Have You Received the Holy Ghost Since You Believed?

[Guojing]

Believing Jesus is the son of God as witnessed in His death, burial and resurrection is an essential part in one being saved.

Notice Paul's exact words in 1 Cor 15:3, "...For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:"

Paul's comment that he told them "FIRST OF ALL" about Jesus death, burial and resurrection points to the fact that there was more to the gospel message he delivered to them.

Throughout chapter 15 Paul is specifically addressing erroneous beliefs about the resurrection of the dead. We also see water baptism was part of what they had learned from him from verse 29. Paul even mentions why bother to be baptized for dead people if there is no resurrection. Of course, being baptized for anyone other than yourself is not a biblical concept. But Paul's comment points to the born again Christians understanding that their water baptism was a necessary component of their salvation.

You don't want to read the scripture literally? How does one get saved when you read Romans to Philemon?

Is it

Believing that Jesus is the Son of God? (John 20:31)
or
Believing that Jesus Christ died for your sins and rose from the dead (Romans 10:9, 1 Cor 15:1-4)

Now the first option required water baptism, no doubt about it, as seen in early Acts, as well as the main verse Mark 16:16.

Why do you then also insist in water baptism in the 2nd option when there was no record in Romans to Philemon about the requirement to

1. believe that Jesus is the Son of God nor
2. be water baptised

 

[Guojing]

Your comments neglect to point out the real significance of the Acts 10 record. Peter's lack of understanding that all peoples would be required to fulfill the instructions is of no consequence. God orchestrated what occurred. This truth should open peoples eyes to the truth that God is in control and His ways are not always understood until after one steps out in faith and obeys His leading. Peter makes this clear through his interaction with the Jewish Council in Acts chapter 11. Who was he to withstand God?

My point was to state that, prior to Acts 10, Peter would never have gone to the gentiles before that. That is considered against the Law.

So it goes back to the point, the Body of Christ could not have begun in Acts 2. How can it be when it was against the Law for Jews to associate themselves with gentiles?

 

[throughfaith]

This has nothing to do with a specific denomination. It's what is in the word.

I am familiar with and study Paul's epistles. They contain detailed information concerning the foundational components of the salvation plan outlined in Acts. In addition, Paul's letters instruct those who have already been born again regarding what conduct is acceptable and pleasing to God.

i believe what many fail to realize is that obedience to the God-inspired instructions outlined in Acts is how each individual's foundation is put into place. One's belief in Jesus being the cornerstone, and repentance, water baptism and the infilling of the Holy Ghost comprising the other 3 corners. Without a proper foundation individual's are building on sand.

At the Royal Gorge in Colorado there is a suspension bridge spanning a great canyon, the bottom of which is more than a mile below. On either side of this gorge and this narrow bridge are solid walls of massive granite. Now one may stand upon the bridge; it will support weight. But only a fool would build his home there. A wise man would certainly take up permanent residence upon the solid ground on either side of the bridge. So it is with these transitional portions of scripture. They are true; we may stand upon them; they will support us. But woe be to the Christian who builds his spiritual life upon such bridges rather than the solid ground of the epistles.

 

[AndyMaleh]

All believers are sure they received the holy ghost because it is written:

Acts 2:38 (NET)

Peter said to them, “Repent, and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

 

[throughfaith]

All believers are sure they received the holy ghost because it is written:

Acts 2:38 (NET)

Peter said to them, “Repent, and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Is that how Paul describes how we are saved in the epistles ? ( as that is the best place to understand, for the church age .Peter is still preaching John the baptist meassage .And its to Israel . Your not Israel and its not until Paul is saved do we have the Gospel of grace .To preach Acts 2.38 today is wrong . We recieve the Holy spirit after we believe. Then we are baptised .

 

[throughfaith]

All believers are sure they received the holy ghost because it is written:

Acts 2:38 (NET)

Peter said to them, “Repent, and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Peter said a lot of things . Mostly to Israel . Did you miss it ?

 

[AndyMaleh]

God's grace to Israel is God's grace to everyone. Jesus Christ comes before Paul in importance. As a true Christian, I follow Jesus Christ, the namesake of Christianity, not Paul. And, Jesus's sayings are what proved true in my life. Paul's sayings apply more to ex-criminals like him. Since I am neither a criminal nor an ex-criminal, I do not need Paul's teachings if I have Jesus Christ's teachings from the Gospel, the true source. I have lived my life by them guided by the Holy Spirit every day since I've been born again. Even before I read much in the Bible, the Holy Spirit led me to give up all my possessions, and later I found out Jesus Christ asked a Jew to do so and he failed to obey, so I knew I was on the right path. Just like Jesus Christ said, I abided in his teachings, and so I became his true disciple, and then I knew the truth, and the truth made me free. Godspeed.

 

[throughfaith]

God's grace to Israel is God's grace to everyone. Jesus Christ comes before Paul in importance. As a true Christian, I follow Jesus Christ, the namesake of Christianity, not Paul. And, Jesus's sayings are what proved true in my life. Paul's sayings apply more to ex-criminals like him. Since I am neither a criminal nor an ex-criminal, I do not need Paul's teachings if I have Jesus Christ's teachings from the Gospel, the true source. I have lived my life by them guided by the Holy Spirit every day since I've been born again. Even before I read much in the Bible, the Holy Spirit led me to give up all my possessions, and later I found out Jesus Christ asked a Jew to do so and he failed to obey, so I knew I was on the right path. Just like Jesus Christ said, I abided in his teachings, and so I became his true disciple, and then I knew the truth, and the truth made me free. Godspeed.

Wow ! there's so much wrong in what you've just said , I'm actually shocked 😲 . Jesus specifically commissioned Paul . Following the instructions in Paul's letters is Following Jesus . Ignore Paul your disobeying Jesus . And we were all ex criminal s as far as God is concerned .

 

[Wansvic]

After the resurrection of Christ we find, in the first seven chapters of the book of Acts, that the believers continued to preach to the Jews first before they were scattered to take the good news to the Gentiles. The message of the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ began to be preached to Israel. Read carefully the statements and sermons of the apostles in Acts 2-7, and this will be perfectly clear. Prior to Acts 8, no one preached that an individual could be saved solely on the merits of the finished work of the Lord Jesus Christ. Though no one ever came to the Father but by Jesus Christ, this was not clearly understood prior to His resurrection (1 Peter 1:10-12). When the Ethiopian eunuch was taught from Isaiah by Philip, we find an individual Gentile converted by preaching the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ (Isaiah 53). He was saved by grace through faith and baptized afterwards. From this point forward, the men who had preached the good news to the Jew first began to take it to the ends of the earth.
Saul of Tarsus is converted by believing on the Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 9) and is called to be the apostle to the Gentiles (Romans 11:13). His gospel message, found in 1 Corinthians 15, is the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ, according to the scriptures. These great gospel truths of the suffering Saviour paying for the sins of the world with His own precious blood are found throughout the Old Testament writings, but prior to the conversion of the apostle Paul, they were hid from the hearts and minds of men. When Paul wrote to the body of Christ in Colossians 1, he said that the gospel message of salvation by grace and birth into the church of God and the body of Christ was a mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints (Colossians 1:26). The salvation of the soul through faith in the finished work of Christ is taught all through the law and the prophets but was not revealed until the Holy Spirit bade Paul unfold such truth in his epistles.

See Acts 19:1-6. Paul's gospel message was no different than the one initially presented by Peter.

 

[Wansvic]

You don't want to read the scripture literally? How does one get saved when you read Romans to Philemon?

Is it

Believing that Jesus is the Son of God? (John 20:31)
or
Believing that Jesus Christ died for your sins and rose from the dead (Romans 10:9, 1 Cor 15:1-4)

Now the first option required water baptism, no doubt about it, as seen in early Acts, as well as the main verse Mark 16:16.

Why do you then also insist in water baptism in the 2nd option when there was no record in Romans to Philemon about the requirement to

1. believe that Jesus is the Son of God nor
2. be water baptised

Paul's letters were sent to people who had already been born again. They give more detail about what actually occurred in their baptism, etc. Corrected erroneous beliefs in conjunction with baptism, etc. And instructed them regarding proper conduct and kingdom principles.

 

[Wansvic]

Is that how Paul describes how we are saved in the epistles ? ( as that is the best place to understand, for the church age .Peter is still preaching John the baptist meassage .And its to Israel . Your not Israel and its not until Paul is saved do we have the Gospel of grace .To preach Acts 2.38 today is wrong . We recieve the Holy spirit after we believe. Then we are baptised .

Peter is not preaching John's message. John did not baptize anyone in the name of the Lord Jesus nor state one could expect to receive the infilling of the Holy Ghost during his time of ministry.

Also, please provide scripture that states one specifically receives the Holy Ghost the moment they believe.

 

[Wansvic]

My point was to state that, prior to Acts 10, Peter would never have gone to the gentiles before that. That is considered against the Law.

So it goes back to the point, the Body of Christ could not have begun in Acts 2. How can it be when it was against the Law for Jews to associate themselves with gentiles?

Mark 1:1 begins by stating the what follows is the beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ. John the Baptist preached Jesus and water baptism for the remission of sin and stated Jesus would baptize with the Holy Ghost sometime in the future.

Peter and Paul's message of the gospel included all the components John initially presented. However, John's baptism later transitioned into water baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus. This was due to the connection water baptism would have with Jesus' death, burial and resurrection.

Notice Paul's statement in Romans:
Rom 1:16-17
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

There is one step of faith in conjunction with belief, another step of faith submitting to water baptism, and again upon believing and receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost.

 

[throughfaith]

See Acts 19:1-6. Paul's gospel message was no different than the one initially presented by Peter.

have you had an encounter like Paul had ? "
2He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.
3¶And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism." Is this normative today ? well nor is the response normative for today either . You do not understand what is happening in Acts . The transition from the OT to NT , From Jews to gentiles and from Johns message to the Gosepl of grace . If you've based your soteriology on Acts then you will have no clue what the rest of the NT is saying ..

 

[throughfaith]

Peter is not preaching John's message. John did not baptize anyone in the name of the Lord Jesus nor state one could expect to receive the infilling of the Holy Ghost during his time of ministry.

Also, please provide scripture that states one specifically receives the Holy Ghost the moment they believe.

Eph 1 .1313¶In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

 

[throughfaith]

Mark 1:1 begins by stating the what follows is the beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ. John the Baptist preached Jesus and water baptism for the remission of sin and stated Jesus would baptize with the Holy Ghost sometime in the future.

Peter and Paul's message of the gospel included all the components John initially presented. However, John's baptism later transitioned into water baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus. This was due to the connection water baptism would have with Jesus' death, burial and resurrection.

Notice Paul's statement in Romans:
Rom 1:16-17
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

There is one step of faith in conjunction with belief, another step of faith submitting to water baptism, and again upon believing and receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Eisegesis (/ˌaɪsɪˈdʒiːsɪs/) is the process of interpreting text in such a way as to introduce one's own presuppositions, agendas or biases. ... Exegesis is drawing out text's meaning in accordance with the author's context and discoverable meaning.

 

[Guojing]

Mark 1:1 begins by stating the what follows is the beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ. John the Baptist preached Jesus and water baptism for the remission of sin and stated Jesus would baptize with the Holy Ghost sometime in the future.

Peter and Paul's message of the gospel included all the components John initially presented. However, John's baptism later transitioned into water baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus. This was due to the connection water baptism would have with Jesus' death, burial and resurrection.

Notice Paul's statement in Romans:
Rom 1:16-17
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

There is one step of faith in conjunction with belief, another step of faith submitting to water baptism, and again upon believing and receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Are you addressing my point about how Peter would have responded to Gentiles in Acts 2 and 3?

No point in you quoting Paul here, the revelation of what he said was unknown in early Acts.

 

[Guojing]

Paul's letters were sent to people who had already been born again. They give more detail about what actually occurred in their baptism, etc. Corrected erroneous beliefs in conjunction with baptism, etc. And instructed them regarding proper conduct and kingdom principles.

Paul never mentioned the necessity of being born again, even once in his epistles.

 

[Wansvic]

have you had an encounter like Paul had ? "
2He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.
3¶And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism." Is this normative today ? well nor is the response normative for today either . You do not understand what is happening in Acts . The transition from the OT to NT , From Jews to gentiles and from Johns message to the Gosepl of grace . If you've based your soteriology on Acts then you will have no clue what the rest of the NT is saying ..

As I stated previously this encounter occurred about 20 years after Pentecost. The gospel of grace presented at Pentecost was still be preached by Paul. Keep in mind that 2 Tim 3:16 speaks to the fact that ALL scripture is given by God for instruction in righteousness.

 

[Wansvic]

Eph 1 .1313¶In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

This scripture speaks to the truth that once a person is presented with the entire Pentecost message (word of truth, the gospel of salvation) and believes it they obey the commands indicating they have put their trust in Jesus. As stated in the instructions, they will receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. That promise pertains to all that the Lord God shall call. (Acts 2:38-39)

 

[Wansvic]

Are you addressing my point about how Peter would have responded to Gentiles in Acts 2 and 3?

No point in you quoting Paul here, the revelation of what he said was unknown in early Acts.

Paul was given the revelation that the church was comprised of both the Jews and Gentiles by Jesus Himself. Whereas, this truth became known to Peter through God-inspired individual practical experiences. (Acts 2:38, 8:12-17, 10:44-48)

Paul's direct revelation as well as the truth again seen through practical experiences in the biblical record provide the 2-3 witness principle required for an established truth to be realized.