Today’s church’s misunderstandings

[mustaphadrink]

well, you will have to take that up with the Lord. i am simply taking Him at His word about who is under what Covenant.

gentiles are and never were under the Mosaic Covenant, and are not required to keep the Sabbath.

Well then, that begs the question, if they are not required to keep the sabbath which was one of the 10 commandments, does that mean it is OK to murder, which is another one of the 10 commandments?

 

[gb9]

the other 9 were all repeated in the N.T. as commands for Christians, but Sabbath was not repeated as a command...

 

[mustaphadrink]

the other 9 were all repeated in the N.T. as commands for Christians, but Sabbath was not repeated as a command...

Where were the other nine repeated? Chapter and verse, please?

 

[mustaphadrink]

the other 9 were all repeated in the N.T. as commands for Christians, but Sabbath was not repeated as a command...

Perhaps that was not necessary as the New Testament church met on the Sabbath, not Sunday anyway,

 

[gb9]

Perhaps that was not necessary as the New Testament church met on the Sabbath, not Sunday anyway,

negative.

the early church met on sun. morning, very early, before they went to work,

why? because Christ rose on sun. not the Sabbath.

 

[gb9]

Where were the other nine repeated? Chapter and verse, please?

read the N.T.

you will see them there. there is NO command for gentile Christians to keep the jewish Sabbath.

 

[DesertWanderer]

The church tells us that God knew he make a mistake so he cancelled the old covenant.

I have been involved in a lot of churches in my lifetime. I have NEVER heard any pastor or leader espouse this false, unbiblical notion.

The church goes on and on about the mistakes the Lord has made.

Which church?

Scripture tells us to celebrate Christ with Passover, the church says God cancelled that. They made up a new way to do it and named it using pagan gods to inspire them to make up a name for this replacement.

I don't mean to be unkind, but I think it may be time for you to turn off the computer and pick up the Word of God, meaning your Bible.

The beginning of wisdom is to fear the Lord,
and acknowledging the Holy One is understanding. Proverbs 9:10

but the word of the Lord endures forever 1 Peter 1:25

 

[Godcares]

Actually, we have services on Sunday because Constantine changed the day to attract the pagans to the church.

In terms of your statement, am I correct in concluding that Christians used to keep the Sabbath on Saturday and started going to church on Sunday because of one man’s decision.

So possibly, if Constantine had not decided that Christians should start going to church on Sunday, then all Christians would be going to church on Saturday in 2020 and we would not be having this debate of Saturday vs Sunday?

 

[gb9]

In terms of your statement, am I correct in concluding that Christians used to keep the Sabbath on Saturday and started going to church on Sunday because of one man’s decision.

So possibly, if Constantine had not decided that Christians should start going to church on Sunday, then all Christians would be going to church on Saturday in 2020 and we would not be having this debate of Saturday vs Sunday?

no, that is not correct.

judeaizers teach that Jesus rose on the Sabbath and early Christians met on the Sabbath until constantine outlawed Sabbath keeping .

that is a sick lie. Jesus rose on sun, early Christians met early sun. morning , as sun was a work day back then.

many Sabbath pushers think that sun worship is either the mark of the beast ,and/or worshiping nimrod the sun god.

any Sabbath pusher should be ignored, they are not trying to teach, they have an agenda.

 

[mailmandan]

Where were the other nine repeated? Chapter and verse, please?

1. You shall have no other gods before Me. - Acts 14:15
2. You shall make no idols. - 1 John 5:21
3. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain. - James 2:7; 5:12
4. Keep the Sabbath day holy. - Not binding on the Church - Colossians 2:16-17
5. Honor your father and your mother. - Ephesians 6:1-2
6. You shall not murder. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 John 3:15
7. You shall not commit adultery. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 Corinthians 6:9-10
8. You shall not steal. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 4:28
9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor. - Romans 13:9-10; Colossians 3:9-10
10. You shall not covet. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 5:3

 

[mailmandan]

Perhaps that was not necessary as the New Testament church met on the Sabbath, not Sunday anyway,

Chapter and verse, please?

 

[garee]

Cutting a man's foreskin is male circumcision, but what about women?

Women are not used to respect the flesh of the Son of man, Jesus

When the veil was rent from the top to the bottom . It signified the flesh of the first born the Son of man, Jesus . It fulfilled that shadow as well as most shadows as laws used in ceremonies .They spoke beforehand of the sufferings of our bloody husband .They where fulfilled at that time of reformation.

In that way they received the end of the faith of Christ that worked in them from the beginning .We on this side of the reformation look back to the glory that made the shadows disappear by the same one spirit of faith.

Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls. Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you: Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow. 1 Peter 1: 9-11

 

[throughfaith]

The church today says that the Sabbath was cancelled. As proof they tell of Mary’s discovery of the risen Christ on Sunday. It doesn’t make sense that the time of a discovery should change what God tells us He created on the seventh day, or that a time of discovering something establishes when it happened, but that is the way they think.

The Lord gave us a new covenant, one we are told makes the old covenant obsolete. The church tells us that God knew he make a mistake so he cancelled the old covenant. I guess they think that God is like them and they know they make mistakes so they say so does the Lord. As if the Lord was just another human.

The church goes on and on about the mistakes the Lord has made. They say the sacrificial system didn’t work at all for atonement of sin even though scripture tells us it did. When the blood of cattle was used to feed the Lord, like pagans fed idols and not as a symbol of Christ, God hated it so the church tells us it was a mistake of the Lord to establish it.

The church tells us OT scripture can be in error. OT scripture tells us that God guides us to praise and celebrate His plan of salvation for us with feasts for all generations. The church tells us that is an error, that the feasts are to be treated the same way cutting the foreskin is treated.

Scripture tells us to celebrate Christ with Passover, the church says God cancelled that. They made up a new way to do it and named it using pagan gods to inspire them to make up a name for this replacement.

Demons are attracted to the church, undermining it is undermining the Lord. They have done a mighty work, they will still fail in the end.

Let no man therefore judge you in food, or in drink, or in respect of a holy day, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
col2
13And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
14Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
15And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
16¶Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

 

[garee]

Mark 16:1 And the sabbath passing, Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of James and Salome, bought spices, so that coming they might anoint Him. Mark 16:2 And very early on the first of the week, the sun having risen, they came upon the tomb.

Luke 24:1 And the first of the sabbaths, while still very early, they came on the tomb, carrying spices which they prepared; and some were with them.

John 20:1 But on the first of the sabbaths, Mary Magdalene came early to the tomb, darkness yet being on it. And she saw the stone had been removed from the tomb.

Matthew 28:1 But late in the sabbaths, at the dawning into the first of the sabbaths, Mary the Magdalene and the other Mary came to gaze upon the grave.

Mark 16:9 And having risen early on the first of the sabbath, He first appeared to Mary Magdalene, from whom He had cast out seven demons.

John 20:19 Then it being evening on that day, the first of the sabbaths, and the doors having been locked where the disciples were assembled because of fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood in the midst and said to them, Peace to you.

These are all the verses you quoted to make your case, but in the original and literal interpretation, it does not mention Sunday. In every case, it says the first of the sabbaths.

Therefore can you explain why this is the case?

It introduces the new era of sabbaths. This side of the reformation .This when God changed the name of His born again bride Israel to her new name and more befitting name Christian.

 

[J-T]

Perhaps that was not necessary as the New Testament church met on the Sabbath, not Sunday anyway,

Do you have a Bible Chapter and Verse to support that incorrect statement?

 

[Dino246]

When the veil was rent from the top to the bottom . It signified the flesh of the first born the Son of man, Jesus .

Where is that in Scripture?

 

[Just_Jo]

Baptism symbolizes death and resurrection, and we follow Jesus into burial to have resurrection through Him. This is our rest because our miserable works of the flesh are finally laid off. This is The "taking up of our cross and following Jesus" (crucifying the flesh). Jesus was not about self gratification but did God's work, and we are expected to do the same 24/7. He increases His presence in your being, so ultimately it isn't you, but Jesus that works through you. You "ceased from your works like God did from His" (resting), Jesus now lives in that house. So because He is holy, you are also kept holy, He hallows the temple which is your body. "Be holy as I am holy", this can only be achieved through you no more living, men are contrary to God. But we are set apart as holy vessels for God's 24/7 use.

1 Peter 1:15-16
But as he who called you is holy, you also be holy in all your conduct, since it is written, “You shall be holy, for I am holy.”
Galatians 2:20
I have been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me. (...)
Hebrews 4:9-10
So then, there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God, for whoever has entered God's rest has also rested from his works as God did from his.

This tells us that the promised Sabbath rest intended for the people of God is something that is "entered". Are we still talking about a weekly ordinance?

A big AMEN!

 

[Nehemiah6]

So possibly, if Constantine had not decided that Christians should start going to church on Sunday, then all Christians would be going to church on Saturday in 2020 and we would not be having this debate of Saturday vs Sunday?

Constantine had very little to do with the Lord's Day, other than make it the Christian day of worship within the Roman empire. Which was according to the New Testament. From the day of Christ's resurrection, Christians observed the Lord's Day on the first day of the week, NOT the last day of the week.

 

[GandalfTheWhite]

read the N.T.

you will see them there. there is NO command for gentile Christians to keep the jewish Sabbath.

All I can say is we are going around in circles

There is no such thing as a "jewish Sabbath" unless you are referring to the feast days the Jews themselves ordained as Sabbaths. If you are referring to Saturday it is a "negative".

 

[Angela53510]

No, I am not judging you and I don't believe you are 96. I bring up the idea of keeping the Sabbath. it is my understanding IF you as I have broken the commandment Once you can not go back and keep it. That is all.

I've known Blik for many years on CC. I guess since she was 90, making it 6 years. In those days, the age was part of your avatar. So everyone knew she was old, and a woman. We used to talk, till she became angry because she couldn't convince me to become a Hebrew Roots person, like her. There we're other things going on, not related to CC, and no fault of Blik's.

I will vouch for her age and integrity. What I will not stand for, is this cycle she has of coming back every 6 months or so, and pushing this erroneous theology on everyone here.

I'm not going to post verses. I've done it many times, and she doesn't listen. I've seen a really good case made for worshipping on Sunday, the first day of the week. No need for me to go through the whole tedious and irrelevant defence again.

So, Blik is 96, she is a woman, she believes strongly what she is saying, but sadly is caught up in this Hebrew Roots cult. She does a lot of other Jewish things, trying to keep Old Testament laws and commands that were not meant for the church!

It's called context, Blik! Context is where you show something to demonstrate your point, using the verses in the passage and how they support the people it was written to. While there are universal principles in the OT, the Levitical laws are not among them. Even in Genesis, where God rested, it was never meant to be a day God commands us to legalistically keep. The real universal principle is that God expects us to rest weekly, to restore our hearts, minds and souls. That is what honours God, not legalistically keeping certain days or the Jewish feasts, for that matter.