The Babies of God

[JohanA]

Hi Oyster67,

What is the doctrine he is trying to set forth? Why not be honest and tell us straight?

Jesus didn't bring a doctrine. He just was "Himself". He just Lived his Life. Humans make doctrines because they live intellectually. And their is no Life in the intellect of dead Adam.


Mat. 15
8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me withtheir lips; but their heart is far from me.
9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

You have to stop living by the mind. You died to that. And start Living by the Spirit. Which is Free from the captivity of the mind.

Rom. 6

3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

When you Live in the Spirit you are Free.

2 Cor. 3

15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.
17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.
18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

It is your "doctrines" that is causing your Baby Existence. Because in your mind you create your divisions from your other Brothers and Sisters. And in your judgment of them you stay captive in Baby Life. Time to rise above strife. And go out and meet your Brothers and Sisters. Some will be older than you and some younger. Those older you will learn from. And those younger you will teach. It is not about your group. It is about God that is the Father of all His Children.


1 Cor. 3
1 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal,even as unto babes in Christ.
2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal?
4 For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?

 

[JohanA]

I was just noticing how accurate the thread is turning out to be regarding the strife and arguing and exposing the carnality in us in most discussions

“For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭3:3‬ ‭KJV‬‬


“Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers. And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice:

And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭4:

“Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like:

of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.


But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭5:19-26‬ ‭KJV‬‬


Important post if we look at our own selves

Good that you see this. All divisions are captured under the evil spirit of strife. Which God gave them unto. Because they didn't heed the warning not to cause divisions.

And those that want to grow has to obviously rise above this Existence. And that is where we need to go. How does one actually do this practically in the Holy Spirit? And when we start venturing on this road we will enter "Edifying".

1 Cor. 14
26 How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.


Assisting one another to be released from the captivity of that evil spirit hampering our growth. No matter what the costs physically. Because to us the most important is to grow up in the Perfection of the Word Jesus given to us. We can just not stay Babies.

We can never disregard the Character of God of His Fellowship. Where the main thing that we notice is this. There is nobody "in charge". Only God as the Father of His Household. And of course this goes totally against the attitude in the groups. Where some enjoy to rule their slaves.


Luke 22
24 ¶And there was also a strife among them, which of them should be accounted the greatest.
25 And he said unto them, The kings of the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and they that exercise authority upon them are called benefactors.
26 But ye shall not be so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve.

And also notworthy is that you said it is mostly like this. Because there are some that managed to not be part of the "strife". And we can learn from them. For starters. And they should post more. Because they are our Pastors. Not those with the "titles". But those Pasturing in the Gift of Pastor. From the Great Pastor. Where their actual Life they are Living is the Example to lead the sheep to waters and food.

1 Peter 5

1 The elders which are among you I exhort, who am also an elder, and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, and also a partaker of the glory that shall be revealed:
2 Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind;
3 Neither as being lords over God’s heritage, but being ensamples to the flock.
4 And when the chief Shepherd shall appear, ye shall receive a crown of glory that fadeth not away.
5 Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder. Yea, all of you be subject one to another, and be clothed with humility: for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble.
6 Humble yourselves therefore under the mighty hand of God, that he may exalt you in due time:

 

[JohanA]

Yes, and guess what me putting Colossians was?

It is not a "guessing game" here. But "Edifying".


1 Cor. 14
26 How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.

Correcting and teaching you.

Good. That is what it is all about. Edifying one another int the Holy Spirit.

Let me teach you another thing, then:

Good. The more, the better.

God alone creates.

I agree.

We don't 'create life' in one another.

I agree. It is only the Holy Spirit speaking from us that is doing this. That is why it is called "by the Gift of the Holy Spirit.

We, being used of Him, encourage each other, to spur all toward more good works and deeper knowledge of Him.

Seems you have a very limited view of the Holy Spirit and His Gift in us? Because you are here in the ability of man and not the Gift.

Eternal life is this: to know Him

It's not supposed to be about us. It's about Him

Sure. Edifying one another is by the Gift of the Holy Spirit and not the ability of man to "encourage and spur". It is streams of Living Waters flowing from us. Creating Words of God Himself. Because He is the Spirit.

John 4
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Maybe you are in one of those groups that i am warning you against? Where the "boss" is a pastor with a title and not The Gift.

 

[JohanA]

First of all I want to say "sorry" for my mistake. I forgot to end your quotes and it is totally messed up. And i tried to fix it but the 5 min. was up. And I tried to delete it but the 5 min. was up. So here is the correct one. Hope you didn't waste too much time with the previous one.

Let me teach you another thing, then:

Good. The more, the better.

God alone creates.

I agree.

We don't 'create life' in one another.

I agree. It is only the Holy Spirit speaking from us that is doing this. That is why it is called "by the Gift of the Holy Spirit.

We, being used of Him, encourage each other, to spur all toward more good works and deeper knowledge of Him.

Seems you have a very limited view of the Holy Spirit and His Gift in us? Because you are here in the ability of man and not the Gift.

Eternal life is this: to know Him

I agree. We grow up in His Life and know Him as we grow up in His Life. Always more and more and more and . . . .

It's not supposed to be about us. It's about Him

Sure. Edifying one another is by the Gift of the Holy Spirit and not the ability of man to "encourage and spur". It is streams of Living Waters flowing from us. Creating Words of God Himself. Because He is the Spirit.

John 4
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Maybe you are in one of those groups that i am warning you against? Where the "boss" is a pastor with a title and not The Gift.
Where you can not perceive more that your Baby Existence in carnality?

 

[oyster67]

Romans
16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
16:18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.
16:19 For your obedience is come abroad unto all [men]. I am glad therefore on your behalf: but yet I would have you wise unto that which is good, and simple concerning evil.
16:20 And the God of peace shall bruise Satan under your feet shortly. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ [be] with you. Amen.

 

[JohanA]

I speak against my own intelligence and understanding; I am a fool and very stupid. I should have understood you without further probing, but I needed it: this is evidence of my own idiocy.

I don't know what you're talking about 'attacking you more' - that was the first post I have ever written to you, our very first interaction.
Hi. I'm post.

I asked because you had correlated 1 Corinthians 3 with Psalm 2.
Psalm 2 tells us exactly who God holds in derision and why He does so.
So i was asking if you are really equating the two passages or just taking a verse out of context from the psalm in order to establish that sometimes God holds certain groups in derision.

That's all. It wasn't clear to me whether your intent was to say psalm 2 is about th people in Corinth or whether you just extracted the verse for your own justification.

By telling me that you 'never said that' I perceive it was the latter; you didn't take the context into consideration.

Thanks

No need for us to strife about this. I have already answered this question adequetely. If you didn't get it. Then it is not for you now. You can not do grade 6 when you have not yet passed grade 1.

 

[JohanA]

When we believe the gospel we begin to learn of and know him as our Father who Loves us , and a perfect example of what man is created to be . Both father and son are evident in the Bible and by the Holy Spirit we are pulled into the family of God knowing him through Christ and the presentation of God and man we find in the four gospels

Amen. In the Gospels we have The Word of God on the Relationship of Father and Child. And that Word, Jesus can never create less than it is. In looking and allowing for the Creating Power of God we are created to be the Reality of The Word. Just by Looking at The Word.

2 Cor. 3
17 Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.
18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

And we become The Living Word.

2 Cor. 3
2 Ye are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read of all men:
3 Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.
4 And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward:
5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

 

[JohanA]

You are not presenting your opinion you are casting judgments on others who disagree with you.

When we become Adults in The Word we enter that Ability of God.

1 Cor. 6

2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?
4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.
5 I speak to your shame. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren?

When we are born of God we have His Life in us. In which we grow up to enter the Life of the King of kings and the Lord of lords.

Mat. 19
28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

Just make use of God's Real Gifts and you will get there too.

Eph. 4
11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
14 That we henceforth be no more children,

 

[JohanA]

That is incorrect God displayed horror to men. We are to render Honnor to those whom honor is due. You really don't know what you are talking about Biblically. Have you been disciples? Do you attend church regularly? Do you submit to a local fellowship?

No need to strife and argue about this. I am not a "Baby" anymore. I don't enter "strife mode" but "Discipline Mode".

1 Cor. 4
18 Now some are puffed up, as though I would not come to you.
19 But I will come to you shortly, if the Lord will, and will know, not the speech of them which are puffed up, but the power.
20 For the kingdom of God is not in word, but in power.
21 What will ye? shall I come unto you with a rod, or in love, and in the spirit of meekness?

If you didn't get the Superiority of Gods' Love to humans ability to "honor" others . . .

John 5
41 I receive not honour from men.
42 But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you.
43 I am come in my Father’s name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.
44 How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only?



. . . then it is not for you now. You first need to pass grade 1 before you can get into grade 6.

 

[JohanA]

which local denomination and doctrine should one submit to ? Should we just head to the local church and put our faith in the pastor ? And I guess “ submit” to someone who may be preaching anything right or wrong ?

who decides who a pastor is ? How do we know our local church is being led by the word of God ? If denominations all teach pretty key differences , which one then should we believe is the one ?

I’m not sure that submitting to a local church is biblical , but submitting to Christ and believing the gospel is biblical and then finding a church that teaches and can help us grow in the faith .

did you realize that a pastor , according to the biblical design isn’t even supposed to be the one who speaks in church ????? That’s not what scripture taught when they are together to hear Gods word

it came in later as a tradition like the ot folks gathered together and began traditions

Gods design is for two or three prophets to stand and speak to the group . The pastor was the leader and organizer but was never meant to preach every week and have his own disciples like we’ve done in the world the church in scripture was inclusive of everyone each had thier place and roles

prophets , teachers , pastors , and on down the line all had thier place , gift and function in the church . it wasn’t as it is now that design has one man speaking and all the congregation listening and being forced to accept what he’s saying as truth

But what if he’s not called to speak and teach the word of God ? Shouldn’t we want church to look like it does in scripture before we go submitting to a group ?

I think cults get a lot of folks that way Jim jones was a local charismatic pastor who quoted a scripture here and there and then preached his message , people flooded to it.

they over a short time became devoted to thier pastor and their church group . Over a longer period of time listening to his sermons , he began to explain they no Longer needed the scriptures because they had him .

eventually he convinced them to drink poison coolaid first they gave it to thier children , then took it themselves . Those who refused were shot after they had all died he short himself .

they all believed from the beginning this local pastor was to be believed because he preached from a pulpit , in the End 918 children , women and men lay dead and it began at a local Christian church where they all blindly submitted and followed a Well spoken and well versed pastor

true story

Yep. It fits nicely. To rather be allowing for the Holy Spirit to show you where you have to be. Where you can grow. Where it is only Brothers. Assisting one another to be able to do what they can do. Not enjoying you being "unable". Keeping you in your lack of Ability.

Mat. 23
8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.

When you have a church where you only have to "submit to someone" but that someone does not submit to you it is of course a Baby Church. Where you will stay a Baby.

1 Peter 5
1 The elders which are among you I exhort, who am also an elder, and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, and also a partaker of the glory that shall be revealed:
2 Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind;
3 Neither as being lords over God’s heritage, but being ensamples to the flock.
4 And when the chief Shepherd shall appear, ye shall receive a crown of glory that fadeth not away.
5 Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder. Yea, all of you be subject one to another, and be clothed with humility: for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble.
6 Humble yourselves therefore under the mighty hand of God, that he may exalt you in due time:


Because when you are in a Fellowship you have something to Say too. In the Holy Spirit. Which everyone has to submit too. Meaning submiting you your Word too. Every time you get together.


1 Cor. 14
26 How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.

Just as Paul said and did too.

Rom. 1
9 For God is my witness, whom I serve with my spirit in the gospel of his Son, that without ceasing I make mention of you always in my prayers;
10 Making request, if by any means now at length I might have a prosperous journey by the will of God to come unto you.
11 For I long to see you, that I may impart unto you some spiritual gift, to the end ye may be established;
12 That is, that I may be comforted together with you by the mutual faith both of you and me.

 

[posthuman]

Seems you have a very limited view of the Holy Spirit and His Gift in us? Because you are here in the ability of man and not the Gift.

i have a far higher view of God than of mankind, even of the children of God. ((Psalm 113:4-9, etc))

and i believe it is God that works in us both to will & to do ((Philippians 2:13)), including to encourage one another to do good ((Hebrews 10:24)) and teaching and admonishing one another ((Colossians 3:16)) -- such that if any good word comes out of my mouth, it is "not i, but Christ which dwelleth in me" ((Galatians 2:20))

so i naturally rebuff at anyone telling me that they, or i, 'create life' in others -- immediately calling to mind Nebuchadnezzar looking over that great city saying, 'is not this great Babylon, that I have built for the house of the kingdom by the might of my power, and for the honour of my majesty?' ((Daniel 4:30))

 

[posthuman]

. . . then it is not for you now. You first need to pass grade 1 before you can get into grade 6.

yay, 1st grade!

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rejoice always
(1 Thessalonians 5:16)​

 

[JohanA]

yeah. That is not a characteristic of God.

And what do you call it then?

It seems rather to pass for one of your own characteristics. [/QUOTE]

Seems you are unsure? Don't you think you should ask Dad and "Edify" us?

An attribute of God is not laughter leading to the derision of those He scorns because of sin

Maybe the Psalm is speaking about someone else, laughing. And the consequences that befall you after that "laughing" reach its destiny?

Here is the verse in context:

Why do the nations rage

and the peoples plot in vain?

2The kings of the earth take their stand

and the rulers gather together,

against the LORD

and against His Anointed One:b

3“Let us break Their chains

and cast away Their cords.”

4The One enthroned in heaven laughs;

the Lord taunts them.

5Then He rebukes them in His anger,

and terrifies them in His fury:

6“I have installed My King on Zion,

upon My holy mountain.”

So we have a "Terrible One" in heaven that is not God?

I just cannot say how much I dislike people USING the word for their own purposes and somehow imagining that the holiness and power of God gives them credence to somehow do that.

Seems you have a "purpose" here to Exalt someone else that is not God?

chew on this:

No problem. Just keep your carnality out of it. Because that Someone will start "Laughing" again.

“Do you hear what these children are saying?” they asked. “Yes,” Jesus answered. “Have you never read: ‘From the mouths of children and infants You have ordained praise’?”

that is Word. Good.

Be careful not to offend a 'little one' that you did not save, do not keep, cannot raise up and that God has saved, is keeping and will raise up according to His word.

Did I "offend" you? Or did God give you the "offended evil spirit"? Because you asked for it? Enjoying your carnality?

1 Samuel 16
13 Then Samuel took the horn of oil, and anointed him in the midst of his brethren: and the Spirit of the Lord came upon David from that day forward. So Samuel rose up, and went to Ramah.
14 ¶But the Spirit of the Lord departed from Saul, and an evil spirit from the Lordtroubled him.*n8
15 And Saul’s servants said unto him, Behold now, an evil spirit from God troubleth thee.

 

[JohanA]

i have a far higher view of God than of mankind, even of the children of God. ((Psalm 113:4-9, etc))

and i believe it is God that works in us both to will & to do ((Philippians 2:13)), including to encourage one another to do good ((Hebrews 10:24)) and teaching and admonishing one another ((Colossians 3:16)) -- such that if any good word comes out of my mouth, it is "not i, but Christ which dwelleth in me" ((Galatians 2:20))

so i naturally rebuff at anyone telling me that they, or i, 'create life' in others -- immediately calling to mind Nebuchadnezzar looking over that great city saying, 'is not this great Babylon, that I have built for the house of the kingdom by the might of my power, and for the honour of my majesty?' ((Daniel 4:30))

So you thought I was telling everybody that you have to do it in your "natural human ability"?

 

[JohanA]

Romans
16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
16:18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.
16:19 For your obedience is come abroad unto all [men]. I am glad therefore on your behalf: but yet I would have you wise unto that which is good, and simple concerning evil.
16:20 And the God of peace shall bruise Satan under your feet shortly. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ [be] with you. Amen.

Nice Word. But what did the Holy Spirit say to you when you decided to enter it here?

 

[JohanA]

yay, 1st grade!

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rejoice always​

(1 Thessalonians 5:16)​

We don't strife. For the sake of the "hearers". They will decide themselves.

2 Tim. 2
14 Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers.

 

[JohanA]

Please answer the question I don't care what church one attend I was asking if one does and have they been disciples LOL

We are in one now, LOL.

 

[JohanA]

Please answer the question I don't care what church one attend I was asking if one does and have they been disciples LOL

We are in one now, LOL.

 

[JohanA]

Please answer the question I don't care what church one attend I was asking if one does and have they been disciples LOL

We are in one now, LOL.

In fact. The Greatest One is the One now between me and you.

Mat. 18
20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

 

[JohanA]

Please answer the question I don't care what church one attend I was asking if one does and have they been disciples LOL

We are in one now, LOL.

In fact. The Greatest One is the One now between me and you.

Mat. 18
20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.