Justified by work vs faith

[Jackson123]

Those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. (Galatians 5:21) No one who is born of God practices sin.. (1 John 3:9) Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? (1 Corinthians 6:9) And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God. (1 Corinthians 6:11) Are you getting the picture?

1 John 3:7 - Little children, make sure no one deceives you; the one who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous; 8 the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning. The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil. 9 No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. 10 By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.

I agree, It Seem If we do this sin below, we have to repent or go to hell

21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Do you believe after Being Christian No matter what you do you go to heaven, If you murder No need repent only lose your reward. Child never lose his status as child. Murder child is child still go to heaven?

 

[throughfaith]

My brother, this is how the Lord did for disobey child, No more Eden

Now for the disobey No inherit the kingdom of God
The same verse

21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Nothing there about a Person in christ not going to heaven my friend.

 

[throughfaith]

Yep, and murder kickek out of inherit the kingdom of heaven

Same verse my brother, I am not make this verse

21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Nor did Adam being kicked out the Garden mean Adam could not go to heaven . Unless you have a verse which says that Adam could not go to Heaven after the fall ? likewise are you saying unbelievers cannot go to heaven even if after they do turn to the Lord ? it seems like no one can be saved in your system. Adam , unbelievers , what's the point if no one can be saved ?

 

[throughfaith]

Yep, and murder kickek out of inherit the kingdom of heaven

Same verse my brother, I am not make this verse

21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

And were back to square one again? so no one who has murdered can recieve Jesus. Prison ministry is a waste of time then .

 

[throughfaith]

You say all liar include Christian liar isn't it

I'm just going with what it says . But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
According to your theology and inlight of this verse . No one will be in heaven .

 

[mailmandan]

I agree, It Seem If we do this sin below, we have to repent or go to hell

21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Do you believe after Being Christian No matter what you do you go to heaven, If you murder No need repent only lose your reward. Child never lose his status as child. Murder child is child still go to heaven?

I believe that Christians practice righteousness and not sin, (1 John 3:9-10) but that does not mean they will never sin at all. (1 John 1:8-10; 2:1) How many Christians do you know that go around murdering people? Is that the fruit of being a child of God? In regards to envying, drunkenness, revelings etc.. not to say that Christians are exempt from ever having weak moments and stumbling in this regard, yet this is not their lifestyle or bent of life.

 

[throughfaith]

You say all liar include Christian liar isn't it

I see your making a distinction between 'Christian liar 'and non Christian liar '. It says all liars .

 

[throughfaith]

I believe that Christians practice righteousness and not sin, (1 John 3:9-10) but that does not mean they will never sin at all. (1 John 1:8-10; 2:1) How many Christians do you know that go around murdering people? Is that the fruit of being a child of God? In regards to envying, drunkenness, revelings etc.. not to say that Christians are exempt from ever having weak moments and stumbling in this regard, yet this is not their lifestyle or bent of life.

I'm not sure this is the case on whether we ' practice 'sin or not . What's the limit and how many is enough ? some people are continuing to be proud and have many sins which are not necessarily noticible , but they practice regularly.

 

[mailmandan]

I'm not sure this is the case on whether we ' practice 'sin or not . What's the limit and how many is enough? some people are continuing to be proud and have many sins which are not necessarily noticible , but they practice regularly.

The idea of "practice" is to perform repeatedly or habitually and thus describes repetition or continuous action with no goal or effort to stop. This describes the practice as habitual, as one's lifestyle or bent of life. Those who practice sin demonstrate that they have not been born of God. To have weak moments and stumble and sin intermittently is different than making these sinful behaviors a willful, ongoing lifestyle. Even the apostle Peter had his weak movements and sinned when he denied Christ three times, as Jesus said he would, and also when he was playing the part of a hypocrite when he was not straightforward about the truth of the gospel in Galatians 2:11-15 and the apostle Paul had to rebuke him. Yet that was not Peter's bent of life.

 

[throughfaith]

The idea of "practice" is to perform repeatedly or habitually and thus describes repetition or continuous action with no goal or effort to stop. This describes the practice as habitual, as one's lifestyle or bent of life. Those who practice sin demonstrate that they have not been born of God. To have weak moments and stumble and sin intermittently is different than making these sinful behaviors a willful, ongoing lifestyle. Even the apostle Peter had his weak movements and sinned when he denied Christ three times, as Jesus said he would, and also when he was playing the part of a hypocrite when he was not straightforward about the truth of the gospel in Galatians 2:11-15 and the apostle Paul had to rebuke him. Yet that was not Peter's bent of life.

I hear what your saying . My thoughts are this could be viewed as closer to Lordship salvation thinking . The ' no true Scotsmen ' or when Calvinists say we are saved by faith alone, BUT ( there's always a but ) that faith is never alone . The reason from a Calvinist perspective is that ' Faith ' is a supernatural gift ,so of course this " Faith ' has to bare fruit ,otherwise ' did you ever recieve it , are you one of the elect, type of thinking.

 

[throughfaith]

The idea of "practice" is to perform repeatedly or habitually and thus describes repetition or continuous action with no goal or effort to stop. This describes the practice as habitual, as one's lifestyle or bent of life. Those who practice sin demonstrate that they have not been born of God. To have weak moments and stumble and sin intermittently is different than making these sinful behaviors a willful, ongoing lifestyle. Even the apostle Peter had his weak movements and sinned when he denied Christ three times, as Jesus said he would, and also when he was playing the part of a hypocrite when he was not straightforward about the truth of the gospel in Galatians 2:11-15 and the apostle Paul had to rebuke him. Yet that was not Peter's bent of life.

I think the word 'practice 'may not be the best translation ?

 

[mailmandan]

I think the word 'practice 'may not be the best translation ?

I've heard 3 different interpretations for 1 John 3:9.

1. No one who is born of God sins (that is the part of us that is born of God does not sin, but the flesh still sins)

2. No one who is born of God practices sin (willful, habitual lifestyle or bent of life)

3. No one who is born of God sins at all (sinless perfection)

The Amplified Bible reads - No one who is born of God [deliberately, knowingly, and habitually] practices sin, because God’s seed [His principle of life, the essence of His righteous character] remains [permanently] in him [who is born again—who is reborn from above—spiritually transformed, renewed, and set apart for His purpose]; and he [who is born again] cannot habitually [live a life characterized by] sin, because he is born of God and longs to please Him.

 

[throughfaith]

The idea of "practice" is to perform repeatedly or habitually and thus describes repetition or continuous action with no goal or effort to stop. This describes the practice as habitual, as one's lifestyle or bent of life. Those who practice sin demonstrate that they have not been born of God. To have weak moments and stumble and sin intermittently is different than making these sinful behaviors a willful, ongoing lifestyle. Even the apostle Peter had his weak movements and sinned when he denied Christ three times, as Jesus said he would, and also when he was playing the part of a hypocrite when he was not straightforward about the truth of the gospel in Galatians 2:11-15 and the apostle Paul had to rebuke him. Yet that was not Peter's bent of life.

I think usually we can tell an unbeliever from what they say about the Gospel . Fruit inspection is misleading. Let's face it Mormons and Jehovah witnesses on the surface look more Christian. They certainly are prepared to preach there Gospel without hesitation.

 

[throughfaith]

I've heard 3 different interpretations for 1 John 3:9.

1. No one who is born of God sins (that is the part of us that is born of God does not sin, but the flesh still sins)

2. No one who is born of God practices sin (willful, habitual lifestyle or bent of life)

3. No one who is born of God sins at all (sinless perfection)

The Amplified Bible reads - No one who is born of God [deliberately, knowingly, and habitually] practices sin, because God’s seed [His principle of life, the essence of His righteous character] remains [permanently] in him [who is born again—who is reborn from above—spiritually transformed, renewed, and set apart for His purpose]; and he [who is born again] cannot habitually [live a life characterized by] sin, because he is born of God and longs to please Him.

What if the spirit never sins . That is born of God . 'The seed remains ' just a thought on some admittedly tricky verses . But ' practices ' I feel leads to a works based mindset .

 

[mailmandan]

I think usually we can tell an unbeliever from what they say about the Gospel . Fruit inspection is misleading. Let's face it Mormons and Jehovah witnesses on the surface look more Christian. They certainly are prepared to preach there Gospel without hesitation.

I look to what people say about the gospel first. If someone preaches a "different" gospel, then it really does not matter how many so called good works that they attempt to conjure up through the flesh or how much self moral-reformation they have experienced. Without believing the correct gospel, they are still lost in their sins.

 

[mailmandan]

What if the spirit never sins . That is born of God . 'The seed remains ' just a thought on some admittedly tricky verses . But 'practices' I feel leads to a works based mindset .

Someone might see "practice" that way, but at the same time, even though we are not saved by our performance after conversion, our performance testifies to what is in our heart. If someone claims to be saved, yet you see them continuously living like the devil, then their testimony is bogus. If someone was on trial for being a Christian, there should be enough evidence to convict them (even though some may have more evidence than others). Now some people may do a good job of looking like the real deal (like Judas Iscariot) yet Jesus knew his heart and said he is a devil! (John 6:70)

 

[throughfaith]

They

Someone might see "practice" that way, but at the same time, even though we are not saved by our performance after conversion, our performance testifies to what is in our heart. If someone claims to be saved, yet you see them continuously living like the devil, then their testimony is bogus. If someone was on trial for being a Christian, there should be enough evidence to convict them (even though some may have more evidence than others). Now some people may do a good job of looking like the real deal (like Judas Iscariot) yet Jesus knew his heart and said he is a devil! (John 6:70)

I see the difference as what they believe . An atheist will tell you flat out ' God is a myth ' . No confusion there . Its the same with Mormons, Jws, SDA , new agers , wiccans , . We know from what they believe. If I see a ' professing Christian I ask what they believe .

 

[throughfaith]

Someone might see "practice" that way, but at the same time, even though we are not saved by our performance after conversion, our performance testifies to what is in our heart. If someone claims to be saved, yet you see them continuously living like the devil, then their testimony is bogus. If someone was on trial for being a Christian, there should be enough evidence to convict them (even though some may have more evidence than others). Now some people may do a good job of looking like the real deal (like Judas Iscariot) yet Jesus knew his heart and said he is a devil! (John 6:70)

it actually turns out that someone has good outward ' evidence ' . They tick every box on the fruit list. They preach , they lead clean lives , pay their bills on time..but can be completely lost and unsaved. Many will be in churches . I see it more about who they are trusting. is it their fruit or Jesus .

 

[mailmandan]

it actually turns out that someone has good outward 'evidence.' They tick every box on the fruit list. They preach, they lead clean lives, pay their bills on time..but can be completely lost and unsaved. Many will be in churches. I see it more about who they are trusting. is it their fruit or Jesus .

Even Jesus referred to the scribes and Pharisees, as whitewashed tombs which on the outside appear beautiful, but inside they are full of dead men's bones and all uncleanness. (Matthew 23:27) They were obviously trusting in works and not in Jesus for salvation. Even though men at times may be fooled by outward appearance, God knows our hearts. There is no fooling Him. He knows our heart's motivation for why we do the things we do.

 

[throughfaith]

Even Jesus referred to the scribes and Pharisees, as whitewashed tombs which on the outside appear beautiful, but inside they are full of dead men's bones and all uncleanness. (Matthew 23:27) They were obviously trusting in works and not in Jesus for salvation. Even though men at times may be fooled by outward appearance, God knows our hearts. There is no fooling Him. He knows our heart's motivation for why we do the things we do.

Exactly . So we do can all the works under the sun ( And we should . He saved us and its the least we could do ) but they are not evidence of anything to anyone . Of course we will have a hard time preaching the Gospel to someone whilst punching them in the face and stealing their wallet. That won't save anyone .