Sins cannot be charged!

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
Thats the elect world, theres a world that doesnt have its sins charged to it 2 Cor 5:19 and a world that does 1 Cor 11:32, cant be the same world, sorry !
If you read in the news paper in the context of vaccines. That all living humans were going to be offered the vaccine and it read : This vaccine we recieved here at news weekly is Not for us only but for the whole world..Is there anyone left out of that ? Wouldn't every normal person understand that ?
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
Thats the elect world, theres a world that doesnt have its sins charged to it 2 Cor 5:19 and a world that does 1 Cor 11:32, cant be the same world, sorry !
Which verse says ' elect world ' please? I assume you use a translation im not familiar with perhaps?
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
Same reason why it doesnt say its not the elect world. You have a world that has its sins charged to it 1 Cor 11:32 and a world that doesnt have its sins charged to it 2 Cor 5:19 Cant be the same world.
No normal person writes like this . Weve crossed over into terrible hermanutics here . If it said 'He only died for those he elected to be saved 'you might have something. But you're believing something that the bible doesn't say .
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
You never want to get into what ' the bible doesn't say ' . " The bible doesn't say we can't pray to Mary " ( says the Catholic) The Bible DOESN'T say many things . It doesn't say Jesus wasnt a champion figure skater. Ect .
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
He died for His Body, which is One with Him Eph 5:23-25,30-32


23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.
24 Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.
25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.
31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.
32 This is a great mystery:
but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

So if Jesus Christ is Elect, His Body is also, for the Head and Body are One !
This is called the ' negative inference fallacy ' This is specifically talking about the church. Paul is addressing the church ( the body ) This is doctrine for the church. This does not take away what else Jesus did. He died for the sins of all those pork abstaining , sabbath observing temple sacrificing ones under the first covenant also . Before there ever was a ' church ' ( the body ) . Israel is not the Church . He died for Moses sins . He is not part of the body of Christ . Moses was not baptised by the Holy Spirit into the ' church ' ( Jew / gentile body of believers) The ' one body ' Paul is speaking of here was a mystery not known in the OT .
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Nov 21, 2020
6,358
563
113
If You just let the verse read as it is without adding ' world of elect ' what does it say ?
But it is the world of the Elect, it needs to be emphasized. Thats the world that God doesnt impute sin 2 Cor 5:19
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Nov 21, 2020
6,358
563
113
If you read in the news paper in the context of vaccines. That all living humans were going to be offered the vaccine and it read : This vaccine we recieved here at news weekly is Not for us only but for the whole world..Is there anyone left out of that ? Wouldn't every normal person understand that ?
Invalid comment.
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Nov 21, 2020
6,358
563
113
No normal person writes like this . Weve crossed over into terrible hermanutics here . If it said 'He only died for those he elected to be saved 'you might have something. But you're believing something that the bible doesn't say .
There are two worlds, one which sin isnt imputed to it 2 Cor 5:19 and one that sin is charged to it 1 Cor 11:32.
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Nov 21, 2020
6,358
563
113
This is called the ' negative inference fallacy ' This is specifically talking about the church. Paul is addressing the church ( the body ) This is doctrine for the church. This does not take away what else Jesus did. He died for the sins of all those pork abstaining , sabbath observing temple sacrificing ones under the first covenant also . Before there ever was a ' church ' ( the body ) . Israel is not the Church . He died for Moses sins . He is not part of the body of Christ . Moses was not baptised by the Holy Spirit into the ' church ' ( Jew / gentile body of believers) The ' one body ' Paul is speaking of here was a mystery not known in the OT .
So Christ died for His Body the Church. He is the Elect Head, it is the Elect Body. Just like Adam was the Head of Eve, she was in him before she was manifested, so likewise, members of Christ Body were in Him before they become manifested. He died for them, and their sins arent charged to them
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
But it is the world of the Elect, it needs to be emphasized. Thats the world that God doesnt impute sin 2 Cor 5:19
Eisegesis
Eisegesis is the process of interpreting text in such a way as to introduce one's own presuppositions, agendas or biases. It is commonly referred to as reading into the text. It is often done to "prove" a pre-held point of concern, and to provide confirmation bias corresponding with the pre-held interpretation and any agendas supported by it. Eisegesis is best understood when contrasted with exegesis. Exegesis is drawing out text's meaning in accordance with the author's context and discoverable meaning. Eisegesis is when a reader imposes their interpretation of the text. Thus exegesis tends to be objective; and eisegesis, highly subjective.
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Nov 21, 2020
6,358
563
113
Eisegesis
Eisegesis is the process of interpreting text in such a way as to introduce one's own presuppositions, agendas or biases. It is commonly referred to as reading into the text. It is often done to "prove" a pre-held point of concern, and to provide confirmation bias corresponding with the pre-held interpretation and any agendas supported by it. Eisegesis is best understood when contrasted with exegesis. Exegesis is drawing out text's meaning in accordance with the author's context and discoverable meaning. Eisegesis is when a reader imposes their interpretation of the text. Thus exegesis tends to be objective; and eisegesis, highly subjective.
Its telling the Truth. Its the world of the Elect. Theres a world God doesnt impute sin 2 Cor 5:19 and a world He does impute sin and condemns 1 Cor 11:32. Are they the same world ?
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
Its telling the Truth. Its the world of the Elect. Theres a world God doesnt impute sin 2 Cor 5:19 and a world He does impute sin and condemns 1 Cor 11:32. Are they the same world ?
There is only one earth . One ' world ' in the sense of ' peoples ' within the world .
9For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.

30For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

31For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.

32But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.

THE WORLD is not saved is it ? we are not born into the world saved . The world in this context is unbelievers. Not 'world of something ' v 'world of something. Its just the world in which we live . This world is under the sway of the devil . Including people who may or may not become believers . This ' world ' is not ' Gods children through birth ect . There isn't another ' world ' in which it is ever said, " oh this is the world of the elect. " No , a believer is not condemned with the world simply because he is saved . Your using daft terms and modifiers to suit doctrines. The one ' world ' has two types of people in it , saved or lost . But its still one world in which we live .
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Nov 21, 2020
6,358
563
113
There is only one earth . One ' world ' in the sense of ' peoples ' within the world .
9For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.

30For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

31For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.

32But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.

THE WORLD is not saved is it ? we are not born into the world saved . The world in this context is unbelievers. Not 'world of something ' v 'world of something. Its just the world in which we live . This world is under the sway of the devil . Including people who may or may not become believers . This ' world ' is not ' Gods children through birth ect . There isn't another ' world ' in which it is ever said, " oh this is the world of the elect. " No , a believer is not condemned with the world simply because he is saved . Your using daft terms and modifiers to suit doctrines. The one ' world ' has two types of people in it , saved or lost . But its still one world in which we live .
I didn't say there were more than one planet earth. There's more than one world in scripture. You have the world that God does not charge with sin 2 Cor 5:19 and then you have the condemned world for their sins. 1 Cor 11:32
 

Blade

Well-known member
Nov 19, 2019
1,783
624
113
"If Christ died for our sins, for He didn't die for everyone's sins," this is not written or you would have posted the verse.

Did not the sweet holy Spirit say through John "behold the lamb of God that takes away the sin of the world". What is the Good News? He died for the worlds sin. What did Christ say about the Holy Spirit?

He said the holy Spirit "And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment of sin, in regard to sin because they do not believe in Me "The only sin that can not be forgiven.

Then look.. His word has reached the WORLD! So that not one should perish for that is Gods will.. that all be saved. Did not He say that? :)
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
I didn't say there were more than one planet earth. There's more than one world in scripture. You have the world that God does not charge with sin 2 Cor 5:19 and then you have the condemned world for their sins. 1 Cor 11:32
Yes ,but you believe that when there is no verse that says this . It could have easily said what you believe ,but it doesn't. That's as far as i can go on this topic. The bible never says this , but you believe it anyway. What more can anyone say ?
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Nov 21, 2020
6,358
563
113
The Better Covenant/Testament referenced in Heb 7:22 that Christ was made Surety of is the Everlasting Covenant Heb 13:20

20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

This Covenant I believe was made with Father and Son before the World began, and The Spirit is a Witness of it.

This Covenant in time is also revealed to be the New Covenant. The Blood of the Everlasting Covenant Heb 13 and the Blood of the New Covenant Matt 26:28

28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Are the same Blood and Same Covenant, One and the same.

Christ was charged with the sins of the elect and became Surety by virtue of this Covenant, and all liability for their sins were never imputed or charged to them, what a Great Blessing ! 16c
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
The Better Covenant/Testament referenced in Heb 7:22 that Christ was made Surety of is the Everlasting Covenant Heb 13:20

20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

This Covenant I believe was made with Father and Son before the World began, and The Spirit is a Witness of it.

This Covenant in time is also revealed to be the New Covenant. The Blood of the Everlasting Covenant Heb 13 and the Blood of the New Covenant Matt 26:28

28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Are the same Blood and Same Covenant, One and the same.

Christ was charged with the sins of the elect and became Surety by virtue of this Covenant, and all liability for their sins were never imputed or charged to them, what a Great Blessing ! 16c
rom 5
6¶For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.
Everyone ! is ungodly
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
rom 5
6¶For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.
Everyone ! is ungodly
Heb 7.22
. “By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament” (vs. 22). This is a guarantee that the New Testament (“grace and truth”) is better than the Old Testament (“law”—John 7:17), and to prove it, the Old Testament ends with the word “curse” and the New Testament ends with the word “AMEN.”
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
The Better Covenant/Testament referenced in Heb 7:22 that Christ was made Surety of is the Everlasting Covenant Heb 13:20

20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

This Covenant I believe was made with Father and Son before the World began, and The Spirit is a Witness of it.

This Covenant in time is also revealed to be the New Covenant. The Blood of the Everlasting Covenant Heb 13 and the Blood of the New Covenant Matt 26:28

28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Are the same Blood and Same Covenant, One and the same.

Christ was charged with the sins of the elect and became Surety by virtue of this Covenant, and all liability for their sins were never imputed or charged to them, what a Great Blessing ! 16c
///This Covenant I believe was made with Father and Son before the World began, and The Spirit is a Witness of it.// What verses say this ?