If you read the story you will find that on the first two instances Pharaoh hardened His own heart.. After two times refusing to obey God.. God then kept Pharaoh's heart hard so that God could perform the miraculous miracles.. God did this i believe to leave the world in no doubt that it was God himself who was freeing the Hebrews from Egypt and that it was not Moses and Aaron..
Why did God harden Pharaoh’s heart, rather than let them go right away?
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If you read the story you will find that on the first two instances Pharaoh hardened His own heart.. After two times refusing to obey God.. God then kept Pharaoh's heart hard so that God could perform the miraculous miracles.. God did this i believe to leave the world in no doubt that it was God himself who was freeing the Hebrews from Egypt and that it was not Moses and Aaron..
First mention;
“And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.” Exodus 4:21 (KJV 1900)
“For they cast down every man his rod, and they became serpents: but Aaron’s rod swallowed up their rods. And he hardened Pharaoh’s heart, that he hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said.” Exodus 7:12–13 (KJV 1900)
Who would not buckle under the severe judgments unless God supernaturally hardened their heart?
Yes God said he would harden Pharoah's heart but he did not say WHEN He would harden Phaorah's heart..
The second refusal of Pharoah is recorded in Exodus 8
Exodus 8: KJV
32 "And Pharaoh hardened his heart at this time also, neither would he let the people go."
So if Pharaoh hardened his own heart the second time Also then that must mean he hardened hios own heart the first time..
The third instance says that Pharaoh's heart was hardened.. Not that Pharaoh hardened his own heart..
Exodus 9: KJV
7 "And Pharaoh sent, and, behold, there was not one of the cattle of the Israelites dead. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, and he did not let the people go."
The Bible says God raised Pharaoh up so that God could show his power through him. It is echoed and elaborated on in Romans 9. Pharaoh was always meant to be destroyed even before he was born. Romans 9 elaborates upon this with the lesson of the vessels of wrath and the vessels of mercy.
Yes Pharaoh was doomed because God foreknew him and that he would reject the will of God.. But like all others God will allow them to reject His will.. Before God gives them over to delusions and deception..
Well God created him to that purpose. Vessels of wrath, they're just made to be destroyed so that all can see the power of God.
You have interpreted ""raised him up"" to be Created Him.. this is a Calvinist interpretation and i am not a Calvinist..
God raised him up to the position of Pharaoh foreknowing that He would repeatedly rebel against Gods will..
What moron would not flee in terror unless God hardened his heart so he would not? This is before Moses went back to Egypt.
“And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.” Exodus 4:21 (KJV 1900)
I am not a Calvinist either so I don't really care about their interpretations.
God raised up Pharaoh to destroy him. Pharaoh never believed in God all his life. Romans 9 has a good passage about this which I posted in the first page of this topic. Some people God makes as vessels of mercy, created to have God show his mercy through them. Some are vessels of wrath fit for destruction to have God show his mighty power through smiting them.
Some people would argue against apostle Paul on this wondering "how does he find fault if none have resisted his will?" To which Paul explains, it is not for the clay to say to the potter "what do you form?" The potter has the power over the clay to make one for honor and the other for dishonor, to make one for mercy and the other for wrath.
Think of it this way.. The Clay already exists before God works upon it to form it into a vessel.. Now if the God calvinism existed then the verse would have said God created one clay of wrath and another clay of honor..
And if you believe God created one person to have no other option but to be cast into the eternal lake of fire then you are a calvinist.. That's right at the base of calvinism.. God creates one person for the purpose of being saved and having eternal life with him in His perfect existence and God creates another person for the purpose of being an eternal burning tormented torch..
Well I don't care about Calvinism nor care to learn about it frankly. So I don't have much to say about Calvinism.
As far as the Bible goes, which I do know, yes some people are created simply to be destroyed. Not just to be thrown in the lake of fire for eternity, though that too, but really to be destroyed right here on earth in the sight of people so to show God's power through them.
This is why Pharaoh was created, this is why God hardened Pharaoh's heart. God was always going to destroy Pharaoh and the Egyptians, they were made to have God show his wrath through them and to make the name of God famous. To the converse, one can also see God was always going to free the Israelites, God was always going to raise Moses up and show his great and patient mercies through them.
If that's the case then the following verse is a lie right??
2 Peter 3: KJV
9 "The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance."
So Peter was not inspired and His letters now must now be rejected,, Right???
No, not at all. Like Romans 9 which elaborates about this, God bears with the vessels of wrath with much patience.
Romans 9:22-23
22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
Yeah but the restrictions you're putting on God are unfounded and "unbaseable", and that's not even a real word. You can't know how God works, of course we have choice, but are told that we are even enslaved to and by these very choices, we are going to serve one master or the other plain and simple. I love it. Praise Jesus mighty name.
Calvin imagined himself to be right about God. What he ventured to create shows that it was John Calvin that hated God.
Unfortunately, he didn't keep his ideas to himself and now there are a whole bunch of John Calvin like people believing in Calvin's god.
The purpose of John Calvin being born as I see it is to show people that anyone can make anything of the bible and its message. The can come up with a doctrine using the bible, they can twist those passages they choose and make all sorts of claims and stipulations about what it means to get right with God according to their creative inventing.
That doesn't mean that is what Jesus was about.
Before I was a married man I dated quite a bit. One young woman I was interested in was a Calvinist. I immersed myself in her church for over a year and all while I was a Christian that did not ascribe to Calvinism.
Quite the experience.
Later I met the woman I'd marry. She happened to own a flower shop that also had a bridge into landscaping by appointment. Our yard is spectacular. But to this day when I look at the layered tulip bed as it blossoms so beautifully beside the waterfall that flows in the background without chuckling just a little.
My wife always said I should let it go. And I assure her that I did but it still makes me laugh that a woman I knew so well, or thought I did back in the day, was so committed to a man's invention. And not only did he corrupt the words of God but he had to smear the image of a lovely flower for all time in the process. That batturd! haha. My wife still gets the joke.
You make the accusation that i am placing restrictions on God but then you never put forward what restrictions you are accusing me of putting on God..
The problem is, Calvin, Luther, and others of the same belief broke the back of the Catholic Church. And you agree with the Catholics on free will. The main belief they challenged.
I'm sorry if I seemed too harsh, I didn't mean to "accuse" in such a hard lined way. Let me explain what I mean when I say you put restrictions on Gods power. I didn't mean it in a demeaning way or anything like that, what I mean is the way you make it seem as if Gods not in control in every way. As if God is in some way a spectator just kind of watching us to see what we do. As if every single decision we make, and I do believe we make decision obviously, is not only know by Him, but was a 100% preordained, authored, and carried out by His will and power for His glory.
I know this is a point we differ in perspective on, and I very much understand why to be honest, and I don't even want you to think I'm even trying to debate your view, I'm just trying to explain what I mean by restricting God'a power. I can not explain to you at all how God works His sovereignty fitting our wills into it, this is one of the biggest mystery's of God I personally have stumbled upon, but I do not believe God is a spectator sitting and "watching/already knowing", what we are going to do at in any way at all. I believe this "restriction" you're putting on God is that He is not 100% in control of everything at all time. That's about the best way I can describe it. I hope it makes sense enough you at least understand what I believe, and again I am really sorry it came off the way it did last time. I was in a rush and didn't explain how I meant that nearly well enough. I didn't mean it like you were "robbing" God or anything like that.
