Not By Works

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dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#120,561
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
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#120,561
Melach said:
Jesus lived under the law but why does Jesus still before resurrection change the law? He was supposed to fulfill it

like this:
"Again, you have heard that it was said to the people long ago, 'Do not break your oath, but fulfill to the Lord the vows you have made.'

thats what the torah states in deuteronomy leviticus and many places. sometimes God even says make an oath in LORD's name only in Deuteronomy 6:13. so why does Jesus change it to:

"But I tell you, do not swear an oath at all: either by heaven, for it is God's throne;"....

why does it change before resurrection of Jesus where new covenant comes? its almost like rebuking God. of course Jesus has power to change the law i got no problem with it, its just timing that concern me because it says new covenant begins when Jesus resurrects, but here this is said when Jesus is still not died and resurrected yet.
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A will is written before death and then ratified at the time of death.............same is true of the New Covenant.......MANY fail to grasp the words of JESUS under this banner...He was born, lived and died under the LAW which ratified the NEW Covenant....and to add insult to injury, the workers for, Cainologists, Pharisees and salvation losers conflate salvation and justification with ongoing sanctification and in so doing peddle a dogma straight from hell.....!
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#120,562
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
#120,562
Melach said:
so you say law is done the moment Jesus starts preaching? but wait you are PS you dont even believe in the god of the OT? whats going on im confused now.

can you please send me a private message telling me exactly what do you believe.

do you believe the God who gave us the books of genesis-deuteronomy is the Father of Jesus? yes or no?
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Keep it in the open bro.....he is a deceiver and will twist crap so far out of whack to lead you astray....
 
D

Discern

Banned
#120,564
Dec 6, 2019
1,206
691
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#120,564
Judges1318 said:
Faith without works is not the faith that justifies apart from works.
Even Luther said this.
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When you trusted Jesus unto justification, how many works did you have to do before God justified you?

I did none but believe (which I do not call a work), but works followed justification out of gratitude
 
Melach

Melach

Well-known member
#120,567
Mar 28, 2019
2,026
1,512
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#120,567
Discern said:
Benedicamus, what you are red exxing is in agreement with Romans 4. So you disagree with Paul.
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welcome to roman catholicism. this is why you should never debate roman catholic unless you put one premise: bible trumps what church(es) say. they belief only they can interpret bible and its owned by the church so what they say trumps bible. if thats the case all discussion is waste of time
 
Melach

Melach

Well-known member
#120,568
Mar 28, 2019
2,026
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#120,568
dcontroversal said:
With the Iranian deal.....maybe a MID AMERICA tour might be in order Hahah
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what iran deal? are you talking about how they swear revenge over what usa did in iraq to one of their bozos?

they will do nothing. as conor mcgregor says: "'youll do nootin'"
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#120,569
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
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#120,569
GracethroughfaithinChrist said:
There is no discussion to be had with you.

You are here for the sake of debate, not discussion.

Someone should have set you straight a long time ago.

We aren't your babysitters dude!
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We did set him straight when he was here under the banner of Ralph....and even now under his new name....he is a deceiver and his dogma is as dangerous as it can be.........
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#120,570
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,395
113
#120,570
Melach said:
what iran deal? are you talking about how they swear revenge over what usa did in iraq to one of their bozos?

they will do nothing. as conor mcgregor says: "'youll do nootin'"
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Ummmmm Persia is a main player in the end, and in the coalition with Turkey and Russia that DESTROY the HINDERMOST of the NATIONS the LADY of the KINGDOMS.......
 
D

Discern

Banned
#120,574
Dec 6, 2019
1,206
691
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#120,574
Judges1318 said:
In terms of Paul's justification 'apart from works' (Romans 4:6), none.
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Excellent answer.

Having begun in the Spirit, we are perfected in the Spirit. We are kept the same way way we were saved in the first place. By the power of God through faith
 
J

Judges1318

Banned
#120,576
Nov 16, 2019
3,441
860
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#120,576
Discern said:
Having begun in the Spirit, we are perfected in the Spirit. We are kept the same way way we were saved in the first place. Kept by the power of God through faith
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Key: "through faith"
You have to keep believing to be protected by the power of God.
The newest version of once saved always saved says you don't have to continue in the 'faith' part to be kept by the power of God.
Maybe you don't realize it, but this new form of osas does not agree with you that believers will without doubt continue to believe.
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#120,577
#120,577
Discern said:
Excellent answer.

Having begun in the Spirit, we are perfected in the Spirit. We are kept the same way way we were saved in the first place. By the power of God through faith
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I am sorry Discern but he is not really agreeing with you.
 
Chris1975

Chris1975

Senior Member
#120,578
Apr 27, 2017
2,492
517
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#120,578
Judges1318 said:
Key: "through faith"
You have to keep believing to be protected by the power of God.
The newest version of once saved always saved says you don't have to continue in the 'faith' part to be kept by the power of God.
Maybe you don't realize it, but this new form of osas does not agree with you that believers will without doubt continue to believe.
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I believe Discern said that continual belief is necessary. So on that front we have unity.
 
Chris1975

Chris1975

Senior Member
#120,579
Apr 27, 2017
2,492
517
113
#120,579
Judges1318 said:
Key: "through faith"
You have to keep believing to be protected by the power of God.
The newest version of once saved always saved says you don't have to continue in the 'faith' part to be kept by the power of God.
Maybe you don't realize it, but this new form of osas does not agree with you that believers will without doubt continue to believe.
Click to expand...
EleventhHour doesnt believe that continual faith is necessary. So a major disconnect there.
 
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