Has an equal opportunity for salvation been given to all people in all time periods?

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

This is what happens when people get Calvinistic tunnel vision, and do not take into account all of Scripture. So let's see what is revealed in Scripture.

ACTS 17: ALL MEN WERE TO SEEK GOD AND FIND HIM
24 God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;
25 Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;
26 And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;
27 That they should seek the Lord, if haply [THEREFORE] they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:
28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.
29 Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.
30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
31 Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

ROMANS 1: CREATION REVEALS GOD THEREFORE THERE IS NO EXCUSE
18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

ROMANS 10: THE GOSPEL HAS GONE INTO ALL THE WORLD
16 But they have not all obeyed the Gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
18 But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

PSALM 19: THE HEAVENS DECLARE THE GLORY OF GOD
1 The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.
2 Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge.
3 There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard.
4 Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun,
5 Which is as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber, and rejoiceth as a strong man to run a race.
6 His going forth is from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof.

GENESIS 4: MANKIND BEGAN TO CALL UPON THE NAME OF THE LORD VERY EARLY ON
25 And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew.
26 And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the LORD.

GENESIS 6: MANKIND WAS CORRUPTED
5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

2 PETER 2:5/GENESIS 6:3: THE GOSPEL WAS PREACHED TO THE WORLD FOR 120 YEARS
5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;
3 And the LORD said, My Spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

GENESIS 11: THE WHOLE EARTH WANTED TO REACH UP TO HEAVEN (IN FALSE WORSHIP)
1 And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech.
2 And it came to pass, as they journeyed from the east, that they found a plain in the land of Shinar; and they dwelt there.
3 And they said one to another, Go to, let us make brick, and burn them throughly. And they had brick for stone, and slime had they for morter.
4 And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth.
5 And the LORD came down to see the city and the tower, which the children of men builded.
6 And the LORD said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do.
7 Go to, let us go down, and there confound their language, that they may not understand one another's speech.
8 So the LORD scattered them abroad from thence upon the face of all the earth: and they left off to build the city.
9 Therefore is the name of it called Babel; because the LORD did there confound the language of all the earth: and from thence did the LORD scatter them abroad upon the face of all the earth.

All this is natural revelation my friend. They know God exists as Creator but not as Savior. NR does not tell them that the Christ came in the flesh and died and rose again three days later.

Now, show me where the other nations had...

A sacrificial system that atoned for their sins.
Had a high priest that interceded to God on their behalf.
Were entusted with the oracles of God.
Had been given the Law, covenants, promises, &c.
Had a sacrificial lamb that expiated their sins.

All these the nation of Israel had. Now show me where the Egyptians, Philistines, Jebusites, Assyrians, Syrians, Moabites, Amalekites, &c., has these.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

A simple apology would have been sufficient.

Okay. @Laish is sorry you’re easily offended.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

This is what happens when people get Calvinistic tunnel vision, and do not take into account all of Scripture. So let's see what is revealed in Scripture.

ACTS 17: ALL MEN WERE TO SEEK GOD AND FIND HIM
24 God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;
25 Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;
26 And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;
27 That they should seek the Lord, if haply [THEREFORE] they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:
28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.
29 Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.
30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
31 Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

ROMANS 1: CREATION REVEALS GOD THEREFORE THERE IS NO EXCUSE
18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

ROMANS 10: THE GOSPEL HAS GONE INTO ALL THE WORLD
16 But they have not all obeyed the Gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
18 But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

PSALM 19: THE HEAVENS DECLARE THE GLORY OF GOD
1 The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.
2 Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge.
3 There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard.
4 Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun,
5 Which is as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber, and rejoiceth as a strong man to run a race.
6 His going forth is from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof.

GENESIS 4: MANKIND BEGAN TO CALL UPON THE NAME OF THE LORD VERY EARLY ON
25 And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew.
26 And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the LORD.

GENESIS 6: MANKIND WAS CORRUPTED
5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

2 PETER 2:5/GENESIS 6:3: THE GOSPEL WAS PREACHED TO THE WORLD FOR 120 YEARS
5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;
3 And the LORD said, My Spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

GENESIS 11: THE WHOLE EARTH WANTED TO REACH UP TO HEAVEN (IN FALSE WORSHIP)
1 And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech.
2 And it came to pass, as they journeyed from the east, that they found a plain in the land of Shinar; and they dwelt there.
3 And they said one to another, Go to, let us make brick, and burn them throughly. And they had brick for stone, and slime had they for morter.
4 And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth.
5 And the LORD came down to see the city and the tower, which the children of men builded.
6 And the LORD said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do.
7 Go to, let us go down, and there confound their language, that they may not understand one another's speech.
8 So the LORD scattered them abroad from thence upon the face of all the earth: and they left off to build the city.
9 Therefore is the name of it called Babel; because the LORD did there confound the language of all the earth: and from thence did the LORD scatter them abroad upon the face of all the earth.

This post is averring ppl can seek God outside of His word. That’s mysticism my friends.

 

[John146]

This post is averring ppl can seek God outside of His word. That’s mysticism my friends.

People can seek God outside His word, but they can’t know Him outside His word.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

People can seek God outside His word, but they can’t know Him outside His word.

That’s not what the Bible says. They seek a god they know nothing about. The Bible says there are none who seek God, there are none who understands[Romans 3].

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

People can seek God outside His word, but they can’t know Him outside His word.

The Native American Indians for instance spoke of a happy hunting ground. So, they knew there was a hereafter, but couldn’t properly articulate it. Why? They never had His word to truly understand. Ppl in remote places attribute what they see via NR to some sort of idol. That’s what Romans 1:18ff avers my friend. It’s not a treatise in how to be saved via NR, but that man in his ruined state w/o God in their lives is doomed. All NR does is causes a man to be w/o excuse before God.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

People can seek God outside His word, but they can’t know Him outside His word.

But before we jay off the subject of the OP, can you show me where the nations outside of Israel had a high priest that interceded to God on their behalf, that God gave them a sacrificial system to atone for their sins, a scapegoat that expiated their sins, were given the covenants, promises, the giving of the Law, the temple services, were entrusted with the oracles or God, &c.?

Also, did God say this to those other nations, too?

”You only have I chosen among all the families of the earth; Therefore I will punish you for all your iniquities.”[Amos 3:2]

The KJV uses “known” and it means the same thing. But did He say this to the Philistines, Egyptians, Jebusites, Moabites, Amalekites, Assyrians, Syrians, &c.?

 

[John146]

That’s not what the Bible says. They seek a god they know nothing about. The Bible says there are none who seek God, there are none who understands[Romans 3].

People can seek God the Creator, but be ignorant of who He is.

 

[John146]

But before we jay off the subject of the OP, can you show me where the nations outside of Israel had a high priest that interceded to God on their behalf, that God gave them a sacrificial system to atone for their sins, a scapegoat that expiated their sins, were given the covenants, promises, the giving of the Law, the temple services, were entrusted with the oracles or God, &c.?

Also, did God say this to those other nations, too?

”You only have I chosen among all the families of the earth; Therefore I will punish you for all your iniquities.”[Amos 3:2]

The KJV uses “known” and it means the same thing. But did He say this to the Philistines, Egyptians, Jebusites, Moabites, Amalekites, Assyrians, Syrians, &c.?

Nope, there were none. Israel was God’s chosen. I agree.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

People can seek God the Creator, but be ignorant of who He is.

And they will never find Him as they end up in idolatry if they’ve never heard and/or read the word. That’s my point. That’s what Romans 1:18ff avers.

18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, 19 because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. 20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse. 21 For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened. 22 Professing to be wise, they became fools, 23 and exchanged the glory of the incorruptible God for an image in the form of corruptible man and of birds and four-footed animals and crawling creatures.[Romans 1]

God has revealed Himself to them via creation. They are w/o excuse because they know there is a god, but as vs 23 says, they attribute that to some sort of idol.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

Nope, there were none. Israel was God’s chosen. I agree.

So then God justly left those nations w/o a remedy for their sins. And it was not because they were more wicked than Israel. He painstakingly makes that clear...

7 “The LORD did not set His love on you nor choose you because you were more in number than any of the peoples, for you were the fewest of all peoples, 8 but because the LORD loved you and kept the oath which He swore to your forefathers, the LORD brought you out by a mighty hand and redeemed you from the house of slavery, from the hand of Pharaoh king of Egypt.”[Deuteronomy 7]

There was nothing special in Israel that caused God to give them all that He did in Romans 3:1-2 and Romans 9:4-5. Neither was the other nations more evil than Israel that caused Him to justly leave them in their already condemned state.

 

[TooFastTurtle]

This post is averring ppl can seek God outside of His word. That’s mysticism my friends.

Do you think we need a physical book to be saved? Many saved Christians who could never read. We can seek God outside the Bible, always have been able to, you do know that Noah never had a Bible? Neither did Abraham and many others. Neither did Enoch, yet Enoch "walked with God"

There is someone called The Holy Spirit that indwells God's people and leads them.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

Do you think we need a physical book to be saved? Many saved Christians who could never read. We can seek God outside the Bible, always have been able to, you do know that Noah never had a Bible? Neither did Abraham and many others. Neither did Enoch, yet Enoch "walked with God"

There is someone called The Holy Spirit that indwells God's people and leads them.

Hebrews 1 will clear this up for you my friend.

Where does faith come from? The word of God. It does not come from what we see in nature. Faith comes from hearing the word of God, not what we see in nature.

14 How then will they call on Him in whom they have not believed? How will they believe in Him whom they have not heard? And how will they hear without a preacher? 15 How will they preach unless they are sent? Just as it is written, “HOW BEAUTIFUL ARE THE FEET OF THOSE WHO BRING GOOD NEWS OF GOOD THINGS!" 16 However, they did not all heed the good news; for Isaiah says, “LORD, WHO HAS BELIEVED OUR REPORT?" 17 So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ.[Romans 10]

The lost person who has never heard of the Christ will never come to faith in Him by looking at what he sees through nature. Nature does not tell Him that God came as a man, lived ~ 33.5 years on earth, lived the perfect life, died upon a cross, rose from the dead three days later. And that is what saves ppl, the preaching, witnessing of the gospel, as that is where faith comes from. So, natural revelation does not bring someone to saving faith in Him.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

Do you think we need a physical book to be saved? Many saved Christians who could never read. We can seek God outside the Bible, always have been able to, you do know that Noah never had a Bible? Neither did Abraham and many others. Neither did Enoch, yet Enoch "walked with God"

There is someone called The Holy Spirit that indwells God's people and leads them.

They may not need a physical book to save them, but they do need someone to witness to them about what it says the Christ did.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

Do you think we need a physical book to be saved? Many saved Christians who could never read. We can seek God outside the Bible, always have been able to, you do know that Noah never had a Bible? Neither did Abraham and many others. Neither did Enoch, yet Enoch "walked with God"

There is someone called The Holy Spirit that indwells God's people and leads them.

1 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.[Hebrews 1]

Noah, Abraham, Enoch, Isaac, Jacob, et al did not have a bible and that is true. But they had God conversing with them. Yes, the bible wasn't written until centuries after they had died. I agree with that, and neither will any Calvinist/Reformed person. However, God does not speak to us that way now, by audible voice. He speaks to us via His word now. What God told them, they told the ppl and they had a audible bible of sorts, if you will. What God told them, they told the ppl. Now we have the full canon of scripture and we don't have God talking to us audibly now, but through His word, the bible.

For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not come to know God, God was well-pleased through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.[1 Cor. 1:21]

How does God save ppl according to this verse? Through preaching, not through mystical means. God does not speak to us audibly today. I know there are some who claim some sort of apostolic authority and God speaks to them, but I call that utter foolishness. If ppl want God to speak to them, they need to pick their bibles up and read. That is God speaking to us through the pages of scriptures He has given us to learn more of Him.

13 In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation--having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who is given as a pledge of our inheritance, with a view to the redemption of God’s own possession, to the praise of His glory.[Ephesians 1]

Again, another time where the word of God is necessary to bring one to saving faith. There is no other way to come to saving faith than through His word my Friend.

26 For consider your calling, brethren, that there were not many wise according to the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble; 27 but God has chosen the foolish things of the world to shame the wise, and God has chosen the weak things of the world to shame the things which are strong, 28 and the base things of the world and the despised God has chosen, the things that are not, so that He may nullify the things that are, 29 so that no man may boast before God. 30 But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption, 31 so that, just as it is written, “LET HIM WHO BOASTS, BOAST IN THE LORD.”[1 Corinthians]

28 And we know that God causes all things to work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose. 29 For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren; 30 and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He also justified; and these whom He justified, He also glorified.[Romans 8]

5 Now for this very reason also, applying all diligence, in your faith supply moral excellence, and in your moral excellence, knowledge, 6 and in your knowledge, self-control, and in your self-control, perseverance, and in your perseverance, godliness, 7 and in your godliness, brotherly kindness, and in your brotherly kindness, love. 8 For if these qualities are yours and are increasing, they render you neither useless nor unfruitful in the true knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 For he who lacks these qualities is blind or short-sighted, having forgotten his purification from his former sins. 10 Therefore, brethren, be all the more diligent to make certain about His calling and choosing you; for as long as you practice these things, you will never stumble; 11 for in this way the entrance into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ will be abundantly supplied to you.[2 Peter 1]

Now, I brought these passages up because they all deal with God calling ppl. How are ppl called? Via the word of the God, the bible. There is no other way that He calls us than via His word.

 

[CGYager]

I'll go ahead and toss in my reply as well. Firstly, the Bible tells us that we need to refrain from spending our time on useless debates. God is in control. Always has been and always will be. Secondly, the Bible tells us very plainly that God gets no pleasure in the destruction of the wicked, but would rather that all men come to repentance. So, how could all come to that place, if there was no way to get there prior to the arrival of Jesus? The Bible is vast and covers a lot, but it does not include every thought or action of God, nor for that matter do the gospels cover every moment of Jesus time on earth. Is there a true Christian who actually believes that only those things written down occurred? Obviously not. I totally believe that anyone who truly searches for God in any era of time has found Him or to be more accurate, God has come to them.
God is perfection. We know the term, but can't really grasp what that means, since none of us has ever or will ever attain it. Things like this is what has caused so many denominations to exist and splits within the individual churches to happen. One day many of these questions will be answered (if really necessary). In the meantime let's allow God to be God and find something with a bit more substance to occupy our everyday lives and our growth as Christians. And no, I will not continually reply to a subject that in anyway suggests that man can know the mind of our one true God.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

I'll go ahead and toss in my reply as well. Firstly, the Bible tells us that we need to refrain from spending our time on useless debates. God is in control. Always has been and always will be. Secondly, the Bible tells us very plainly that God gets no pleasure in the destruction of the wicked, but would rather that all men come to repentance. So, how could all come to that place, if there was no way to get there prior to the arrival of Jesus? The Bible is vast and covers a lot, but it does not include every thought or action of God, nor for that matter do the gospels cover every moment of Jesus time on earth. Is there a true Christian who actually believes that only those things written down occurred? Obviously not. I totally believe that anyone who truly searches for God in any era of time has found Him or to be more accurate, God has come to them.
God is perfection. We know the term, but can't really grasp what that means, since none of us has ever or will ever attain it. Things like this is what has caused so many denominations to exist and splits within the individual churches to happen. One day many of these questions will be answered (if really necessary). In the meantime let's allow God to be God and find something with a bit more substance to occupy our everyday lives and our growth as Christians. And no, I will not continually reply to a subject that in anyway suggests that man can know the mind of our one true God.

Iron sharpens iron, and these debates do help us better understand the bible. Thank you for your reply to the thread my friend.

Again, look at that previous post of mine. Where does faith come from? Hearing the word of God(I would also say reading it can bring someone to faith as well). God has given us His word to better understand Him. Yes, it will never tell us all about Him as there is no library large enough to contain all the books. But the bible is what He has given us to better understand what He has revealed about Himself to us. Without the bible, we'd know nothing about Him.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

All this is natural revelation my friend. They know God exists as Creator but not as Savior. NR does not tell them that the Christ came in the flesh and died and rose again three days later.

Now, show me where the other nations had...

A sacrificial system that atoned for their sins.
Had a high priest that interceded to God on their behalf.
Were entusted with the oracles of God.
Had been given the Law, covenants, promises, &c.
Had a sacrificial lamb that expiated their sins.

All these the nation of Israel had. Now show me where the Egyptians, Philistines, Jebusites, Assyrians, Syrians, Moabites, Amalekites, &c., has these.

@Angela53510 you missed giving this post ^^^^ post # 41 a like. And this one, too. If you're going to like them all, then like them all.

 

[NayborBear]

What about Old Testament saints?

My position is that 1) many knew a future redeemer was coming and 2) those that didn't knew God would make a provision for them in some manner.

I voted yes.
As per yer answer "2." Even those who never called God, the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob, "God", or "Lord", realized, even in some "very small" way, something "more" then what "this life" had to offer. (a provision)
Even the "pagans", made a statue or monument of some sorts in their at least "recognizing" the "Unknown God."
(provision made)

We can go all the way back to where Abram, gave a "tenth" of all he had to some guy named "Melchizedek."
And this was way after the "flood of Noah." That God "makes provisions", throughout the course of the "history of flesh man", in His continual "providing" "a way." Even when the "pedigree" of "Ha-Adam", had been intermixed with nephielium (fallen ones), to the point of, That the "genealogy of Jesus" would have been "lost", if God had not made provision with Mary.

 

[UnitedWithChrist]

I voted yes.
As per yer answer "2." Even those who never called God, the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob, "God", or "Lord", realized, even in some "very small" way, something "more" then what "this life" had to offer. (a provision)
Even the "pagans", made a statue or monument of some sorts in their at least "recognizing" the "Unknown God."
(provision made)

We can go all the way back to where Abram, gave a "tenth" of all he had to some guy named "Melchizedek."
And this was way after the "flood of Noah." That God "makes provisions", throughout the course of the "history of flesh man", in His continual "providing" "a way." Even when the "pedigree" of "Ha-Adam", had been intermixed with nephielium (fallen ones), to the point of, That the "genealogy of Jesus" would have been "lost", if God had not made provision with Mary.

I would have a hard time believing that all have had an equal opportunity for salvation.

One, I am convicted that election to salvation is taught in Scripture.

Two, I referenced Scriptures saying that God opened up salvation to the Gentiles at the time of Paul.

Three, Ephesians refers to the Gentiles as without hope prior to Christ.

Four, all but eight drown in the Flood so apparently they didn't belong to God. I have indicated in the past that eight is the number of new beginnings, so I don't think the number is incidental.

For instance, Hebrew children were circumcised at eight days old, and Jesus was resurrected on the eighth day as a new creation, as his resurrection body was the firstfruit of a great harvest.