Did the Church institute Dec 25th to replace Pagan Festivals with a Christian Theme?

[calibob]

me, redefining a word?
Hardly.
Homosexual was around before I was.
Of course gay means happy.
It can also be someone's name.

No, of course not you personally. As politics are becoming more cult like I keep being reminded of the ways words were twisted by the government in Orwell's book 1984. So I downloaded Kingdom of the Cults by Dr. Walter Martin and have been scanning the techniques used to normalize cult speak in order to twist the minds of, for lack of better terms, victims or consumers that get sucked into fringe groups. It's been going on seemingly forever. However the fringe groups are gaining traction, playing the part of victims and getting enough attention to make them seem to be legitimate. Many people think that LDS are Christians and the KKK are patriots. Homosexuality is now considered normal by the mainstream and abortion is acceptable.

We're 'religious fanatic's' for opposing the new definitions of normal in this bastardized society. I wasn't criticizing you but simply bringing more of the illegitimate tactics to light. I even doubt that the folks who stormed the capitol realized that they were participating in a group form of anarchy.

 

[Blik]

You would say they are irrelevant, however, I will tell you the word Holiday is not in the Bible Did you know that? the word is secular because those who are not Christians did not like the term " Holy Day". To try and make yourself right you interject words you don't even know are not Biblical like " holiday". BUT a "Holy Day " meaning one set apart by God is very much in the word of God

IT WAS a HOLY Day when Jesus was Born. And I will prove it by the very word of God . Then you can say it is irrelevant while using secular terms to describe a day off from work.

InLuke 2:11

" For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord. "

The Angels announced it,
Isiah 9:6 prophesied it and Micah. Ther words this day in Greek that the angels spoke of in Luke chapter 2:11 is not only of that day but also that night. The Angels proclaimed the birth of the Savior of the world, not a small thing had to happen. This day was set apart from other days because it was Holy unto the Lord. God and the angels treated it as such, but you know better.

" This day " was spoken by God Himself in Genesis and prophesied by the man of God 700 years before and fulfilled o this day and the angel even testified of IT. Yes, that day was indeed holy set apart. Now because we do not know of that day or when it was,

WE celebrate and honor the event that happened on that day which is praiseworthy and edifying and a historical event that actually happened, the Savior was born.

You make very reasonable thinking about this, but I still think the bottom line is that God suggested we celebrate his plan of our salvation in a certain way and men decided to celebrate it in another. That is just simple fact, and many conclusions have been drawn from lots of things, even the meaning of the word holiday.

If the day of the birth of Christ is declared Holy, that is not put into scripture that I can recall. Did you find it there? It was the day Christ rose that was made Holy.

I think one of the best conclusions that has been brought out about this change in celebrations or anything you want to call it is that God made the celebration of His birth as a man into something good for those who love Him, as God said He would. Good will, charity, joy, for example. The negative of that is the negatives of this holiday like suicides increase because it reminds them of family and many have lost family and many overspend for Christmas.

 

[Blackpowderduelist]

So there is scripture about this very thing. According to this passage one may esteem or keep a day or not keep it. Judging the other for doing so is sin.

As for the one who is weak in faith, welcome him, but not to quarrel over opinions. One person believes he may eat anything, while the weak person eats only vegetables. Let not the one who eats despise the one who abstains, and let not the one who abstains pass judgment on the one who eats, for God has welcomed him. Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. And he will be upheld, for the Lord is able to make him stand. One person esteems one day as better than another, while another esteems all days alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it in honor of the Lord. The one who eats, eats in honor of the Lord, since he gives thanks to God, while the one who abstains, abstains in honor of the Lord and gives thanks to God. For none of us lives to himself, and none of us dies to himself. For if we live, we live to the Lord, and if we die, we die to the Lord. So then, whether we live or whether we die, we are the Lord’s.
Romans 14:1‭-‬8 ESV

So we celebrate Christmas unto Christ, you don't celebrate it unto Christ. There really is nothing left to be said about it.

 

[calibob]

You make very reasonable thinking about this, but I still think the bottom line is that God suggested we celebrate his plan of our salvation in a certain way and men decided to celebrate it in another. That is just simple fact, and many conclusions have been drawn from lots of things, even the meaning of the word holiday.

If the day of the birth of Christ is declared Holy, that is not put into scripture that I can recall. Did you find it there? It was the day Christ rose that was made Holy.

I think one of the best conclusions that has been brought out about this change in celebrations or anything you want to call it is that God made the celebration of His birth as a man into something good for those who love Him, as God said He would. Good will, charity, joy, for example. The negative of that is the negatives of this holiday like suicides increase because it reminds them of family and many have lost family and many overspend for Christmas.

So there is scripture about this very thing. According to this passage one may esteem or keep a day or not keep it. Judging the other for doing so is sin.

As for the one who is weak in faith, welcome him, but not to quarrel over opinions. One person believes he may eat anything, while the weak person eats only vegetables. Let not the one who eats despise the one who abstains, and let not the one who abstains pass judgment on the one who eats, for God has welcomed him. Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. And he will be upheld, for the Lord is able to make him stand. One person esteems one day as better than another, while another esteems all days alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it in honor of the Lord. The one who eats, eats in honor of the Lord, since he gives thanks to God, while the one who abstains, abstains in honor of the Lord and gives thanks to God. For none of us lives to himself, and none of us dies to himself. For if we live, we live to the Lord, and if we die, we die to the Lord. So then, whether we live or whether we die, we are the Lord’s.
Romans 14:1‭-‬8 ESV

So we celebrate Christmas unto Christ, you don't celebrate it unto Christ. There really is nothing left to be said about it.

Now Black powder said almost the same thing that I was about to. However not to esteem one day as being more or less sacred than the other as heathens do. Or something like that.

Every day someone is saved by Jesus. Everyday his blood atones for someone's' sins. What could be more holy or sacred than that? Is not every day Holy and Sacred now?

 

[Blackpowderduelist]

Now Black powder said almost the same thing that I was about to. However not to esteem one day as being more or less sacred than the other as heathens do. Or something like that.

Every day someone is saved by Jesus. Everyday his blood atones for someone's' sins. What could be more holy or sacred than that? Is not every day Holy and Sacred now?

I wish I could remember the day I was baptized. I would celebrate that each year as opposed to the day I was born into this world.

 

[CS1]

You make very reasonable thinking about this, but I still think the bottom line is that God suggested we celebrate his plan of our salvation in a certain way and men decided to celebrate it in another. That is just simple fact, and many conclusions have been drawn from lots of things, even the meaning of the word holiday.

If the day of the birth of Christ is declared Holy, that is not put into scripture that I can recall. Did you find it there? It was the day Christ rose that was made Holy.

I think one of the best conclusions that has been brought out about this change in celebrations or anything you want to call it is that God made the celebration of His birth as a man into something good for those who love Him, as God said He would. Good will, charity, joy, for example. The negative of that is the negatives of this holiday like suicides increase because it reminds them of family and many have lost family and many overspend for Christmas.

THAT IS YOUR OPINON and you are entitled to it, however, the idea that honoring the birth of Christ is unbiblical just simply not true.

And that too is a myth that suicides increase during Christmas. The Superbowl has more people killing themselves historically than Christmas. Athiest push that false narrative for years and was debunked a long time ago. Sad that professing Christians ill-informed make such accusations just because they want to be right with a legalistic approach to celebrating the birth of Christ. Please try to use facts and truth instead of legalism You can research and read : https://www.winchesterhospital.org/health-library/article?id=156980

 

[calibob]

I wish I could remember the day I was baptized. I would celebrate that each year as opposed to the day I was born into this world.

Amen. In fact the very first group of hardcore, real, nondenominational Christians that I became associated with were too poor to have a church building. I met them in a park. They/we took up a collection to rent a public school auditorium `and invited some Calvary Chapel missionaries to come and share their experiences on the day before Pentacost, 1977. I was baptized in a public lagoon a couple of weeks later. I think that we should remember the resurrection of Christ everyday. not just once a week, month or year.

 

[Lisamn]

I wish I could remember the day I was baptized. I would celebrate that each year as opposed to the day I was born into this world.

Psalms‬ ‭139:13-18‬ ‭
For You formed my inward parts; You wove me in my mother’s womb. I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; Wonderful are Your works, And my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from You, When I was made in secret, And skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth; Your eyes have seen my unformed substance; And in Your book were all written The days that were ordained for me, When as yet there was not one of them. How precious also are Your thoughts to me, O God! How vast is the sum of them! If I should count them, they would outnumber the sand. When I awake, I am still with You.
‭‭​

 

[Blackpowderduelist]

Psalms‬ ‭139:13-18‬ ‭
For You formed my inward parts; You wove me in my mother’s womb. I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; Wonderful are Your works, And my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from You, When I was made in secret, And skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth; Your eyes have seen my unformed substance; And in Your book were all written The days that were ordained for me, When as yet there was not one of them. How precious also are Your thoughts to me, O God! How vast is the sum of them! If I should count them, they would outnumber the sand. When I awake, I am still with You.
‭‭​

What's your point?

 

[Lisamn]

What's your point?

It’s not a bad thing to celebrate the day you were born....God said you were fearfully and wonderfully made.

 

[Blik]

THAT IS YOUR OPINON and you are entitled to it, however, the idea that honoring the birth of Christ is unbiblical just simply not true.

And that too is a myth that suicides increase during Christmas. The Superbowl has more people killing themselves historically than Christmas. Athiest push that false narrative for years and was debunked a long time ago. Sad that professing Christians ill-informed make such accusations just because they want to be right with a legalistic approach to celebrating the birth of Christ. Please try to use facts and truth instead of legalism You can research and read : https://www.winchesterhospital.org/health-library/article?id=156980

I certainly did not personally find the people who commit suicide. I know Christmas for me is terrible because everyone but me has family, it reminds me I am alone except for my Lord.

But I really think your idea of Christmas being so biblical is not quite correct. The word Christmas isn't in scripture. You certainly cannot say that celebrating the salvation we have with feasting isn't biblical . It is well established that Christ was not born in December. You can, though say it has been made into a wonderful time and brings some people thoughts of the Lord who otherwise don't think of God as part of their life, even though some people think of it as a secular holiday.

I lived in an apartment for awhile that was government supplemented. The manager of this unit issued an order one Christmas that we could not send religious Christmas cards to each other.

 

[Blackpowderduelist]

It’s not a bad thing to celebrate the day you were born....God said you were fearfully and wonderfully made.

Cool

 

[CS1]

I certainly did not personally find the people who commit suicide. I know Christmas for me is terrible because everyone but me has family, it reminds me I am alone except for my Lord.

But I really think your idea of Christmas being so biblical is not quite correct. The word Christmas isn't in scripture. You certainly cannot say that celebrating the salvation we have with feasting isn't biblical . It is well established that Christ was not born in December. You can, though say it has been made into a wonderful time and brings some people thoughts of the Lord who otherwise don't think of God as part of their life, even though some people think of it as a secular holiday.

I lived in an apartment for awhile that was government supplemented. The manager of this unit issued an order one Christmas that we could not send religious Christmas cards to each other.

you have a bias about Christmas formulated by your negative experience. That doesn't make the event evil. nor does it make it ungodly.

I am very sorry to hear of your feeling of loneliness during the time of Christmas. I would not lambast you but encourage you to know your God has never left you nor forsaken you. You all have those here too. There is something you can do. Maybe reach out to your local church and seek other events. We are not hermits we are not isolationists either. I would be honored to pray for you and send you a Christmas card and even a gift in the name of the Lord. You can PM me if you would like to be remembered by the CS1 family and family Christian center here in California. It is not my idea of Christmas it is what I was shown over my short 54 years. Again everything that is a godly action done by those who are Christians was not recorded in the Bible. Yet we can discern them to be praiseworthy and edifying. Not authoritative or binding. The Nicene Creed is not the word of God but it is biblical.

 

[Lanolin]

I had this thing sometimes where I go to people's birthday parties, or if they don't have them, remembering to wish them happy birthday, or send a card, or msg, though sometimes I forget, but I might give them a gift another day, and say its for their birthday, (even if it isn't the day) which basically means I'm happy they are alive.

People that don't have birthdays or even birth certificates (yes, some people don't) just miss out on being celebrated, which is a bit sad. I think children and babies being born do need to be celebrated, even if only by their own parents.

When Jesus was born, he was presented to the temple, Mary had her purification ritual and Jesus got circumcised on the 8th day. I would say that was very important in Jewish/Hebrew culture to do that. Anna and Simeon were actually waiting for Jesus birth because they knew the prophecies, and celebrated with them.

The tradition of lighting candles on a cake I wouldn't say was pagan, in Jewish culture candles/lamps were important...God had insituted it in the temple with the menorah. God had appointed special feasts etc.

People shouldn't feel guilty though for not remembering or forgetting a birthday.
Just as people shouldn't feel disgruntled because someone else is celebrating. If you weren't invited tho thats no reason to pack a sad. It's always someone's birthday somewhere. Do something nice for someone else.

 

[UCA4J]

No, of course not you personally. As politics are becoming more cult like I keep being reminded of the ways words were twisted by the government in Orwell's book 1984. So I downloaded Kingdom of the Cults by Dr. Walter Martin and have been scanning the techniques used to normalize cult speak in order to twist the minds of, for lack of better terms, victims or consumers that get sucked into fringe groups. It's been going on seemingly forever. However the fringe groups are gaining traction, playing the part of victims and getting enough attention to make them seem to be legitimate. Many people think that LDS are Christians and the KKK are patriots. Homosexuality is now considered normal by the mainstream and abortion is acceptable.

We're 'religious fanatic's' for opposing the new definitions of normal in this bastardized society. I wasn't criticizing you but simply bringing more of the illegitimate tactics to light. I even doubt that the folks who stormed the capitol realized that they were participating in a group form of anarchy.

yeah ok.

 

[Blik]

you have a bias about Christmas formulated by your negative experience. That doesn't make the event evil. nor does it make it ungodly.

I am very sorry to hear of your feeling of loneliness during the time of Christmas. I would not lambast you but encourage you to know your God has never left you nor forsaken you. You all have those here too. There is something you can do. Maybe reach out to your local church and seek other events. We are not hermits we are not isolationists either. I would be honored to pray for you and send you a Christmas card and even a gift in the name of the Lord. You can PM me if you would like to be remembered by the CS1 family and family Christian center here in California. It is not my idea of Christmas it is what I was shown over my short 54 years. Again everything that is a godly action done by those who are Christians was not recorded in the Bible. Yet we can discern them to be praiseworthy and edifying. Not authoritative or binding. The Nicene Creed is not the word of God but it is biblical.

I didn't say it was ungodly because it is something men decided on not God. Honestly, I am not bias against Christmas. There are many good things about Christmas. What I think about it is summed up with knowing that God suggested a way of celebrating, and men preferred their own way.

We are Christians living in a world where our churches choose the man's way of celebrating, and the world follows that. If I had my own way they would choose the way God outlined it for them, I feel sure it would be better. God always knows best. But I'm with you as far as that if I had a family I would celebrate Christmas, and not the feasts because I would be alone, then. I enjoyed Christmas when I had a family.