Even if we can't lose salvation, we CAN LOSE entrance/position in the Kingdom of God? (And what is the Gospel of Christ vs the Gospel of God)?

[TheWaytoGo]

1) Paul said he became all things to all people, that by all means he might save some. But he also said, that even after all he did, he could find himself disqualified. Disqualified from what? Salvation? What is it that Paul, in the end, thought he might not be qualified for? Is Paul referring to the Kingdom of God?

1Co 9:27 But I discipline my body and keep it under control, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified. ​

2) What is the Kingdom of God? Rich men will enter it with much difficulty, surely that doesn't mean rich men can't receive salvation. (Or does it, because the previous verse says rich men will enter the "kingdom of heaven" with much difficulty).

Does the kingdom of heaven mean salvation and the Kingdom of God is another destination altogether?

Mat 19:23 And Jesus said to his disciples, “Truly, I say to you, only with difficulty will a rich person enter the kingdom of heaven.​

​

Mat 19:24 Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the kingdom of God.” ​

Mat_6:33 But seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.​

​

Mat_12:28 But if it is by the Spirit of God that I cast out demons, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.​

​

Mat_21:31 Which of the two did the will of his father?” They said, “The first.” Jesus said to them, “Truly, I say to you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes go into the kingdom of God before you.​

​

Mar_1:15 and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel.”​

​

Mar_9:1 And he said to them, “Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death until they see the kingdom of God after it has come with power.”​

​

Mar_9:47 And if your eye causes you to sin, tear it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than with two eyes to be thrown into hell,​

3) What is the difference between the Gospel of Christ and the Gospel of God?

Rom_15:19 by the power of signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God—so that from Jerusalem and all the way around to Illyricum I have fulfilled the ministry of the gospel of Christ;​

​

1Co_9:12 If others share this rightful claim on you, do not we even more? Nevertheless, we have not made use of this right, but we endure anything rather than put an obstacle in the way of the gospel of Christ.​

​

Gal_1:7 not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ.​

​

Php_1:27 Only let your manner of life be worthy of the gospel of Christ, so that whether I come and see you or am absent, I may hear of you that you are standing firm in one spirit, with one mind striving side by side for the faith of the gospel,​

​

​

Mar_1:14 Now after John was arrested, Jesus came into Galilee, proclaiming the gospel of God,​

​

Rom_1:1 Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus, called to be an apostle, set apart for the gospel of God,​

1Th_2:8 So, being affectionately desirous of you, we were ready to share with you not only the gospel of God but also our own selves, because you had become very dear to us.​

​

1Pe_4:17 For it is time for judgment to begin at the household of God; and if it begins with us, what will be the outcome for those who do not obey the gospel of God?​

I've just discovered a former Moody Bible Institute professor's (Charles Cooper), series on the Gospel of God, the Gospel of Christ, and the Kingdom of God as expressed by Christ and the epistles. Cooper believes knowing the difference between the three is essential to the Christian walk and understanding of eternity.

I don't have a clear understanding of the difference, or similarities, of the two gospels and exactly what the kingdom of God is that we should be striving to enter, or how it applies to us, the Church. So, I am interested in your studies and thoughts.

 

[Tararose]

1) Paul said he became all things to all people, that by all means he might save some. But he also said, that even after all he did, he could find himself disqualified. Disqualified from what? Salvation? What is it that Paul, in the end, thought he might not be qualified for? Is Paul referring to the Kingdom of God?

1Co 9:27 But I discipline my body and keep it under control, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified. ​

2) What is the Kingdom of God? Rich men will enter it with much difficulty, surely that doesn't mean rich men can't receive salvation. (Or does it, because the previous verse says rich men will enter the "kingdom of heaven" with much difficulty).

Does the kingdom of heaven mean salvation and the Kingdom of God is another destination altogether?

Mat 19:23 And Jesus said to his disciples, “Truly, I say to you, only with difficulty will a rich person enter the kingdom of heaven.​

​

Mat 19:24 Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the kingdom of God.” ​

Mat_6:33 But seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.​

​

Mat_12:28 But if it is by the Spirit of God that I cast out demons, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.​

​

Mat_21:31 Which of the two did the will of his father?” They said, “The first.” Jesus said to them, “Truly, I say to you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes go into the kingdom of God before you.​

​

Mar_1:15 and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel.”​

​

Mar_9:1 And he said to them, “Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death until they see the kingdom of God after it has come with power.”​

​

Mar_9:47 And if your eye causes you to sin, tear it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than with two eyes to be thrown into hell,​

3) What is the difference between the Gospel of Christ and the Gospel of God?

Rom_15:19 by the power of signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God—so that from Jerusalem and all the way around to Illyricum I have fulfilled the ministry of the gospel of Christ;​

​

1Co_9:12 If others share this rightful claim on you, do not we even more? Nevertheless, we have not made use of this right, but we endure anything rather than put an obstacle in the way of the gospel of Christ.​

​

Gal_1:7 not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ.​

​

Php_1:27 Only let your manner of life be worthy of the gospel of Christ, so that whether I come and see you or am absent, I may hear of you that you are standing firm in one spirit, with one mind striving side by side for the faith of the gospel,​

​

​

Mar_1:14 Now after John was arrested, Jesus came into Galilee, proclaiming the gospel of God,​

​

Rom_1:1 Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus, called to be an apostle, set apart for the gospel of God,​

1Th_2:8 So, being affectionately desirous of you, we were ready to share with you not only the gospel of God but also our own selves, because you had become very dear to us.​

​

1Pe_4:17 For it is time for judgment to begin at the household of God; and if it begins with us, what will be the outcome for those who do not obey the gospel of God?​

I've just discovered a former Moody Bible Institute professor's (Charles Cooper), series on the Gospel of God, the Gospel of Christ, and the Kingdom of God as expressed by Christ and the epistles. Cooper believes knowing the difference between the three is essential to the Christian walk and understanding of eternity.

I don't have a clear understanding of the difference, or similarities, of the two gospels and exactly what the kingdom of God is that we should be striving to enter, or how it applies to us, the Church. So, I am interested in your studies and thoughts.

A gospel - simply relates to good news or message. Christ and God are one and the same, though there is a sense in which the gospel is given in two distinct ways to jews and non-jews, simply because you cannot preach to non-jews about the promises God gave to them through Moses, or about their slavery in Egypt, or about Christ being their replacement passover and their replacement covenant etc as they didn't have the history or forefathers or promises or law or prophecy that the jews had prior to Chris coming in the flesh.

The good news of God is the 'gospel of Christ" and "the good news of Christ is the "gospel of God" it is the good news from God about Christ. It is the same as saying the good news from the royal family, or the good news from the queen.
It is the same good news for everyone - just presented in "familiar terms" that they related to if you like.

The difference in the way it is presented might be due to the speakers roots or the audiences primary roots etc. But in essence it always comes to the point, salvation is through Jesus alone.


The kingdom (greek is -Basileia) is where the King (greek is - Basileou) reigns (also from the greek root - Basileou). His Royal (Basileios) "King's court" (also -Basileios).

Gods Kingdom is simply where He is king of the domain. It is kind of like saying London Palace, or the Queen's Palace.
When Christ came and said the kingdom is within and that we must be born again to enter it, He was speaking of an eternal spiritual domain that is within us, for as believers we hide and abide in God/Christ, who has come to sup with us but he indwelling of his Holy Spirit, and to make his abode with us when we trust in Him and are saved by grace through faith in Christ. For it is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives IN me....

To think of it simply, Where-ever God dwells, is the kingdom of God, and by default is a piece of heaven in a sense.
Our entering the kingdom starts here on earth at the point of believing and spiritual rebirth, and simply continues on when we leave our mortal coil and are transferred to the realm which we know simply as heaven.

These are my thoughts, I hope they are of some help. Sometimes we make things very complicated, when Christ spoke in stories a child could understand for a reason, and uses the simple things to confound the wisdom of the wise. I love to study the word, but really, it is the simplicity of the gospel that is despised, but which ultimately is the power of God that saves. I don't know what teaching you have heard, but I think maybe there has been some over complicating by the teacher on these matters.

I could be wrong, I often am

 

[Tararose]

As for Paul, He spoke about....
1 Corinthians 6:12,13
All things are lawful unto me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any...


I think he had to be doubly sure not to be a hypocrite. His was a ministry appointed by God for the promotion of the gosepl and the salvations of, and the basis of the teachings for, the gentile believers in the church.

He had to be careful most of all not to become prideful about his Hebrew roots, his knowledge of the law and all things pertaining to it and so on. He knew not being under law meant he had to show you could, by the power of the Holy Spirit, be free from the POWER of sin. He was doubly hard on his flesh to avoid any lax attitude he might have developed whilst embracing the newfound freedoms of a jew - resting wholly on grace rather than observance to the law suddenly.

He did not want to miss out on that freedom from the power of sin - the slavery to sin that Christ had saved him from - that he was sharing with others, through complacency and trusting in his position etc.

again just my thoughts. be glad to hear others and yours too.

I do like D L Moody for the record

 

[Guojing]

1) Paul said he became all things to all people, that by all means he might save some. But he also said, that even after all he did, he could find himself disqualified. Disqualified from what? Salvation? What is it that Paul, in the end, thought he might not be qualified for? Is Paul referring to the Kingdom of God?

1Co 9:27 But I discipline my body and keep it under control, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified. ​

2) What is the Kingdom of God? Rich men will enter it with much difficulty, surely that doesn't mean rich men can't receive salvation. (Or does it, because the previous verse says rich men will enter the "kingdom of heaven" with much difficulty).

Does the kingdom of heaven mean salvation and the Kingdom of God is another destination altogether?

Mat 19:23 And Jesus said to his disciples, “Truly, I say to you, only with difficulty will a rich person enter the kingdom of heaven.​

​

Mat 19:24 Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the kingdom of God.” ​

Mat_6:33 But seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.​

​

Mat_12:28 But if it is by the Spirit of God that I cast out demons, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.​

​

Mat_21:31 Which of the two did the will of his father?” They said, “The first.” Jesus said to them, “Truly, I say to you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes go into the kingdom of God before you.​

​

Mar_1:15 and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel.”​

​

Mar_9:1 And he said to them, “Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death until they see the kingdom of God after it has come with power.”​

​

Mar_9:47 And if your eye causes you to sin, tear it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than with two eyes to be thrown into hell,​

3) What is the difference between the Gospel of Christ and the Gospel of God?

Rom_15:19 by the power of signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God—so that from Jerusalem and all the way around to Illyricum I have fulfilled the ministry of the gospel of Christ;​

​

1Co_9:12 If others share this rightful claim on you, do not we even more? Nevertheless, we have not made use of this right, but we endure anything rather than put an obstacle in the way of the gospel of Christ.​

​

Gal_1:7 not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ.​

​

Php_1:27 Only let your manner of life be worthy of the gospel of Christ, so that whether I come and see you or am absent, I may hear of you that you are standing firm in one spirit, with one mind striving side by side for the faith of the gospel,​

​

​

Mar_1:14 Now after John was arrested, Jesus came into Galilee, proclaiming the gospel of God,​

​

Rom_1:1 Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus, called to be an apostle, set apart for the gospel of God,​

1Th_2:8 So, being affectionately desirous of you, we were ready to share with you not only the gospel of God but also our own selves, because you had become very dear to us.​

​

1Pe_4:17 For it is time for judgment to begin at the household of God; and if it begins with us, what will be the outcome for those who do not obey the gospel of God?​

I've just discovered a former Moody Bible Institute professor's (Charles Cooper), series on the Gospel of God, the Gospel of Christ, and the Kingdom of God as expressed by Christ and the epistles. Cooper believes knowing the difference between the three is essential to the Christian walk and understanding of eternity.

I don't have a clear understanding of the difference, or similarities, of the two gospels and exactly what the kingdom of God is that we should be striving to enter, or how it applies to us, the Church. So, I am interested in your studies and thoughts.

You may find this link useful

https://forwhatsaiththescriptures.org/2015/06/24/kingdom-of-god-kingdom-of-heaven/

 

[TheWaytoGo]

You may find this link useful

https://forwhatsaiththescriptures.org/2015/06/24/kingdom-of-god-kingdom-of-heaven/

Thank you.

 

[Blik]

1Co 9:27 But I discipline my body and keep it under control, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified. .​

Paul is telling us that although he had been saved through the forgiveness of his sin through Christ, it was a living force in his life and he was given the ability to take it back, to put these forgiven sins back into what he wanted of life.​

 

[TheWaytoGo]

Paul is telling us that although he had been saved through the forgiveness of his sin through Christ, it was a living force in his life and he was given the ability to take it back, to put these forgiven sins back into what he wanted of life.​

I don't understand what you mean. Can you clarify?

 

[Tararose]

Romans 14:17
For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.

Luke 17 v 21 Neither shall they say, See here! or, see there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

 

[Blik]

I don't understand what you mean. Can you clarify?

Paul tells us that without discipline we can lose salvation. That discipline is to use our will to not sin, to delight in what Christ has given us: to be sin free. We can decide against this, and lose the righteousness that the Lord as gifted us with.

 

[OneFaith]

1) Paul said he became all things to all people, that by all means he might save some. But he also said, that even after all he did, he could find himself disqualified. Disqualified from what? Salvation? What is it that Paul, in the end, thought he might not be qualified for? Is Paul referring to the Kingdom of God?

1Co 9:27 But I discipline my body and keep it under control, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified. ​

2) What is the Kingdom of God? Rich men will enter it with much difficulty, surely that doesn't mean rich men can't receive salvation. (Or does it, because the previous verse says rich men will enter the "kingdom of heaven" with much difficulty).

Does the kingdom of heaven mean salvation and the Kingdom of God is another destination altogether?

Mat 19:23 And Jesus said to his disciples, “Truly, I say to you, only with difficulty will a rich person enter the kingdom of heaven.​

​

Mat 19:24 Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the kingdom of God.” ​

Mat_6:33 But seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.​

​

Mat_12:28 But if it is by the Spirit of God that I cast out demons, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.​

​

Mat_21:31 Which of the two did the will of his father?” They said, “The first.” Jesus said to them, “Truly, I say to you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes go into the kingdom of God before you.​

​

Mar_1:15 and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel.”​

​

Mar_9:1 And he said to them, “Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death until they see the kingdom of God after it has come with power.”​

​

Mar_9:47 And if your eye causes you to sin, tear it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than with two eyes to be thrown into hell,​

3) What is the difference between the Gospel of Christ and the Gospel of God?

Rom_15:19 by the power of signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God—so that from Jerusalem and all the way around to Illyricum I have fulfilled the ministry of the gospel of Christ;​

​

1Co_9:12 If others share this rightful claim on you, do not we even more? Nevertheless, we have not made use of this right, but we endure anything rather than put an obstacle in the way of the gospel of Christ.​

​

Gal_1:7 not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ.​

​

Php_1:27 Only let your manner of life be worthy of the gospel of Christ, so that whether I come and see you or am absent, I may hear of you that you are standing firm in one spirit, with one mind striving side by side for the faith of the gospel,​

​

​

Mar_1:14 Now after John was arrested, Jesus came into Galilee, proclaiming the gospel of God,​

​

Rom_1:1 Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus, called to be an apostle, set apart for the gospel of God,​

1Th_2:8 So, being affectionately desirous of you, we were ready to share with you not only the gospel of God but also our own selves, because you had become very dear to us.​

​

1Pe_4:17 For it is time for judgment to begin at the household of God; and if it begins with us, what will be the outcome for those who do not obey the gospel of God?​

I've just discovered a former Moody Bible Institute professor's (Charles Cooper), series on the Gospel of God, the Gospel of Christ, and the Kingdom of God as expressed by Christ and the epistles. Cooper believes knowing the difference between the three is essential to the Christian walk and understanding of eternity.

I don't have a clear understanding of the difference, or similarities, of the two gospels and exactly what the kingdom of God is that we should be striving to enter, or how it applies to us, the Church. So, I am interested in your studies and thoughts.[/


DISCLAIMER: I have respect for every single person here. I hope that we can agree, or at least agree to disagree. Never take anything I say as angry, because I am here to love and share biblical truth as I see it. I respect everyone’s God-given right to freewill thought and decision. I will open-mindedly consider what you have to say, and hope that you will do the same for me…

The gospel is the good news of the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ and how that saves us.

Can we lose salvation? Yes- Jesus will never leave us, but we can choose to leave Him. This is why Paul said he has to be careful not to get disqualified.

 

[oyster67]

Even if we can't lose salvation, we CAN LOSE entrance/position in the Kingdom of God?

Correct. God promises to never leave us or forsake us, but He wills not block the door if we decide to leave and forsake Him. You can marry a lady and be faithful and true, but if you love her, you will not bind her in chains to keep her from leaving. She does not lose your love, but she will spend eternity elsewhere if she never comes back.

Matthew
23:37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, [thou] that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under [her] wings, and ye would not!
23:38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

One cannot lose salvation, but they can discard it. One cannot be forsaken by God, but they can forsake Him.

 

[phil36]

Even if we can't lose salvation, we CAN LOSE entrance/position in the Kingdom of God? (And what is the Gospel of Christ vs the Gospel of God)?

If you can't lose your salvation, then you can't lose your entrance into the Kingdom of God (if saved your already in God's Kingdom). If you believe you can lose your salvation then the opposite is true - you lose entrance.

The Gospel of Christ is the Gospel of God two different ways of saying the same thing. Jesus is God!

 

[Blik]

Humans can change their mind. Those who believe you cannot lose salvation deny this. They are saying that we can't trust heaven to be a house of mansions, for it would include the people who were once saved, but changed their minds and became people who live in sin. Salvation means that we are forgiven sins and accept the righteousness of
Christ in their life. They are still sinners, but they are not people who love righteousness.