God's FREE Gift of {temporary?} ETERNAL Life!
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FreeGrace2 said:
They actually do fit the issue of the difference between believing and having faith.
Instead of "whatever", which is dismissive, why don't you explain WHY my examples don't fit. If they don't, I'd like to know.
Then why don't you understand James 2:19 then?
Please stop with the cop-outs. If you disagree, you need to explain WHY you do, not just dismiss with a snarky "it is evidence you are closed minded". You know nothing about me. Give it a try. Explain YOURSELF. That's how discussion work.
I said:
If you don't like my example, can you explain why?
More snarky dismissiveness. I get the impression that you are unable to defend your own beliefs, so you just dismiss those you disagree with. It's certainly easier to dismiss rather than provide a mature and thorough explanation.
I said:
I'll stop here. With your erroneouos "mere belief" comment. It is obvious to me that you are too biased to grasp the truth.
You are just so full of snark. You have nothing to offer. No facts, no explanations, just snarkiness.
It was probably my comment telling Paul how wrong his answer to the jailer was, huh.
By saying "mere belief" you have OBVIOUSLY exposed your faith PLUS works theology. No wonder you have no answers. Scripture refutes your beliefs.
lol. You haven't even tried to. All you've done is throw snarky comments my way, been dismissive of my posts, and FAILED to explain your own beliefs.
You're really something. You have been throwing snarky comments and been very dismissive, and when I what is obvious to me, that you are too biased to grasp the truth, I am now "attacking" you.
Do you understand what hypocrisy means?
Since you seem unable to explain your supposedly correct view, and all you can do is be snarky and dismissive, it is better than you quit.
How about when YOU finally realize that you cannot explain yourself.
They actually do fit the issue of the difference between believing and having faith.
Instead of "whatever", which is dismissive, why don't you explain WHY my examples don't fit. If they don't, I'd like to know.
Then why don't you understand James 2:19 then?
Please stop with the cop-outs. If you disagree, you need to explain WHY you do, not just dismiss with a snarky "it is evidence you are closed minded". You know nothing about me. Give it a try. Explain YOURSELF. That's how discussion work.
I said:
If you don't like my example, can you explain why?
More snarky dismissiveness. I get the impression that you are unable to defend your own beliefs, so you just dismiss those you disagree with. It's certainly easier to dismiss rather than provide a mature and thorough explanation.
I said:
I'll stop here. With your erroneouos "mere belief" comment. It is obvious to me that you are too biased to grasp the truth.
You are just so full of snark. You have nothing to offer. No facts, no explanations, just snarkiness.
It was probably my comment telling Paul how wrong his answer to the jailer was, huh.
By saying "mere belief" you have OBVIOUSLY exposed your faith PLUS works theology. No wonder you have no answers. Scripture refutes your beliefs.
lol. You haven't even tried to. All you've done is throw snarky comments my way, been dismissive of my posts, and FAILED to explain your own beliefs.
You're really something. You have been throwing snarky comments and been very dismissive, and when I what is obvious to me, that you are too biased to grasp the truth, I am now "attacking" you.
Do you understand what hypocrisy means?
Since you seem unable to explain your supposedly correct view, and all you can do is be snarky and dismissive, it is better than you quit.
How about when YOU finally realize that you cannot explain yourself.
Well, that was a short finish. You just said you were finished with me. But obviously you aren't.
I said this:
"FreeGrace2 said:
There's your problem. Worried that immoral people will still get into heaven. ."
I said this:
"FreeGrace2 said:
There's your problem. Worried that immoral people will still get into heaven. ."
My question is why people post on these forums but are unable to explain themselves, so they resort to snarky retorts, and are dismissive of those they disagree with.
I gave this poster clear explanations of verses in James 2, but he was not able to show that I am in error. So he became snarky and dismissive. A typical tactic.
I gave this poster clear explanations of verses in James 2, but he was not able to show that I am in error. So he became snarky and dismissive. A typical tactic.
Highly Doubtful for some, or more, In The Body Of CHRIST, Today, since:
(1) Ephesians_2:10 "For we Are HIS Workmanship, Created in CHRIST JESUS unto
good works, which God hath before ordained that we Should walk in them."
(2) 1_Corinthians_5:5 "To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the
[sinful] flesh, that the [righteous] spirit may be saved In The Day of The LORD JESUS."
(3) The Judgment Day Of The LORD JESUS CHRIST!:
"For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
According to The GRACE Of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I
have laid The Foundation, and another buildeth Thereon. But let every man take heed
how he buildeth Thereupon. For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid,
Which Is JESUS CHRIST.
Now if any man build upon This Foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay,
stubble; Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because
it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every {Saved?} man's work of what sort
it is. If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself
Shall Be Saved; yet so as by fire." (1_Corinthians_3:9-15 KJB!)
Conclusion, for All believers In Today's Body Of CHRIST:
EVERY Saved man has Eternal Life, is a co-laborer With God, but some builders,
with The Wrong SORT of building materials, receive NO reward, sounds like:
God's Eternal "Relationship" vs man's perfect/IMperfect fellowship, Correct?
Precious friend, Please Be Very Richly Blessed!
(1) Ephesians_2:10 "For we Are HIS Workmanship, Created in CHRIST JESUS unto
good works, which God hath before ordained that we Should walk in them."
(2) 1_Corinthians_5:5 "To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the
[sinful] flesh, that the [righteous] spirit may be saved In The Day of The LORD JESUS."
(3) The Judgment Day Of The LORD JESUS CHRIST!:
"For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
According to The GRACE Of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I
have laid The Foundation, and another buildeth Thereon. But let every man take heed
how he buildeth Thereupon. For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid,
Which Is JESUS CHRIST.
Now if any man build upon This Foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay,
stubble; Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because
it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every {Saved?} man's work of what sort
it is. If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself
Shall Be Saved; yet so as by fire." (1_Corinthians_3:9-15 KJB!)
Conclusion, for All believers In Today's Body Of CHRIST:
EVERY Saved man has Eternal Life, is a co-laborer With God, but some builders,
with The Wrong SORT of building materials, receive NO reward, sounds like:
God's Eternal "Relationship" vs man's perfect/IMperfect fellowship, Correct?
Precious friend, Please Be Very Richly Blessed!
FreeGrace2 said:
My question is why people post on these forums but are unable to explain themselves, so they resort to snarky retorts, and are dismissive of those they disagree with.
I'm glad you didn't mean it when you said you were finished. This allows me to prove that your reponses to my posts were not serious or evidence based.
I pointed out the quote marks were placed in error. The second sentence doesn't make sense if the "someone" didn't say it. But you ignored that point.
I pointed out the difference between believing from experience and believing from trust, and you ignored that point.
I pointed out in your last posts how dismissive you've been to my posts. You could have just given an explanation instead.
I said:
"I gave this poster clear explanations of verses in James 2, but he was not able to show that I am in error. So he became snarky and dismissive. A typical tactic."
I explained the problem with the quote marks in v.18 yet you completely ignored that. I showed that the second sentence doesn't make sense if the "someone" didn't say it. And you had no answer for it so you ignored it. Now you cop-out by saying that is my opinion. Did you show my error, if I was wrong? No.
I provide answers and explanations to verses. You just dismiss, throw snarky comments or empty claims.
It appears that you really aren't able to defend your own views (opinions). I am.
My question is why people post on these forums but are unable to explain themselves, so they resort to snarky retorts, and are dismissive of those they disagree with.
I'm glad you didn't mean it when you said you were finished. This allows me to prove that your reponses to my posts were not serious or evidence based.
I pointed out the quote marks were placed in error. The second sentence doesn't make sense if the "someone" didn't say it. But you ignored that point.
I pointed out the difference between believing from experience and believing from trust, and you ignored that point.
I pointed out in your last posts how dismissive you've been to my posts. You could have just given an explanation instead.
I said:
"I gave this poster clear explanations of verses in James 2, but he was not able to show that I am in error. So he became snarky and dismissive. A typical tactic."
I explained the problem with the quote marks in v.18 yet you completely ignored that. I showed that the second sentence doesn't make sense if the "someone" didn't say it. And you had no answer for it so you ignored it. Now you cop-out by saying that is my opinion. Did you show my error, if I was wrong? No.
I provide answers and explanations to verses. You just dismiss, throw snarky comments or empty claims.
It appears that you really aren't able to defend your own views (opinions). I am.
E
Hey brother, do you also believe one can claim to have faith in Christ, go to church all the time yet because hearer no a doer with no change in his life?
as for Eph 2. The word should is an interpretive word, the Greek word is actually to walk, it is in the artist active sense. It is something deeper Than should in my view, it is something active, that a
so has been going on for awhile. Not passive,
in fact using commentaries, we find it is God working in us for good works, he does this as we have faith in him and walk in faith, as scripture he has perfected forever those he is sanctifying, it is Gods work in us not our work!
this is exactly what James is talking about a claimed faith with no works, is a dead faith or no faith at all
as for Eph 2. The word should is an interpretive word, the Greek word is actually to walk, it is in the artist active sense. It is something deeper Than should in my view, it is something active, that a
so has been going on for awhile. Not passive,
in fact using commentaries, we find it is God working in us for good works, he does this as we have faith in him and walk in faith, as scripture he has perfected forever those he is sanctifying, it is Gods work in us not our work!
this is exactly what James is talking about a claimed faith with no works, is a dead faith or no faith at all
Are you referring to my corrections of your errors?
Maybe you aren't aware of it, but I don't want to be wrong in my understanding of Scripture any more than you do. Does being able to defend my beliefs from Scripture mean that I am "proud"? No, it gives me confidence. Do you think confidence equals pride?
I'm just curious why you don't explain yourself. I gave you a thorough explanation of James 2:18 and the fact that translators misplaced the end-quote mark. As it stands, the verse makes no sense.
Yet, you didn't bother to even address that. By including both sentences in quotes from the "someone", the verse shows what James' point was. In order to demonstrate one's faith to others, one must have deeds.
And you were silent on that significant point. Why?
Maybe you aren't aware of it, but I don't want to be wrong in my understanding of Scripture any more than you do. Does being able to defend my beliefs from Scripture mean that I am "proud"? No, it gives me confidence. Do you think confidence equals pride?
I'm just curious why you don't explain yourself. I gave you a thorough explanation of James 2:18 and the fact that translators misplaced the end-quote mark. As it stands, the verse makes no sense.
Yet, you didn't bother to even address that. By including both sentences in quotes from the "someone", the verse shows what James' point was. In order to demonstrate one's faith to others, one must have deeds.
And you were silent on that significant point. Why?
E
James 2: 14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him?
this person can mock me and others until he is blue in the face. But when you prove beyond any shadow of a doubt you have no idea what the context of a passage is, the last thing to do is puff yourself up and tell everyone you proved your point, your right, and start belittling anyone who disagrees with you and start screaming he is not listening to you, then when they get sick of your nonsense, continue to try to defend yourself and your belief.
it makes you look bad,
this person can mock me and others until he is blue in the face. But when you prove beyond any shadow of a doubt you have no idea what the context of a passage is, the last thing to do is puff yourself up and tell everyone you proved your point, your right, and start belittling anyone who disagrees with you and start screaming he is not listening to you, then when they get sick of your nonsense, continue to try to defend yourself and your belief.
it makes you look bad,
E
1 John 5:13
These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God
its amazing that some think it is works which keep our faith alive, John here makes it clear, it is our hope and knowledge of what we have from God that keeps that faith alive,
all religions on earth believe in works as a means of making ourselves right with God, and as long as we are doing these works we are secure, when we mess up, our security fails, and we better make it right with god or we will get the boot straight to hell
they want God to be a spirit of fear, and anger and always pointing his finger at us, instead of the loving father who picks us up when we fall down, promising to never leave us nor forsake us, and to keep guiding our paths and empowering us to move.
God gave us the spirit as a pledge or down payment, paul uses this term to prove a point, you give a down payment to a bank or lender with the PROMISE you will pay the rest also. You guarantee to them that final payment in full will be made, if you fail to keep your promise, you LOSE what you pledged, not the bank, but the giver. And the giver loses reputation as being honorable and faithful
if God failed to keep his promise, it is not on us so that we lose it, it is on him and his reputation
its Gods character and reputation on the line not hours, it has been that way since Adam and Eve first sinned and they made the pledge to free the created from the death they deserved.
that’s why it is now and has always been grace through faith, Abraham believed (had living faith) God and through that faith God saved or justified him (made righteous) but abrahams faith was not dead. He proved it, even inspite all of his sins for. He still had works of faith, because true faith works,
there Are those who want us to believe we have have mere belief in God say some sinners prayer and continue to walk like the world (no works) and because we recited some prayer we are saved and will have eternal life.
well I hate to say it, but Paul said this is not true, James said this is not true lthe author of hebrews gave us the faith hall of fame, proving even in the OT those who had true faith always had works,
while a believer being sanctified should focus on loveing God and their neighbor by seeking after the things of the spirit to produce fruit (the result of works) it is God who works in and through us to feed us and empowers us for those works which we were created to do. It is not those works or lack of that empower us to continue to believe, it is the knowledge that to be absent fro. The body is to be present with the Lord, that things seen are good, but our faith is in the future, things unseen, the spiritual things that are ours
paul said we have been given EVERY thing in Christas an inheritance, yes, some things we are still waiting for, but they are still hours. Nothing can take that away from us, let us look to God, the author and finisher of our faith. And take out eyes of self.
These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God
its amazing that some think it is works which keep our faith alive, John here makes it clear, it is our hope and knowledge of what we have from God that keeps that faith alive,
all religions on earth believe in works as a means of making ourselves right with God, and as long as we are doing these works we are secure, when we mess up, our security fails, and we better make it right with god or we will get the boot straight to hell
they want God to be a spirit of fear, and anger and always pointing his finger at us, instead of the loving father who picks us up when we fall down, promising to never leave us nor forsake us, and to keep guiding our paths and empowering us to move.
God gave us the spirit as a pledge or down payment, paul uses this term to prove a point, you give a down payment to a bank or lender with the PROMISE you will pay the rest also. You guarantee to them that final payment in full will be made, if you fail to keep your promise, you LOSE what you pledged, not the bank, but the giver. And the giver loses reputation as being honorable and faithful
if God failed to keep his promise, it is not on us so that we lose it, it is on him and his reputation
its Gods character and reputation on the line not hours, it has been that way since Adam and Eve first sinned and they made the pledge to free the created from the death they deserved.
that’s why it is now and has always been grace through faith, Abraham believed (had living faith) God and through that faith God saved or justified him (made righteous) but abrahams faith was not dead. He proved it, even inspite all of his sins for. He still had works of faith, because true faith works,
there Are those who want us to believe we have have mere belief in God say some sinners prayer and continue to walk like the world (no works) and because we recited some prayer we are saved and will have eternal life.
well I hate to say it, but Paul said this is not true, James said this is not true lthe author of hebrews gave us the faith hall of fame, proving even in the OT those who had true faith always had works,
while a believer being sanctified should focus on loveing God and their neighbor by seeking after the things of the spirit to produce fruit (the result of works) it is God who works in and through us to feed us and empowers us for those works which we were created to do. It is not those works or lack of that empower us to continue to believe, it is the knowledge that to be absent fro. The body is to be present with the Lord, that things seen are good, but our faith is in the future, things unseen, the spiritual things that are ours
paul said we have been given EVERY thing in Christas an inheritance, yes, some things we are still waiting for, but they are still hours. Nothing can take that away from us, let us look to God, the author and finisher of our faith. And take out eyes of self.
It is sad that you think I am mocking you. I'm correcting you. or trying to.
Instead of all this whining, you still CAN'T offer any kind of rebuttal to my explanation of James 2:18, which forms the summary of James' point in ch 2.
The ONLY WAY to demonstrate one's faith is to have works/deeds. Real simple.
No, it's those who don't have any substance to their posts that looks bad.
I suppose you think every use of "save" in the Bible refers to soul salvation.
I explained what James wanted to save his audience from, and i proved it from the context. But you are free to your own opinion.
But ch 1 clearly shows that James considered his audience to be saved already.
Discernment is the key to understanding Scripture.
The Bible tells us to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and we will be saved. Acts 16:31
The Bible tells us that those who believe (present tense) HAVE (possess - present tense) eternal life. John 5:24
The Bible tells us that those given eternal life (believers, from John 5:24) shall never perish. John 10:28
The Bible tells us that works have NO PART in our salvation. Rom 4:4,5 and Eph 2:8,9
The Bible tells us that believers are COMMANDED to bear fruit. In fact, that's what believers have been elected to do.
This poster has not shown ANY verse that supports his misunderstanding of James.
This is true and has no bearing on the point that James made.
Absent from what, exactly?
This really doesn't make sense. Could you re-phrase?
Again, true, but not relevant to the point that James made in ch 2.
The Bible tells us that those who believe (present tense) HAVE (possess - present tense) eternal life. John 5:24
The Bible tells us that those given eternal life (believers, from John 5:24) shall never perish. John 10:28
The Bible tells us that works have NO PART in our salvation. Rom 4:4,5 and Eph 2:8,9
The Bible tells us that believers are COMMANDED to bear fruit. In fact, that's what believers have been elected to do.
This poster has not shown ANY verse that supports his misunderstanding of James.
This is true and has no bearing on the point that James made.
Absent from what, exactly?
This really doesn't make sense. Could you re-phrase?
Again, true, but not relevant to the point that James made in ch 2.
E
see, here is this persons problem, he believes he is correcting me, in other words, his eyes are shut, he is not here to learn but to correct and push his belief system
notice, HE said the context of James is not salvation
yet James himself asked If that faith could save (it is about salvation)
and twice now he has not even spoken about his error
news flash to this poster, you can not correct someone when you can even admit YOUR WRONG!
and you can not teach people when your closed minded
notice, HE said the context of James is not salvation
yet James himself asked If that faith could save (it is about salvation)
and twice now he has not even spoken about his error
news flash to this poster, you can not correct someone when you can even admit YOUR WRONG!
and you can not teach people when your closed minded
No, rather, iow, you have no defense for your own beliefs, so you keep avoiding my explanation of James 2:18 because you have no better answer.
Proven from context.
Exactly. The question is to be "saved from what?" And you automatically default to soul salvation. But those who have read ch 1 already know that James considered his audience SAVED already. So it should be obvious that he wasn't speaking of soul salvation.
And I proved that works have no part in soul salvation from Rom 4:4,5 and Eph 2;8,9.
It is Eph 2:10 that shows your error. Believers were created to do good works. But nothing about good works are automatic for saved people.
I just keep trying to correct your errors.
Then why can't you address my point about James 2:18 with a real discussion?
No. People with closed minds cannot be taught.
All this back and forth is wasting time. I've given you an explanation of James 2:18 and WHY the endquote is incorrect and what the verse actually says.
And you have no answer for that.
That tells us everything.
Proven from context.
Exactly. The question is to be "saved from what?" And you automatically default to soul salvation. But those who have read ch 1 already know that James considered his audience SAVED already. So it should be obvious that he wasn't speaking of soul salvation.
And I proved that works have no part in soul salvation from Rom 4:4,5 and Eph 2;8,9.
It is Eph 2:10 that shows your error. Believers were created to do good works. But nothing about good works are automatic for saved people.
I just keep trying to correct your errors.
Then why can't you address my point about James 2:18 with a real discussion?
No. People with closed minds cannot be taught.
All this back and forth is wasting time. I've given you an explanation of James 2:18 and WHY the endquote is incorrect and what the verse actually says.
And you have no answer for that.
That tells us everything.
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