8 year difference

[Liamson]

Lots of judgment and stereotyping going on here, about a subject that scripture never addresses or speaks to. Scripture is very clear, we are not to pass judgment on people for matters of conscience where the scriptures are silent. By setting yourself up as judge you're causing your brothers and sisters to stumble because of your personal opinions.

If I know that a brother or sister is sinning, that he is for example lying, or stealing, or lusting, or teaching false doctrine, or some other sin that we know is against the word of God, I would not hesitate to offer him correction from scripture. But when it comes to our opinions, why do we feel the need to exert control over other people's lives and relationships? Maybe next you are going to enforce your opinions about which foods they are allowed to eat, or on which day they have to observe the sabbath.

If we cannot hold each other accountable or to a standard, then I'm going to go find people who believe in the same God I do and are willing to hold me to my Faith. With that said, there is a difference between sinning and doing what is socially unacceptable.

In Georgia it is Legal for 16 year olds to be Wed. Does that mean that I'm going to frown on this and say its reckless and ridiculous, absolutely.

I want to be apart of a Christianity that knows what the Truth is and is not willing to let something else slide unremarked on. It is not 'Judgement' that we should establish what is good and right, it is discernment and accountability.

 

[Rissa77]

So, trust_in_the_name,

Are you suggesting that if a friend is in a relationship that doesn't look like sin but may lead to sin OR may not be God's will, we don't have any place to tell them so? I'm not justifying the judgment that was posted on this thread. I was looking for advice on what to do, and how I could see it differently, not for judgment on the two people. But for you to say I have no place to even address such a situation? That's a sad way to view life. Scripture cannot tell me who I am to date and whenthat is to happen. But would my friends correct me if I decided to date a man, say, 20 years older than me in a time in my life when I am clearly not ready for a relationship, or I have too much on my plate to handle it, or I have not consulted God on the matter? YES!! They would! And I would APPRECIATE my friends caring enough to help me focus on the right path. It's not clearly sin, but it's not God's will. Being disobedient to God's will is sin, no matter what that disobedience is and whether it's defined in Scripture. There are some things that only the Holy Spirit can give direction on. You can't get all your answers in your life from the Bible. God speaks multitudesmore than what's contained in the Bible we have now. Therefore, if the Bible isn't clear on whether a decision or action is sin, but the Holy Spirit gives me a bad vibe about it, then I DO have the right to confront my friend, or pastor is this matter, in LOVE.

And I will do that. Thank you to those who responded without judgment and steered me correctly. I need to get over the hurt before I confront them, but I eventually will.

 

[trust_in_the_name]

obviously shes desperate. There seems to be no spiritual aspect in any of this.

18 year old guys are punks. Christian or not there immature.

Desperate.

Like I said, judgment and stereotyping.

So, trust_in_the_name,

Are you suggesting that if a friend is in a relationship that doesn't look like sin but may lead to sin OR may not be God's will, we don't have any place to tell them so? I'm not justifying the judgment that was posted on this thread. I was looking for advice on what to do, and how I could see it differently, not for judgment on the two people. But for you to say I have no place to even address such a situation? That's a sad way to view life. Scripture cannot tell me who I am to date and whenthat is to happen. But would my friends correct me if I decided to date a man, say, 20 years older than me in a time in my life when I am clearly not ready for a relationship, or I have too much on my plate to handle it, or I have not consulted God on the matter? YES!! They would! And I would APPRECIATE my friends caring enough to help me focus on the right path. It's not clearly sin, but it's not God's will. Being disobedient to God's will is sin, no matter what that disobedience is and whether it's defined in Scripture. There are some things that only the Holy Spirit can give direction on. You can't get all your answers in your life from the Bible. God speaks multitudesmore than what's contained in the Bible we have now. Therefore, if the Bible isn't clear on whether a decision or action is sin, but the Holy Spirit gives me a bad vibe about it, then I DO have the right to confront my friend, or pastor is this matter, in LOVE.

And I will do that. Thank you to those who responded without judgment and steered me correctly. I need to get over the hurt before I confront them, but I eventually will.

Mostly I just wanted to remind people what scripture says about disputable matters (matters of conscience which aren't addressed by scripture), which is that we should not pass judgment as if it was a sin, since that seemed to be what was going on.

 

[Clement]

Do you guys have a head pastor? Like someone above Laura?

You can probably go and speak to that person regarding all of this and ask his/her opinion.

 

[Rissa77]

Hey Clement,

Unfortunately, no. I mean her parents are co-owners of the cafe, and they take care of the financial stuff and legal stuff, but they are never at the cafe. Ugh... I can't figure out a way to say this lightly.. they aren't the kind of people I would go to about this, based on what I know and have experienced with them.

 

[zeroturbulence]

I'm going through a tough time after this.. here's the situation.. (names have been changed for privacy)

I volunteer at a teen outreach center that called the Regenerate Cafe. I've been involved for about 4 years. Only over the past year has the cafe become more of a church. The core group has gotten really close and I love every one of them. For the past 3 years, a woman named Laura has been the leader. She is 26. During the past year and a half, one of the kids, David, has risen to be her right-hand man and leader over the guys. He is 18. Over this period of time, when I do not know, they grew an attraction to each other and started dating. The two, like many people at the Cafe, are touchy people, and so certain things that would be considered flirty to others is not to us. So when they started flirting in public I didn't think anything of it. They apparently did it on purpose so that those who are close to us and who suspected something could ask and know the truth, and the two wouldn't have to declare to the crowds that they were dating.

Being ignorant of all of this, I didn't know they were dating until one night I caught Laura and David kissing. My first thought went to the worst and I stood there dumbfounded, only being able to say why and what. Laura said, "I didn't promise to save my first kiss like you, Rissa." Understanding that I was ignorant, David made a scene of it, asking everyone there (it was after closing, so only close friends remained) what he and Laura were doing, and they all knew the two were dating.

Then I left, speechless. I have not returned. I can't even get myself to talk to them. Eight year difference?! The boy hasn't even finished high school! Maybe it's because I know both of them so well that I can't get myself to accept it. I'm disgusted.

I don't know.. I'm writing because I'm confused. They are my only church family. I have no church to go to besides there, no place I fit, unless I go 3 hours north to Memphis every week. I want to justify the situation, but I just can't...

My opinion: She's immature. He's immature. If she was mature she would not have been ok with leaving you embarrassed in front of everyone. Maybe God is telling you that its time you see the truth about these folks who are supposed to be leading this group and find yourself a good church.

 

[Jullianna]

At some point and in some circumstances (some younger people are more mature than others; some older people are less mature than others their age/my late husband was 10 years older than I am), an 8 year difference may not be a big deal (though some people seem more ready to accept it if the male is the older one). For an 18 year old boy living at home, it's a big deal. (I say this as the parent of an 18 year old christian boy living at home, going to college.) For this relationship to be with someone in a faith-based leadership position is also a big deal. For them to have hidden the relationship from someone they considered to also be a leader of the group is also a big deal. What if one of the other younger people had come to Rissa to discuss the matter?

Whether it's right or wrong, it wasn't handled well. And that's a sign of immaturity. Once you've had an opportunity to calm down, it would truly be a good idea for you to sit down with the 26 year old, Rissa. Even if you don't go back, there's some healing that needs to take place.

 

[grace]

At some point and in some circumstances (some younger people are more mature than others; some older people are less mature than others their age/my late husband was 10 years older than I am), an 8 year difference may not be a big deal (though some people seem more ready to accept it if the male is the older one). For an 18 year old boy living at home, it's a big deal. (I say this as the parent of an 18 year old christian boy living at home, going to college.) For this relationship to be with someone in a faith-based leadership position is also a big deal. For them to have hidden the relationship from someone they considered to also be a leader of the group is also a big deal. What if one of the other younger people had come to Rissa to discuss the matter?

Whether it's right or wrong, it wasn't handled well. And that's a sign of immaturity. Once you've had an opportunity to calm down, it would truly be a good idea for you to sit down with the 26 year old, Rissa. Even if you don't go back, there's some healing that needs to take place.

Could not have put it any better than you have. Perfect Jullianna.

 

[Thanson1975]

I don't have a problem with the age difference I have a problem that she is in more of a leadership role and he was most likely part of that club when he was 17.

 

[_nitro]

18 year old guys are punks. Christian or not there immature.

Really? I do believe thats a little stereotypical. Call me what you will, but when I was 18...I wasn't a punk, nor immature. I think it depends on how the person is brought up. Furthermore, I believe that just because he has 18 stamped on him, doesn't mean he wouldn't make a good husband.




To the rest of the thread, Im 22 going on 23 in July...my girlfriend just turned 18 in March. WhenGod brings someone together, He doesn't look at that. So I think the couple should be supported because God brought them together! Even if it is a learning experience for the both of them, GOD LET IT HAPPEN!

 

[Tumnus]

Guys,

I think we should remember the context in which this situation is happening. "Laura" and "David" both appear to be dedicated servants of the Lord who are committed to the ministry of the teen outreach center. And, if I can be "worldly" for a moment, studies have proven that a woman's sex drive lasts significantly longer than a man's. Therefore, an awkward situation at this age can turn out to be a blessing when the couple reaches middle age, and beyond.

What I see that troubles me about this relationship is the way they have kept it a semi-secret. That would indicate to me that at least one of them agrees that it is not completely right. Also, because "Laura" never promised to hold her first kiss. it seems that David was not given a chance to make this decision for himself. As has been pointed out, a guy of 18 may not be mature enough to resist the allure of an "older woman".

My concern would be how this relationship ultimately affects the ministry, especially if it escalates beyond "kissing". For impressionable teens to find out that this type of "stuff" was going on behind the scenes might be devastating to their budding faith, which might be too fragile to take the hit. So, in my opinion, this situation shows a lack of good judgment if nothing else. If they are going to continue to "date", at least one of them needs to leave the ministry.

Once again, brother dmdave17 brings the wisdom! What also struck me was she is in a position of "leadership". If she is having trouble separating her emotions from her duties, maybe a mature (in the faith) male leader should come in to work with the young men and teens from now on. I am just thinking of the verse (forgive me for forgetting where it is in Scripture) that says "Shun all appearance of evil." Anyone in Christian leadership positions, I would think, wouldn't want to be a stumbling block to young or immature believers.

 

[xJoe]

Really? I do believe thats a little stereotypical. Call me what you will, but when I was 18...I wasn't a punk, nor immature. I think it depends on how the person is brought up. Furthermore, I believe that just because he has 18 stamped on him, doesn't mean he wouldn't make a good husband.




To the rest of the thread, Im 22 going on 23 in July...my girlfriend just turned 18 in March. When God brings someone together, He doesn't look at that. So I think the couple should be supported because God brought them together! Even if it is a learning experience for the both of them, GOD LET IT HAPPEN!

You should watch how you said "God brought them together" the age isn't the difficulty but the principle of where both of them are at in there walks with God and also if he is self sufficient.
God let Bathesheba into Davids life? The phase "Let it happen" is a bad way to make a judgment. Not trying to be offensive.

 

[MO4]

I totally agree with you Trust-in-the name. There is a lot of passing of judgement and stereotyping going on here. Rissa, were you getting spiritual nourishment from Laura before you found out that David and her were seeing each other? Have you privately and lovingly confronted Laura concerning the questions you have in mind? I take it that you have angrily judged and executed a sentence on both David and her without much viable ground. If what you think they are doing is wrong, then come up with viable reasons and talk to the both of them instead of walking out on the church. Laura as your pastor could be doing wrong but it is not in your place to judge and condemn her. Yours is to rectify the wrong been committed and helping her reclaim her steps back into Christs chosen path for us his children.. Be the light here and make a great change here. Dont allow the devil to have the opportunity to do what he does best' kill, steal and destroy.

 

[xJoe]

That is very true. Keeping it in and not saying anything to them is the worse possible way to handle this.

 

[NodMyHeadLikeYeah]

Like I said, judgment and stereotyping.



Mostly I just wanted to remind people what scripture says about disputable matters (matters of conscience which aren't addressed by scripture), which is that we should not pass judgment as if it was a sin, since that seemed to be what was going on.

Personally i like judging people. Sometimes at night when i cant fall asleep, i start thinking of all the people i know and i make judgements and assumptions about them. Sometimes i even falsely accuse them of stealing things.

 

[Stanelake]

Age is just a number!
But once one chooses a role in the body of Christ he/she ought to be exemplary in their conduct. These two ought to look at what brought them to the place where they serve. That mindset of accountability will guide them. As their friend you ought to point out the impression they are making and be careful for yourself that you will not be dragged in the wrong way.
It seems to me u held them in high esteem and probably the rest of the team does too. for that reason they in some ways are "their brother's keeper" and so are you.

 

[snugpug240]

i once had a 38 year old ask me out (im 23)...i brough him to my parents house and we all played a board game...him and my dad were cracking up the entire night, they made references to old tv shows and songs that i knew nothing of...so at the end of the night im like, wow this guy has more in common with my dad than he has with me!! we r still good friends but pursuing a romantic relationship with someone who is 15 years older than i wasnt what God had in mind for me. i can imagine it being very difficult to connect. this is certainly an extreme case but perhaps with the 18yo being sooo young and a boy and the 26yo a female (females usually mature faster than boys), the 8 year difference could b equivalent to a 15 year difference...not sure if ive explained this clearly.

 

[kiwi_OT]

The age difference is only a minor thing here in my opinion. However, I agree that how they have handled the situation is deplorable and shows how selfish they appear.
If they were genuinely attracted to each other and wished to build a relationship biblically, they would have spoken to an elder in the church or something like that, and recieved advice on how to continue. The fact that this woman Laura, actually flirted physically in public, what does this say to the younger people? How does this represent her reputation and her testimony of her relationship with Jesus? As a leader, it is her responsibility to think of how her actions affect the whole body - same with the other guy. Neither should be in a position of leadership anymore.
Age difference in couples is not a numbers games. Its whether or not their lifestyle, attitudes and experiences in life compliment one another. While one person is still at school and possibly still living at home compared to a grown woman beyond typical college age and maybe living independently - their
life stages are completely out of sync.
I suspect they grew attracted to each other as a result of being around each other as equals at this cafe, but the truth is, I bet they havent even considered the long term repercussions of their relationship and what it will do to the cafe ministry.

If I were you I would find a church leader (pastor etc) and VERY carefully share your concerns. Talk more about how this will impact the ministry more than the age difference if I were you or else it will look like you're war mongering.

 

[goodtidings]

Heres my take:

- you have a group of friends that you love
- you found out two of them are dating and are confused about whether or not the age difference is considered morally wrong
- you have not returned since you found out

Now
- The decision for Laura and David to be together is theirs and only theirs. If he is too immature as one may presume then the relationship will fail, but again that is their choice.
- You should not let the choice of these two effect your relationship with the rest of your friends, or even your relationship with them perhaps.

1. you can go back and not think about it
2. you can go back and accept and respect their decision.

or you never go back and and never see your friends again, but I would think that this option is not what you want.

 

[NodMyHeadLikeYeah]

I really like someone who is 36 years younger than me sooooooo i really cant say much on the issue