A Distinction Between Tongues

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Locoponydirtman

Guest
#261
#261
What if find a bit... let's just say questionable; is that when ever you see baptism in the Holy Spirit in Acts they not only say spoke in tongues but also they prophesied, but modern charismatic folks focus on tongues rather than prophecy. They spoke in tongues and prophesied not just spoke in tongues. Today in modern charismatic groups they don't really focus at all on prophecy at the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Is it because of they prophesied a wrong prophecy then it would be proof positive that they were not as they say "baptised" in the Holy Spirit, but no one can know if speaking in tongues is genuine? That can be disputed till the Son returns.
 
CS1

CS1

Well-known member
#262
May 23, 2012
13,058
4,341
113
#262
Locoponydirtman said:
What if find a bit... let's just say questionable; is that when ever you see baptism in the Holy Spirit in Acts they not only say spoke in tongues but also they prophesied, but modern charismatic folks focus on tongues rather than prophecy. They spoke in tongues and prophesied not just spoke in tongues. Today in modern charismatic groups they don't really focus at all on prophecy at the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Is it because of they prophesied a wrong prophecy then it would be proof positive that they were not as they say "baptised" in the Holy Spirit, but no one can know if speaking in tongues is genuine? That can be disputed till the Son returns.
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that is a good point may I suggest many do not know what Prophesying is ?
 
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Locoponydirtman

Guest
#263
#263
CS1 said:
No I am not :) I am waiting for the Biblical refutal to my understanding of the scriptures AS I have said which I too have seen anyone say I could be wrong, :) Please help to see Biblically where that is so :) also I asked IF you are suggesting the video is about my faith and understanding that would be a bias :)
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You don't know what bias means then.
The video has biblical references.
 
CS1

CS1

Well-known member
#264
May 23, 2012
13,058
4,341
113
#264
Locoponydirtman said:
You don't know what bias means then.
The video has biblical references.
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yes it does but the person who posted it is not keeping in context. They produce the flow chart and stated this is the working of the Holy Spirit and nothing more in context to the gifts are done today they have stopped with the last Apostle. That is not true.
 
CS1

CS1

Well-known member
#265
May 23, 2012
13,058
4,341
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#265
Locoponydirtman said:
You don't know what bias means then.
The video has biblical references.
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I am speaking of the flow chart the video I saw had to do with the benefits of speaking in tongues for stress relief. I do not teach that nor is that the reason for the Holy Spirit gifts to relieve our stress, how ever, Can the Holy Spirit relieve our stress yes HE can. I prefer to have the Joy of the Lord and the peace of God that should take care of ones stress :)
 
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Locoponydirtman

Guest
#266
#266
CS1 said:
that is a good point may I suggest many do not know what Prophesying is ?
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No doubt about that, but the Holy Spirit does, and if he were the one at work they too would prophecy.
 
G

garee

Banned
#267
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
113
#267
Dave-L said:
All believers in the New Covenant era have the gift of the Holy Spirit. But only few had the Baptism. It came through the two outpourings and then through a apostle's hands. It was a sign of Apostleship according to Hebrews 2:4.
“God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?” Hebrews 2:4 (KJV 1900)
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God through His word bearing them a infallible witness .Not them bearing the witness of men

The word apostle is designed for a certain doctrine like the word tribe. It has had many new meaning added to it which could effect the intention of the author

.Apostle . . .sent one . . . . . .with no other meaning added. .

The sign of a apostle is; they were sent out by God's hand with the prophecy of the mouth of God, as prophets declaring the word of God .

The gift of apostleship will remain as long as the gospel as prophecy is sent out . Where two or three are gathered together under prophecy as it is written Emanuel is there working with us.

When un converted men who do not mix faith (the unseen eternal in what they see or hear ) and they attribute the unseen work or power of the gospel as the hand of gods (many) it would be foolish to that kind of worldly wisdom not to make the apostles into a legion of gods in the likeness of men. God is not served by human hands in any way shape or form.

Do we really want to make the apostles into gods in the likeness of men?

We should be careful when entertaining strangers as messengers sent by the Holy Spirit . They might have a word from him or we could share one with them.

Gospel life producing

And there they preached the gospel And there sat a certain man at Lystra, impotent in his feet, being a cripple from his mother's womb, who never had walked: The same heard Paul speak: who stedfastly beholding him, and perceiving that he had faith to be healed, Said with a loud voice, Stand upright on thy feet. And he leaped and walked. And when the people saw what Paul had done, they lifted up their voices, saying in the speech of Lycaonia, The gods are come down to us in the likeness of men. And they called Barnabas, Jupiter; and Paul, Mercurius, because he was the chief speaker. Then the priest of Jupiter, which was before their city, brought oxen and garlands unto the gates, and would have done sacrifice with the people. Which when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul, heard of, they rent their clothes, and ran in among the people, crying out,
 
CS1

CS1

Well-known member
#268
May 23, 2012
13,058
4,341
113
#268
Locoponydirtman said:
No doubt about that, but the Holy Spirit does, and if he were the one at work they too would prophecy.
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Prophesying = speaking under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit found in 1cor 13 & 14. it is not Fortelling as in one who is a a Prophet.
Preaching is Proclaiming the word of God what is already written as Jesus said the Holy Spirit will bring into your remembrance all that I ( Jesus ) have said. preaching under the anointing of the Holy Spirit is prophesying = speaking the word of God for a specific reason at the time it was preached, proclaimed, prophesied. Tongues with interpretation = prophesying
 
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Locoponydirtman

Guest
#271
#271
CS1 said:
Prophesying = speaking under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit found in 1cor 13 & 14. it is not Fortelling as in one who is a a Prophet.
Preaching is Proclaiming the word of God what is already written as Jesus said the Holy Spirit will bring into your remembrance all that I ( Jesus ) have said. preaching under the anointing of the Holy Spirit is prophesying = speaking the word of God for a specific reason at the time it was preached, proclaimed, prophesied. Tongues with interpretation = prophesying
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And it still leaves the question. Why the focus on speaking in tongues and none on prophecy?
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#272
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#272
garee said:
God through His word bearing them a infallible witness .Not them bearing the witness of men

The word apostle is designed for a certain doctrine like the word tribe. It has had many new meaning added to it which could effect the intention of the author

.Apostle . . .sent one . . . . . .with no other meaning added. .

The sign of a apostle is; they were sent out by God's hand with the prophecy of the mouth of God, as prophets declaring the word of God .

The gift of apostleship will remain as long as the gospel as prophecy is sent out . Where two or three are gathered together under prophecy as it is written Emanuel is there working with us.

When un converted men who do not mix faith (the unseen eternal in what they see or hear ) and they attribute the unseen work or power of the gospel as the hand of gods (many) it would be foolish to that kind of worldly wisdom not to make the apostles into a legion of gods in the likeness of men. God is not served by human hands in any way shape or form.

Do we really want to make the apostles into gods in the likeness of men?

We should be careful when entertaining strangers as messengers sent by the Holy Spirit . They might have a word from him or we could share one with them.

Gospel life producing

And there they preached the gospel And there sat a certain man at Lystra, impotent in his feet, being a cripple from his mother's womb, who never had walked: The same heard Paul speak: who stedfastly beholding him, and perceiving that he had faith to be healed, Said with a loud voice, Stand upright on thy feet. And he leaped and walked. And when the people saw what Paul had done, they lifted up their voices, saying in the speech of Lycaonia, The gods are come down to us in the likeness of men. And they called Barnabas, Jupiter; and Paul, Mercurius, because he was the chief speaker. Then the priest of Jupiter, which was before their city, brought oxen and garlands unto the gates, and would have done sacrifice with the people. Which when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul, heard of, they rent their clothes, and ran in among the people, crying out,
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No evidence exists that the gifts came in any other way then through an Apostle's hands or through the two outpourings.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#274
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#274
CS1 said:
no it does not the word of God does LOL and FYI its not just Acts
it is the Old and New Testament , it is the words of Jesus our Lord, it is 1 Cor 12 to 14 chapters and many more scriptural references .
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But, No evidence exists that the gifts came in any other way then through an Apostle's hands or through the two outpourings.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#275
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#275
CS1 said:
Wow guys the flow chart of the Holy Spirit and because they Bible did not record every thing the Holy Spirit did to be placed in a [ } -0
it did not happen.
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No record = adding to scripture if you try to fill in the blanks without scripture.
 
Wansvic

Wansvic

Well-known member
#276
Nov 27, 2018
5,254
1,109
113
#276
Dave-L said:
All believers in the New Covenant era have the gift of the Holy Spirit. But only few had the Baptism. It came through the two outpourings and then through a apostle's hands. It was a sign of Apostleship according to Hebrews 2:4.
“God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?” Hebrews 2:4 (KJV 1900)
Click to expand...
The scriptures I provided show what to expect when the Holy Ghost takes up residence in their body.

Read them again:
"And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues. Acts 2:1-4

Acts 2:38 - Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 19:6 - And when Paul had laid [his] hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

Acts 8:15 - Who (Peter & John), when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost

Apostle Peter stated: "Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? Acts 10:47

Luke 11:13 - If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall [your] heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#277
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#277
Wansvic said:
The scriptures I provided show what to expect when the Holy Ghost takes up residence in their body.

Read them again:
"And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues. Acts 2:1-4

Acts 2:38 - Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Acts 19:6 - And when Paul had laid [his] hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.

Acts 8:15 - Who (Peter & John), when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost

Apostle Peter stated: "Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? Acts 10:47

Luke 11:13 - If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall [your] heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?
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We all have the Holy Spirit. Nobody has the Baptism since the death of the APostles. All claims to the gifts today are fraudulent. They would be all over the media if true with miracles like the Apostles performed.
 
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Locoponydirtman

Guest
#278
#278
Locoponydirtman said:
And it still leaves the question. Why the focus on speaking in tongues and none on prophecy?
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If someone just started preaching the words of Jesus verbatim with out a Bible to read from, upon the laying on of hands then you would have something.
 
CS1

CS1

Well-known member
#279
May 23, 2012
13,058
4,341
113
#279
Dave-L said:
https://christianchat.com/threads/w...y-spirit-is-not-for-today.189832/post-4160110

Try to find scripture that says anything in Acts beyond this outline. It supports what is here but the rest is purely speculation.
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I guess the instruction of the Holy Spirit given to us through Paul in the context of the Gifts of the Holy Spirit found in 1corthians is not seen as authoritative as your flow chart? Paul never would think after HE died that the gift of the Holy Spirit would cease.
 
CS1

CS1

Well-known member
#280
May 23, 2012
13,058
4,341
113
#280
Locoponydirtman said:
And it still leaves the question. Why the focus on speaking in tongues and none on prophecy?
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again very good question Tongues & interpretation in the context of a church setting as 1cor 14:5 layout is equal to prophesying.

5 I would like every one of you to speak in tongues,[b] but I would rather have you prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues,[c] unless someone interprets, so that the church may be edified. The church can be edified just as prophesy if there is an interpretation. This is why one who is speaking in tongues is to pray that THEY interpret. Then the church judges what is said by the word of God all of the word. If there is no interpretation the elders are to tell that person to pray in silence.

The idea that one is focusing on tongues is a strawman. The same question is why is one only having an issue with one Gift of the Holy Spirit they are 8 more. I do not focus on tongues nor do I on prophesying. It is the idea that they are not for today. I do not see that to be scriptural
 
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