Is Catholicism the Oldest Christian Faith?

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Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
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This is not purgatory

Psalm 66:12 (RSV) "Thou didst let men ride over our heads; we went through fire and through water; yet thou hast brought us forth to a spacious place."

This is king David experience happen when he life on earth, he not wrote after he die

If this is purgatory say it in simple language like hell. Lake of fire

Purgatory is pagan origins.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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therein lies the error. According to Jesus there is no 'second' Church. He promised to preserve them until He returned.
You don't believe that God can live up to His promises to the Church? Or He needed some man at an arbitrary point in time to restore a work He began?
Yes he needs no man. Sola scriptura does all the reforming, restoring.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
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what about the Apostles? Martin Luther and the other reformers, didn't They make some laws you obey?
No they not make any law, they preach the same gospel from Jesus.

Deutronomy 4
2.Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the Lord your God which I command you.

Catholic add a lot of man make law to produce more money, they lie to you
 
Mar 28, 2016
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There is no support. Its easy to see by what did did offer below .Either in this age or in the age to come.it is simply saying forever and ever.

Matthew 12:32
And whoever says a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.

If this sin cannot be forgiven after death, it follows that there are others which can be, and this must be in purgatory: precisely the interpretation of Saint Augustine, Pope Saint Gregory the Great, the Venerable Bede, and Saint Bernard, among others.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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No they not make any law, they preach the same gospel from Jesus.

Deutronomy 4
2.Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the Lord your God which I command you.

Catholic add a lot of man make law to produce more money, they lie to you
Yes we do not attribute the faith of Christ as it is written in respect to those in whom he sends the thoughts of God, by the feet of mankind. Its how beautiful are the feet of those who both hear the will and are empowers to work it out to the good pleasure of God.

Apostles are not a source of faith by which we could believe God .Apostle means "sent one" with no other meaning added .Not venerable ones or reliable ones. We are warned of those who do glory in their own flesh ...
 

Athanasius377

Active member
Aug 20, 2020
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Northern Kentucky
Why do they teach that Mary alone who they call the queen of heaven and we call our sister in Christ. That she alone received the fullness of born again grace .And the rest of Catholics receive a unknow remnant and must continue to wonder and suffer for another unknown never coming to the end of faith the fulness of grace . Why are not all mankind born again signifying the fulness of grace. Where do find he only gave a remnant of grace to some and they must continue to wonder and surfer and wonder and suffer to no end?
It would seem the verse below could be one possibility.

Wonders bring lies prophecy the word of God declared the answer of faith. No need to wonder, wonder, wonder when strengthened by faith .

2 Thessalonians 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
What does that have to do with the post?
 

Athanasius377

Active member
Aug 20, 2020
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Job in chapter 9 informs us that God is not a man and neither is there any infallible fleshly umpire that sits between God not seen and man seen.
Yes we do, but not an umpire, an advocate, παράκλητον.
But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. 2 He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world.

The Holy Bible: English Standard Version. (2016). (1 Jn 2:1–2). Wheaton, IL: Crossway Bibles.

I am aware of both popular reformations (1st and 15th) they came because men had another authroity as a law of the fathers. . .
Show me evidence this is the case. Cite an authority to back up your claim.

And do you attend a church on a regular basis?
 
Aug 14, 2019
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Jesus did not make salvation so deep that no one get to it. No deeper meaning of man can contradict the word of God.
True. But salvation wasn't what we were discussing.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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Yes we do, but not an umpire, an advocate, παράκλητον.
But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. 2 He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world.

The Holy Bible: English Standard Version. (2016). (1 Jn 2:1–2). Wheaton, IL: Crossway Bibles.


Show me evidence this is the case. Cite an authority to back up your claim.

And do you attend a church on a regular basis?
The word of our one Holy Father sola scriptura (all things written in the law and the prophets) is the final authority in matters of faith (the unseen eternal)

Yes, the advocate our unseen Holy Father Holy See who dwells in the believer .He works to both to will and empower us to do his good pleasure. Not the pleasures of a Pope or daysman seen.

We are to not call any man on earth father. One is our Holy Father. He alone is the infallible teacher ..

God is not a man
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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Yes, the advocate our unseen Holy Father Holy See who dwells in the believer .
This is flatly contradictory to Scripture. Jesus is the advocate, as 1 John 2 tells us. You need to remove the blinders of your own erroneous beliefs and simply accept what the Scripture plainly states.
 

GraceAndTruth

Well-known member
Sep 28, 2015
2,031
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Questions in original post...
1. why stray from one doctrine to another? Because maturity in the faith thru the scriptures brings revelation of truth to believers.
2. how do we know if true? test by the bible, the bible alone is our sole authority on faith and morals
3. opinions are like belly buttons, everyone has one and none are useful
4. the value of Christianity to humanity is invaluable......much of the 'civilization' of the human race comes from bible precepts
5. our opinions versus God's? I would think no person of good sense would put their finite minds against the infinite knowledge of God

‘Now the natural man receives not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him; and he cannot know them, because they are spiritually judged’ (1 Cor2:14).” The “natural” man is one who does not have the Holy Spirit residing within him. As Jesus said, “Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit” (John 3:6).
 

GraceAndTruth

Well-known member
Sep 28, 2015
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claims of esoteric knowledge by folks who get "messages"........avoid them like the plague...everything we need to know, God has revealed to us in the scriptures.
 

Athanasius377

Active member
Aug 20, 2020
207
86
28
Northern Kentucky
The word of our one Holy Father sola scriptura (all things written in the law and the prophets) is the final authority in matters of faith (the unseen eternal)

Yes, the advocate our unseen Holy Father Holy See who dwells in the believer .He works to both to will and empower us to do his good pleasure. Not the pleasures of a Pope or daysman seen.

We are to not call any man on earth father. One is our Holy Father. He alone is the infallible teacher ..

God is not a man
So who and what exactly is Jesus Christ?
 

Athanasius377

Active member
Aug 20, 2020
207
86
28
Northern Kentucky
The word of our one Holy Father sola scriptura (all things written in the law and the prophets) is the final authority in matters of faith (the unseen eternal)

Yes, the advocate our unseen Holy Father Holy See who dwells in the believer .He works to both to will and empower us to do his good pleasure. Not the pleasures of a Pope or daysman seen.

We are to not call any man on earth father. One is our Holy Father. He alone is the infallible teacher ..

God is not a man
The problem is that the passage referred to Jesus by name. I would agree that it is a Trinitarian passage. Job 9 is looking forward in time to Christ. Your whole hermeneutic is backwards and upside down. Jesus is on every page in the OT. And if you miss that fact you will land in theism at worst or Unitarianism at best. This is how the historical church has read scripture. It’s consistent everywhere because it’s true.
 
Aug 14, 2019
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No they not make any law, they preach the same gospel from Jesus.
How do you know? Lots of folks say that. Lots of different Gospels preached by them folks too. Authority requires someone to wield it.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
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How do you know? Lots of folks say that. Lots of different Gospels preached by them folks too. Authority requires someone to wield it.
Holy Spirit is the authority holder. Not pope. What happen in the history if catholic install pope as a law maker, killing, cheating, sale indulgence and more criminal act
 
Aug 14, 2019
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Holy Spirit is the authority holder
Nope. If He were there would be one faith among you. You could consult with Him and be one communion. Another thing is the Holy Spirit isn't going to give universal truth to those that it doesn't belong. He gives particular truth to individuals and universal truth to His Church. The Holy Spirit will guide only one Church to All Truth. Is that happening to your denomination?