Paul warns Timothy that a time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine (2Tim 4:3). I would like to know from those that post here as believers (there are many from all over) what you think of sound doctrine. Can you give examples of sound doctrine and examples of unsound doctrine (if you know of any), without mentioning names of people or groups. In addition to quoting verses from scripture (which is important), try to convey these doctrines in your own words as best you can. Try to keep it from being argumentative and concise (if possible) without compromising your point. Other verses: (1Tim 4:6, 6:3, John 7:16-18, Acts 2:42, Rom 6:17, Eph 4:14, 1Tim 1:3, 4:6,16, Titus 2:10, 2John 1:9,10)
Your Imput: Sound Doctrine
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2 Timothy 4:1I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom; 2Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all long suffering and doctrine. 3For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
The unsound doctrine of the serpent seed and the fables sprouting from it whereas Eve had an adulterous affair with Satan in producing the offspring of Cain and from him, the lineage of the serpent seed.
The rebuking of it is here...
Acts 17:25Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things; 26And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;
From the Genesis account of the curse of the serpent and the seed brought because of its lie, we note that if God was not giving permission for Eve and Satan to produce offspring as He was cursing the results of sinning against God, but yet God was giving a promise of the Messiah to come. Do note that after all that was said and done, Adam called Eve by that name for a reason in verse 20.
Genesis 3: 14And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life: 15And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel. 16Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee. 17And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; 18Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field; 19In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return. 20And Adam called his wife's name Eve; because she was the mother of all living. 21Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God make coats of skins, and clothed them.
So why would Adam name her such as his wife if God was giving permission for another lineage to be given from her? How can adultery be a sin if God commanded a seed to represent the serpent from Eve? No way would God authorized that after performing the first marriage!!! He would not violate that which He has set marriage up for.
And if there be any doubt as to the father of all the living...
Malachi 2: 10Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us? why do we deal treacherously every man against his brother, by profaning the covenant of our fathers?
Any doubt to the sons of God should be seen here as the reason why The Hebrew Bible were referring to their lineage as God's chosen people.
Luke 3:38Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.
So the battle rages on with the Bible against the "lost books" in using the implication from Jude to support the direct errant statements from the books of Enoch that angels mingled with the women with conflicting statements regarding where demons come from as souls from the deceased giants or offsprings from mingling with these giants, but those that favours the fables overlook that... as well as other parts of the accepted scriptures as the Bible in rebuking that fable.
Matthew 22:29Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God. 30For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
If angels cannot marry, nor would God permit the joining of fallen angels and women, and certainly because all life from the womb comes from the Lord as all children are an heritage from the Lord. This leads to His commanement in creation that kinds are to produce after their own kind. Fallen angels cannot defy His laws in creation for reproduction. His word holds fast. Only He can create life.
Isaiah 44:24Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;
Psalm 127: 3Lo, children are an heritage of the LORD: and the fruit of the womb is his reward.
1 Corinthians 15:38But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body. 39All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds. 40There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.
So the natural cannot mingle with the supernatural outside the will of God to produce any offspring.
Nor were there any other "races" on the ark along with Noah and his family for this serpent seed to continue.
1 Peter 3:20Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
So the unsound doctrine of the serpent seed in producing fables of angels mingling with men is not unlike the Greek mythology or the Norse mythology as such forgeries or "poetic licenses" has been known to be produced out of Alexandria which coincidentally is the origin of the documents used by translators for the modern Bibles, and why descrepancies are found as opposing the King James Bible which uses documents whose origins were at Antioch where believers were first called christians.
In any event, this is an example of how the correct Bible must be used to fight against unsound doctrines that produces such fables to the likes that it should provide reasons as to why the lost books were "dropped"... and why the origin from whence modern Bible translations comes from should be circumspect. This would lead to the conclusion as to how some will depart from the faith and give heed to unsound doctrines, having an itchy ears for fables. One may find that in correcting those that go after these fables, they cannot endure the sound doctrine of correction. However, those that hear His voice, will hear the correction, and drop the unsound doctrine to be better witnesses of Him.
The unsound doctrine of the serpent seed and the fables sprouting from it whereas Eve had an adulterous affair with Satan in producing the offspring of Cain and from him, the lineage of the serpent seed.
The rebuking of it is here...
Acts 17:25Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things; 26And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;
From the Genesis account of the curse of the serpent and the seed brought because of its lie, we note that if God was not giving permission for Eve and Satan to produce offspring as He was cursing the results of sinning against God, but yet God was giving a promise of the Messiah to come. Do note that after all that was said and done, Adam called Eve by that name for a reason in verse 20.
Genesis 3: 14And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life: 15And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel. 16Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee. 17And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; 18Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field; 19In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return. 20And Adam called his wife's name Eve; because she was the mother of all living. 21Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God make coats of skins, and clothed them.
So why would Adam name her such as his wife if God was giving permission for another lineage to be given from her? How can adultery be a sin if God commanded a seed to represent the serpent from Eve? No way would God authorized that after performing the first marriage!!! He would not violate that which He has set marriage up for.
And if there be any doubt as to the father of all the living...
Malachi 2: 10Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us? why do we deal treacherously every man against his brother, by profaning the covenant of our fathers?
Any doubt to the sons of God should be seen here as the reason why The Hebrew Bible were referring to their lineage as God's chosen people.
Luke 3:38Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.
So the battle rages on with the Bible against the "lost books" in using the implication from Jude to support the direct errant statements from the books of Enoch that angels mingled with the women with conflicting statements regarding where demons come from as souls from the deceased giants or offsprings from mingling with these giants, but those that favours the fables overlook that... as well as other parts of the accepted scriptures as the Bible in rebuking that fable.
Matthew 22:29Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God. 30For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
If angels cannot marry, nor would God permit the joining of fallen angels and women, and certainly because all life from the womb comes from the Lord as all children are an heritage from the Lord. This leads to His commanement in creation that kinds are to produce after their own kind. Fallen angels cannot defy His laws in creation for reproduction. His word holds fast. Only He can create life.
Isaiah 44:24Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;
Psalm 127: 3Lo, children are an heritage of the LORD: and the fruit of the womb is his reward.
1 Corinthians 15:38But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body. 39All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds. 40There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.
So the natural cannot mingle with the supernatural outside the will of God to produce any offspring.
Nor were there any other "races" on the ark along with Noah and his family for this serpent seed to continue.
1 Peter 3:20Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
So the unsound doctrine of the serpent seed in producing fables of angels mingling with men is not unlike the Greek mythology or the Norse mythology as such forgeries or "poetic licenses" has been known to be produced out of Alexandria which coincidentally is the origin of the documents used by translators for the modern Bibles, and why descrepancies are found as opposing the King James Bible which uses documents whose origins were at Antioch where believers were first called christians.
In any event, this is an example of how the correct Bible must be used to fight against unsound doctrines that produces such fables to the likes that it should provide reasons as to why the lost books were "dropped"... and why the origin from whence modern Bible translations comes from should be circumspect. This would lead to the conclusion as to how some will depart from the faith and give heed to unsound doctrines, having an itchy ears for fables. One may find that in correcting those that go after these fables, they cannot endure the sound doctrine of correction. However, those that hear His voice, will hear the correction, and drop the unsound doctrine to be better witnesses of Him.
There are so many unsound doctrine in the church today, so I will just name a few that are the most popular.
The teaching that Jesus was is not God
The pretrib rapture
Predestination (The teaching that God has chosen who would be saved and who would go to Hell before He created the Earth)
OSAS/Eternal security
There is no Hell
The gifts of the Spirit are not for today
Dispensationalism
Universalism
There are many, many more, but I will stop with these for now. The sad thing is that even these false doctrine mentioned here will be defended on this very forum, probably in this thread.
The teaching that Jesus was is not God
The pretrib rapture
Predestination (The teaching that God has chosen who would be saved and who would go to Hell before He created the Earth)
OSAS/Eternal security
There is no Hell
The gifts of the Spirit are not for today
Dispensationalism
Universalism
There are many, many more, but I will stop with these for now. The sad thing is that even these false doctrine mentioned here will be defended on this very forum, probably in this thread.
1
The major issues Paul had to deal with were..
Jesus as the sole means of salvation
Practicing parts of the law to merit salvation
Gnostism
A few others I can't name.
I'd say any doctrine that attempts to strike blows to core issues, like salvation, the authority of God's word, the need to live for God after salvation (yes I'm osas and I said that..)Jesus coming back, the deity of Christ. Any teaching that attempts to attack those core issues should be corrected.
Now if some teaching doesn't agree with your pet, non-core, non-essential issue, you really should just keep your powder dry and save your ammo for better fights.
Jesus as the sole means of salvation
Practicing parts of the law to merit salvation
Gnostism
A few others I can't name.
I'd say any doctrine that attempts to strike blows to core issues, like salvation, the authority of God's word, the need to live for God after salvation (yes I'm osas and I said that..)Jesus coming back, the deity of Christ. Any teaching that attempts to attack those core issues should be corrected.
Now if some teaching doesn't agree with your pet, non-core, non-essential issue, you really should just keep your powder dry and save your ammo for better fights.
C
I believe anyone who denys Jesus is the Christ and is the only way to salvation and to the Father is heresy. I am not a believer in osas but neither do i believe that personal belief matters either way ..it neither saves nor ****s and individual.My belief in loss of salvation does not mean i work to obtain salvation for me i believe a person can turn their back on God and choose to live a life without Him . Most of the time the disputes about doctrine dont really matter about the salvation of a soul usually im sayin not always.So most debate about 'doctrine' in my opinion are pointless.
Concerning God's eternal redemption (eternal salvation) and the gift of eternal life, that is given by grace and through faith to everyone that believes upon the name of the LORD Jesus Christ, I would like to say one thing without going into it.
I could show you that this truth, concerning God's great salvation that can never be taken back by God once given nor lost by those who have received it by grace and through faith, has been taught since the beginning. And even by proving to you in all these areas of the scriptures that involve those listed below, some of you would not change your position because you have been persuaded otherwise. Here they are;
1. God taught Adam and Eve
2. The Patriarch's taught it
3. Moses taught it
4. David taught it
5. The Prophets taught it
6. The Apostles and disciples taught it
7. Jesus taught it as doctrine and with His life
8. The cross teaches it
9. The resurrection teaches it
10. The book of Revelation teaches it
11. Thief on the cross experienced it, having done nothing but believe
12. God is that very life
Anyone that does not believe it, it has to be said of them, that they deny it. To deny it, is to deny the very life of God who has given it. And by the logic of some of you, through the simple fact that you deny it, you can no longer have it because you walked away from it by your own denial of it.
I could show you that this truth, concerning God's great salvation that can never be taken back by God once given nor lost by those who have received it by grace and through faith, has been taught since the beginning. And even by proving to you in all these areas of the scriptures that involve those listed below, some of you would not change your position because you have been persuaded otherwise. Here they are;
1. God taught Adam and Eve
2. The Patriarch's taught it
3. Moses taught it
4. David taught it
5. The Prophets taught it
6. The Apostles and disciples taught it
7. Jesus taught it as doctrine and with His life
8. The cross teaches it
9. The resurrection teaches it
10. The book of Revelation teaches it
11. Thief on the cross experienced it, having done nothing but believe
12. God is that very life
Anyone that does not believe it, it has to be said of them, that they deny it. To deny it, is to deny the very life of God who has given it. And by the logic of some of you, through the simple fact that you deny it, you can no longer have it because you walked away from it by your own denial of it.
I
I'm really sorry, but I can't handle it anymore. You've posted a zillion threads like this with the words 'your imput' in the title... I feel I need to correct you. The word is INPUT not IMPUT. Sorry, but if you're gonna go on a holy crusade about topics and ask us for our opinion, to try and spark debate, at least get that bit right first eh?
Re: Your Input: Sound Doctrine
Why are you in such opposition about some of these topics? If God was going to talk to you personally, wouldn't you want Him to tell you the truth? Don't you think that the scriptures reveal the truth whereby we get to know Him, what He is like, how He treats people, what He thinks about in situations and those things that He gives to us by grace? Did we get saved to just be forgiven or to also get to know Him? The word of God is sacred to me and not some holy crusade as you have depicted it. I am far from perfect in my life and even more in my communication. I am a weak frail sinner in need of God's grace everyday. I hope that you will understand that.
Why are you in such opposition about some of these topics? If God was going to talk to you personally, wouldn't you want Him to tell you the truth? Don't you think that the scriptures reveal the truth whereby we get to know Him, what He is like, how He treats people, what He thinks about in situations and those things that He gives to us by grace? Did we get saved to just be forgiven or to also get to know Him? The word of God is sacred to me and not some holy crusade as you have depicted it. I am far from perfect in my life and even more in my communication. I am a weak frail sinner in need of God's grace everyday. I hope that you will understand that.
I
I'm not in opposition to any of the topics. I agree wholeheartedly with CMW. I think there are far too many people on here who get caught up debating about issues that, in the grand scheme of things really don't matter. Get a grip people! However, having said that... anyone who knows me well, knows that I have no time for spelling or grammar errors, caused by ignorance or stupidity... which is why I felt the need to correct you. You spend all day in here going on and on about issues that are of no relevence to our salvation... driving everybody nuts... trying only to spark debate, and you can't even use the right words to make your point. Fair enough if it's a one-off error, but when it's repetitive, it becomes painful. So, now I have made my point, I too am pulling out of this thread. Bye 
Re: Your Input: Sound Doctrine
I guess I will have to number myself with those unlearned and ignorant men.
Acts 4:13 'Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were unlearned and ignorant men, they marvelled; and they took knowledge of them, that they had been with Jesus'.
I guess I will have to number myself with those unlearned and ignorant men.
Acts 4:13 'Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were unlearned and ignorant men, they marvelled; and they took knowledge of them, that they had been with Jesus'.
Your last sentence that I have emboldened contradicted everything else you previously said, and means that you agree that you can walk away or turn from your salvation even after you have received it, proving the doctrine of OSAS false. Free grace, OSAS, Eternal Security is a deception to cause believers to live in false security.
Re: Your Input: Sound Doctrine
watchmen,
The first part of that sentence is the subject of who the rest of the sentence is talking about that you have emboldened. Read it over and think about what your saying and don't forget the main body of the post. It is all there in the scriptures and God has made it very clear to those that want to know the truth. The Holy Spirit has no problem witnessing the truth that God has delivered unto us who believe.
watchmen,
The first part of that sentence is the subject of who the rest of the sentence is talking about that you have emboldened. Read it over and think about what your saying and don't forget the main body of the post. It is all there in the scriptures and God has made it very clear to those that want to know the truth. The Holy Spirit has no problem witnessing the truth that God has delivered unto us who believe.
R
Free grace, OSAS, Eternal Security is a deception to cause believers to live in false security.
Reading corrupted versions of the Bible which make claims that salvation is a " drawn out process" is a big problem. In fact, those who claim one can lose their salvation is calling God a liar whether one realizes it or not. I consider that a big offense, and will not back down on the issue. Every Christian could go to hell under that corrupted belief. Then Jesus wasted his time on the cross. Jesus saves COMPLETELY.
BLC, God bless you for standing up to heresy. Many hate what you have to say because they are not open to hearing the truth. They have been indoctrinated to believing a lie concerning salvation. They will believe it because their best friend believes it, or some heretical preacher teaches it...I could list hundreds of Scriptures that prove eternal security and still people will choose to believe a lie. No where in any of my posts concerning eternal security do I say that man has a license to sin. But still, those who are confused, will continue to allege I have said that. I dont care if a whole slew of denominations declare eternal security is of the devil......I get what I believe firmly from the Word of God!(Psalm 118:8)...I have caught EVERY person who does not believe in eternal security contradicting their positions on multiple occasions! That is a sign that they are confused.
watchmen, you will be accountable to God for calling Him a liar....And so is everyone else who attacks the central truth in Gods Word!
Reading corrupted versions of the Bible which make claims that salvation is a " drawn out process" is a big problem. In fact, those who claim one can lose their salvation is calling God a liar whether one realizes it or not. I consider that a big offense, and will not back down on the issue. Every Christian could go to hell under that corrupted belief. Then Jesus wasted his time on the cross. Jesus saves COMPLETELY.
BLC, God bless you for standing up to heresy. Many hate what you have to say because they are not open to hearing the truth. They have been indoctrinated to believing a lie concerning salvation. They will believe it because their best friend believes it, or some heretical preacher teaches it...I could list hundreds of Scriptures that prove eternal security and still people will choose to believe a lie. No where in any of my posts concerning eternal security do I say that man has a license to sin. But still, those who are confused, will continue to allege I have said that. I dont care if a whole slew of denominations declare eternal security is of the devil......I get what I believe firmly from the Word of God!(Psalm 118:8)...I have caught EVERY person who does not believe in eternal security contradicting their positions on multiple occasions! That is a sign that they are confused.
watchmen, you will be accountable to God for calling Him a liar....And so is everyone else who attacks the central truth in Gods Word!
This has an unusual aplication for me. I have several learning disabuilities. Word recall, cognitive dislexia,memorization issues and spelling issues. I have read the bible throughout my life but recalling or memorizing scripture is very difficult. Our lord Jesus is faithful though. For as long as I can recall his word and understanding has been on my heart. Time and time again I knew his word. It used to be so frustrating to know and not be able to quote scripture to support it. The one defining part of this understanding though was that all knowlage would be strongly supported by his word. Even though his word was already opon my heart I was always able to find the scripture to validate this knowlage. For me that is what defines sound doctrine. I also believe that all understanding is inspired by his holy spirit. I also ask myself if the scripture is used to promote my or anothers opinion or to validate the word of our Lord Jesus. It still come back to faith though and in faith by his grace that we have our Lord Jesus's protection. God bless, pickles
The funny thing is the OSAS believers also love the authorized KJV version, which afterall, was written by and for a non-OSAS believing organisation, the Church of England. Anglicans believe you can lose your salvation. Maybe the OSAS proponents should make their own bible translation? Or they should probably be using Calvin's bibles instead.
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