Not By Works

[Hevosmies]

All of these are applicable to those who REMAIN in the faith.

Here I respond to the section in Red.

Jude
12 These are [g]spots in your love feasts, while they feast with you without fear, serving only themselves. They are clouds without water, carried [h]about by the winds; late autumn trees without fruit, twice dead, pulled up by the roots;

Bwahahaha! Now yall getting DESPERATE. You try to apply this twice dead to those who are BORN AGAIN right? I just showed you a verse that says once born again you cant die again or be unborn, you are born again of INCORRUPTIBLE seed, to eternal life.

This TWICE DEAD is talking about IN CONTEXT of FALSE PROPHETS among the brethren:

Jud 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

WHOOPS!

Twice dead meaning SECOND DEATH is coming for them boys, LAKE OF FIRE.

 

[Hevosmies]

Btw, my six month pet scan came back all clear! Great Christmas present! Thank you for your prayers and thoughts.

Praise God bro! That means God still got some WORK for you to do for Him here on earth! I believe that we are here for as LONG AS God needs us here!

 

[John146]

Thats your problem right there: "Because i have described above that he did." you just described an UNREALISTIC scenario and expect me to take it and roll with it. Unlucky for you I called you out on it!

If a satanist calls on teh name of the Lord walks with the Lord for a time and then his mates convince him back to satanism and he renounces the Lord, I say THAT MANS A TARE among the wheat if he dies in that state. He went out from among us because he was never of us.

SEE AGAIN, we operate on DIFFERENT atmospheres completely, I believe that God will MAKE SURE that His sheep WONT become satanists after conversion, you seem to be leaving GOD out the equation completely, at best God is just trying to convince folks to believe in Him and stay with Him, but He struggles to get anything done. DOESNT SOUND LIKE THE BIBLICAL VERSION TO ME!

Possibly, but I also don’t want to limit the Love of Romans 8. Nothing can separate us. Nothing!

 

[Chris1975]

Thats your problem right there: "Because i have described above that he did." you just described an UNREALISTIC scenario and expect me to take it and roll with it. Unlucky for you I called you out on it!

If a satanist calls on teh name of the Lord walks with the Lord for a time and then his mates convince him back to satanism and he renounces the Lord, I say THAT MANS A TARE among the wheat if he dies in that state. He went out from among us because he was never of us.

SEE AGAIN, we operate on DIFFERENT atmospheres completely, I believe that God will MAKE SURE that His sheep WONT become satanists after conversion, you seem to be leaving GOD out the equation completely, at best God is just trying to convince folks to believe in Him and stay with Him, but He struggles to get anything done. DOESNT SOUND LIKE THE BIBLICAL VERSION TO ME!

Romans 6 talks very clearly about the two options that exist - living according to the flesh or the Spirit. These are valid choices every believer has to make. God doesnt make this choice for you. He leads, but you respond. If you reject his leading, then the end is death.

 

[John146]

Praise God bro! That means God still got some WORK for you to do for Him here on earth! I believe that we are here for as LONG AS God needs us here!

Maybe I haven’t done enough to keep my salvation and the Lord is giving me more time.😀

 

[NayborBear]

Totally confused... but we will leave it there.

I completely understands!
Because, I can attest? It can get really deep, really fast, and seemingly overwhelming, in stony ground.

 

[Chris1975]

Bwahahaha! Now yall getting DESPERATE. You try to apply this twice dead to those who are BORN AGAIN right? I just showed you a verse that says once born again you cant die again or be unborn, you are born again of INCORRUPTIBLE seed, to eternal life.

This TWICE DEAD is talking about IN CONTEXT of FALSE PROPHETS among the brethren:

Jud 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

WHOOPS!

Twice dead meaning SECOND DEATH is coming for them boys, LAKE OF FIRE.

They are already twice dead. The Spirit is incorruptible seed. The Soul is not. Your soul is the one that is at stake.

 

[TooFastTurtle]

Have you agreed with Jesus that you cannot earn your salvation and accepted His free gift of salvation?

Yes. Yes a thousand times Yes. Cannot earn or maintain something that is a free gift. I just want to be saved and I am now afraid to take credit for obedience or anything.

I had a terrible vision about it

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I do want to strive to enter and try to contend for righteous life, but I do not want to take any credit for that or salvation in general, and MailmanDan and VCO answered well to my questions and found a good way to reconcile the Scriptures I asked about.

I see no problem with the POTS or OSAS as they presented it, and I think it is true and as annoying as it is I hate admitting to being wrong but in the end it looks like I was actually believing that no one has passed from death to life until we die and go to heaven, and this life was more of a probation period rather than a free gift of eternal life.

I have believed in Jesus always, but I do not know if I should do something other than tell Jesus I am sorry and I want to cling to Him alone for my eternal life, as a free gift, rather than a future hope after probation. What do you guys think? @mailmandan @you

Lets see if this helps.

the law states you must obey every word. Failure to live in complete obedience brought about a curse


Deuteronomy 27:26
‘Cursed is the one who does not confirm all the words of this law by observing them.’ “And all the people shall say, ‘Amen!’ ”

Galatians 3:10
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed iseveryone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.”

James 2:10
For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all.

For this reason, as scripture says

rom 3 - for ALL have sinned and fall short (God’s standard is the requirement, one sin and you fall short of this standard)

Rom3 - there are no righteous no not one

Rom 6 - the penalty of sin is death. Every sin we commit has attached to it a decree of guilt. The judgment of guilty requires death.


remembering as paul said, the law is a tutor to lead us to christ. We see according to the law. Not one person living stands up against it, Every man woman and child who ever lived as paul said in Colossians has obtained a certificate of death against them, and God will require them to pay that judgment. No other act of penance or works or attempting to pay of this sin debt you owe God will be accepted. You are Charged, Found guilty and one day the judge will come calling to pronounce this judgment on you and collect on what you owe, this is called the second death, for this reason...

1. No one can “earn” salvation by their own deeds, you can never be goo enough, you can never do enough works, you can never do anything to earn your right to heaven, You are judged guilty where you stand

2. No one can “maintain” Their salvation once it is given because any “sin” which is commited father one is saved would occure the sam judgment as sin before a person was saved, hence they would still be in the same boat apart from being “rescued” from the penalty of sin.

3. “prevent themselves from losing” salvation by being obedient. SInce the “standard” God requires is perfection. And since NO ONE has reacted that state in this lifetime, we can never be good enough to earn salvation, let alone good enough to keep from losing salvation. If salvation was dependent on how good we are. We would all fail. and would end up on the wrong side on judgment day

The law also shows us what God will accept as payment for sin. Death of an innocent, unblemished animal, who is tasked to shed his blood for atonement of the people. As the author of hebrews says, without the shedding of blood, there can be no forgiveness

Of course, the same author says the blood of bulls and goats can never take away sin. So if this is true, what hope do we have? We can not save ourselves. Animal sacrifice can not save us, were do we go?

thats the point of the law. It showed us how desperate our situation is, I caused us to repent, and look to the only thing which could save us

”the lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world”

There is your only hope.

God comes, and he offers each os us this gift. Now we have to chose

1. continue to try to save ourselves. Maintain our salvation of or try to be old enough not to lose it (how good is good enough?)

2. Become like the tax collector. Or as Jesus said in his sermon on the mount, Blessed are the poor in spirit for theirs is the kingdom. The greek word for poor literally means to become bankrupt. Now think about this, what has to happen for a person to come to the point they have to file bankruptcy? They have to be completely broke right? To see no hope. To see no way out of their present situation and continuing on the way they are will just make things worse. Not better. This is what God says needs to happen to us before we can enter the kingdom of God. If we think there is ANYTHING we can do to help. Or think we can believe in Jesus, but add all these works to maintain or keep salvation. Have we really become bankrupt? Have we really got on our knees and said God I am hopeless. I need your gift, because without it I am lost?

That was Paul's point in Galatians. If we think we can be saved by the spirit but have to perfect our salvation int the flesh, we are foolish. Because

1. We have not become bankrupt. So we have not had true living faith
2. We have failed to repent, we still are holding on to our own pride and human nature of trying to do it ourselves
3. We have spit on the cross. And in turn Jesus. And trampled him and his grace underfoot.

Thats why Pauls warning was so dire. He feared for their very salvation. And thats why he sai, if your going to add even ONE command, yoru indebted to follow every part. Because you have taken yourself out of Grace, due to your unbelief, and placed yourself under law. Which takes us back to my very first point. If you obey every command, yet stumble in even the smallest point, Your guilty of all. What is your just reward? Death.

I hope this helps some, I know you understand what the law i thats why I used it in my words. To try to show you what I see.

Praying for you brother!!

 

[Chris1975]

Bwahahaha! Now yall getting DESPERATE. You try to apply this twice dead to those who are BORN AGAIN right? I just showed you a verse that says once born again you cant die again or be unborn, you are born again of INCORRUPTIBLE seed, to eternal life.

This TWICE DEAD is talking about IN CONTEXT of FALSE PROPHETS among the brethren:

Jud 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

WHOOPS!

Twice dead meaning SECOND DEATH is coming for them boys, LAKE OF FIRE.

And these false prophets, if or when they lead away the brethren from the faith, then the brethren, too, run the risk of becoming TWICE DEAD (falling away from the faith). Why does Jude warn the brethren so earnestly, if the brethren are at no risk due to OSAS? Given that any thought?

 

[John146]

Romans 6 talks very clearly about the two options that exist - living according to the flesh or the Spirit. These are valid choices every believer has to make. God doesnt make this choice for you. He leads, but you respond. If you reject his leading, then the end is death.

The Corinthians who were saved, washed, sanctified and justified were living carnally, after the flesh, yet they were still part of the body of Christ.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Or...Jesus says "depart from me, I never knew you"

Jesus spoke this to the religious self righteous people who think they are saved by their works (But have we not done all these mighty works in your name) and jesus declairs to them, I NEVER KNEW YOU!

If jesus NEVER KNEW YOU, you were NEVER HIS CHILD

straight up, thE verse you used SUPPORTS osas. And DESTROYS noses!

 

[Chris1975]

The Corinthians who were saved, washed, sanctified and justified were living carnally, after the flesh, yet they were still part of the body of Christ.

True. But this living leads one to apostasy if left unchecked and unrepented. God will not be mocked.

 

[Chris1975]

Jesus spoke this to the religious self righteous people who think they are saved by their works (But have we not done all these mighty works in your name) and jesus declairs to them, I NEVER KNEW YOU!

If jesus NEVER KNEW YOU, you were NEVER HIS CHILD

straight up, thE verse you used SUPPORTS osas. And DESTROYS noses!

So many noses destroyed

 

[Hevosmies]

Romans 6 talks very clearly about the two options that exist - living according to the flesh or the Spirit. These are valid choices every believer has to make. God doesnt make this choice for you. He leads, but you respond. If you reject his leading, then the end is death.

Again we come from DIFFERENT WORLDS as per usual. I DO NOT BELIEVE in libertarian free will, no matter HOW MUCH it might anger some of the folks on here. But I know they LOVE ME despite that.

Romans 6, lets look at it:

Rom 6:17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
Rom 6:18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

A man who is IN THE FLESH, cannot do ANYTHING pleasing to God, and being a servant of righteousness is pleasing to God. Thats why you need to be born again, regenerated FIRST, BELIEVE THE GOSPEL and then you can bring forth fruit as a SAVED, BORN AGAIN, SEALED UNTO THE DAY OF REDEMPTION believer. WHY are you unable or unwilling to get this? My ministry is to current and ex-convitcs and THEY UNDERSTAND IT no problem with NO TYPE OF EDUCATION whatsoever, in fact, we are running the program of WORK, WORSHIP, WORKOUT the triple W as I call it, for WINNING, EACH DAY. Success rate has been a 100% so far, what these churches often do wrong is, they visit the inmates or ex-inmates ONCE A WEEK, thats not enough to keep these guys motivated and give them that brotherly love that they so desire, and STRUCTURE to keep them on the straight and narrow, BUT THATS NEITHER HERE NOR THERE, and is off topic, but my point is: WHY wont you get this simple stuff?

Here is one LAST JAB from Romans 6, IRONICALLY defeating your entire long argument in the end with one verse, GOTTA LOVE IT how God does it:

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

ITS A GIFT, WHOOPS

 

[eternally-gratefull]

IN OTHER WORDS, You are saying Jesus LOST one of the SHEEP? The Jesus of the Bible says: I will lose NONE of those who the Father gives me.

The good shepherd will not lose a SINGLE SHEEP!

What kind of a LOSER God do you serve?

Amen

I want to know where we can God that the good shepherd can not find us.

And if we are his sheep. Why did we not follow him, when he himself said his sheep know his voice and follow.

I wonder if people understand the picture jesus drew of what God thinks of us by calling us sheep? I think that is lost on many people.

 

[Chris1975]

Jesus spoke this to the religious self righteous people who think they are saved by their works (But have we not done all these mighty works in your name) and jesus declairs to them, I NEVER KNEW YOU!

If jesus NEVER KNEW YOU, you were NEVER HIS CHILD

straight up, thE verse you used SUPPORTS osas. And DESTROYS noses!

No - its due to those who work iniquity. To those he says depart from Me, I never knew you.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Keep yourself in God's love by holding fast to what you heard at first, for that is the condition for retaining the promise of what is to come.

Good luck in thinking God will forgive one sin you commit because of your obedience.

 

[John146]

True. But this living leads one to apostasy if left unchecked and unrepented. God will not be mocked.

I will get to heaven based upon the righteousness and merits of Jesus Christ, not by my own merits.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Now the OSASSERS are disagreeing with one another.

Lol.. Yep. Just like many workers for disagree with catholics and others. They can not even figure out which works are required to maintain their salvation.

You know someone is in danger when they look for every tiny little thing to try to attack their app one ths, and will not look at the word which they disagree on.