Should you resist tyranny or obey - Romans 13 interpretation

[PennEd]

What are your views? Do you interpret Romans 13 to mean that we are to obey wicked leaders and never take a stand against tyranny? You may have to make that decision sooner than later because it's coming

These ladies disobeyed and lied to the government. Note how the Lord was happy with them. So, no, Romans 13 must be used with discernment:

Exodus 1:15-20
New King James Version
15 Then the king of Egypt spoke to the (A)Hebrew midwives, of whom the name of one wasShiphrah and the name of the other Puah; 16 and he said, “When you do the duties of a midwife for the Hebrew women, and see them on the birthstools, if it is a (B)son, then you shall kill him; but if it is a daughter, then she shall live.” 17 But the midwives (C)feared God, and did not do (D)as the king of Egypt commanded them, but saved the male children alive. 18 So the king of Egypt called for the midwives and said to them, “Why have you done this thing, and saved the male children alive?”
19 And (E)the midwives said to Pharaoh, “Because the Hebrew women are not like the Egyptian women; for they [a]are lively and give birth before the midwives come to them.”
20 (F)Therefore God dealt well with the midwives, and the people multiplied and [b]grew very mighty.

 

[Live4Him]

I agree. I'm pointing out something else with the same Scriptures. That is that "(if) Nero was the beast of Rev. 13:17 " that we are told to avoid buying and selling with his money https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation 13:17-18&version=KJV then Paul would be endorsing Christians to use the money/mark to pay tribute/dues with. He would not if it was the mark at that time.

Nero definitely was NOT the first beast of Revelation chapter 13...the one to whom the mark belongs.

That would be the Papacy/the Vatican, and there are multiple ways to prove the same from both scripture and history.

 

[iamsoandso]

Nero definitely was NOT the first beast of Revelation chapter 13...the one to whom the mark belongs.

That would be the Papacy/the Vatican, and there are multiple ways to prove the same from both scripture and history.

Wasn't the beast that that John was shown already "in the pit" at the time the angel explained it to John? https://biblehub.com/interlinear/revelation/17-8.htm How did it exist,receive it's wound prior to the Papacy?

 

[Live4Him]

Wasn't the beast that that John was shown already "in the pit" at the time the angel explained it to John? https://biblehub.com/interlinear/revelation/17-8.htm How did it exist,receive it's wound prior to the Papacy?

I'm chomping at the bit to answer your questions, but I don't want to derail this thread.

If the OP doesn't mind, then I'll gladly answer your question here.

If not, then somewhere else for sure.

 

[iamsoandso]

I'm chomping at the bit to answer your questions, but I don't want to derail this thread.

If the OP doesn't mind, then I'll gladly answer your question here.

If not, then somewhere else for sure.

I agree another place is better in respect to the OP...

 

[Live4Him]

I agree another place is better in respect to the OP...

Two questions:

1. Do you have access to Facebook?
2. Do you have the ability to send private messages here (I don't, and this site won't let me become a paid member for some unknown reason)?

Anyhow, if the answer to both questions is yes, then you can PM me, and I'll send you a link to my Facebook page where your questions will be answered by something I've already posted there.

 

[iamsoandso]

Two questions:

1. Do you have access to Facebook?
2. Do you have the ability to send private messages here (I don't, and this site won't let me become a paid member for some unknown reason)?

Anyhow, if the answer to both questions is yes, then you can PM me, and I'll send you a link to my Facebook page where your questions will be answered by something I've already posted there.

lol, no I'm in my 80's and I've never had a facebook account nor a cell phone,,let me see what I can do...

 

[GaryA]

Two questions:

1. Do you have access to Facebook?
2. Do you have the ability to send private messages here (I don't, and this site won't let me become a paid member for some unknown reason)?

Anyhow, if the answer to both questions is yes, then you can PM me, and I'll send you a link to my Facebook page where your questions will be answered by something I've already posted there.

Just simply start a new thread...

 

[iamsoandso]

Just simply start a new thread...

I'm waiting for approval now,,not sure yet but thanks...

 

[Live4Him]

Just simply start a new thread...

I've only started one thread here before, and it had to be okayed by the Mods. My answer to his question is rather long, and it will probably require three posts which I would like to make back to back to back. I'm thinking that I'll only be able to post the first part and then have to wait until the Mods approve the thread (assuming that they approve it) before I can add the other two parts.

You know how things work around here. The dissenters and naysayers will inevitably chime in, and our conversation will more than likely be compromised. Like I said, assuming the Mods even approve it. Seeing how I'm beyond convinced from both scripture and history that the Papacy/the Vatican is the first beast of Revelation chapter 13, are we allowed to post on something like that here? I've been on other "Christian" forums where negative comments about the Papacy/the Vatican weren't allowed. That is why I am asking.

 

[iamsoandso]

I've only started one thread here before, and it had to be okayed by the Mods. My answer to his question is rather long, and it will probably require three posts which I would like to make back to back to back. I'm thinking that I'll only be able to post the first part and then have to wait until the Mods approve the thread (assuming that they approve it) before I can add the other two parts.

You know how things work around here. The dissenters and naysayers will inevitably chime in, and our conversation will more than likely be compromised. Like I said, assuming the Mods even approve it. Seeing how I'm beyond convinced from both scripture and history that the Papacy/the Vatican is the first beast of Revelation chapter 13, are we allowed to post on something like that here? I've been on other "Christian" forums where negative comments about the Papacy/the Vatican weren't allowed. That is why I am asking.

I tried to begin one but it's waiting aproval if not(it's ok) I will look through my old threads and see what will work...

 

[Live4Him]

I tried to begin one but it's waiting if' not(it's ok) I will look through my old threads and see what will work...

All that I can say is that God is funny.

Every time that I determine in my heart that I'm leaving this forum, somebody starts a topic that I feel the Lord wants me to comment on.

My retirement from here was supposed to have started earlier today.

Anyhow, I look forward to our conversation...wherever/whenever it takes place.

 

[iamsoandso]

All that I can say is that God is funny.

Every time that I determine in my heart that I'm leaving this forum, somebody starts a topic that I feel the Lord wants me to comment on.

My retirement from here was supposed to have started earlier today.

Anyhow, I look forward to our conversation...wherever/whenever it takes place.

lol, I've been watching your post since you joined and I thought you would be interesting to talk to. Don't give up for the most part I notice the more interesting ones to talk to just sit and watch until a certain point and then do.

 

[GaryA]

I've only started one thread here before, and it had to be okayed by the Mods. My answer to his question is rather long, and it will probably require three posts which I would like to make back to back to back. I'm thinking that I'll only be able to post the first part and then have to wait until the Mods approve the thread (assuming that they approve it) before I can add the other two parts.

You know how things work around here. The dissenters and naysayers will inevitably chime in, and our conversation will more than likely be compromised. Like I said, assuming the Mods even approve it. Seeing how I'm beyond convinced from both scripture and history that the Papacy/the Vatican is the first beast of Revelation chapter 13, are we allowed to post on something like that here? I've been on other "Christian" forums where negative comments about the Papacy/the Vatican weren't allowed. That is why I am asking.

Perhaps, if you ask politely in the OP for people to give you ample time --- and then - post like crazy!

You are allowed to post more than the OP - how many you can post seems to depend largely on how long it is before someone gets to it to approve it.

I would venture a guess that most of the [regular] members on here believe that the RCC/Papacy/etc. is the first beast. Or, at least many do.

As long as you are [reasonably] 'civil' in your posts on the subject, it will more than likely be okay.

For what it is worth...

https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/catholic-heresy-for-the-record.41911/#post-705411

 

[iamsoandso]

Perhaps, if you ask politely in the OP for people to give you ample time --- and then - post like crazy!

You are allowed to post more than the OP - how many you can post seems to depend largely on how long it is before someone gets to it to approve it.

I would venture a guess that most of the [regular] members on here believe that the RCC/Papacy/etc. is the first beast. Or, at least many do.

As long as you are [reasonably] 'civil' in your posts on the subject, it will more than likely be okay.

For what it is worth...

https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/catholic-heresy-for-the-record.41911/#post-705411

They did approve the thread(thanks),,,,he's probably got to work tomorrow so tomorrows another day...

 

[iamsoandso]

In the spirit of this thread though,,,in 1776 should the 13 colonies have submitted to the authority of England and obeyed or begun the American Revolution? Now bare in mind that you are "we the people" and God has surely granted you ruler-ship(you won independence) and you have no king over you that God will hold accountable for iniquity,,,, but you your own selves, "we the people",,, shall God require it of you?

 

[Blackpowderduelist]

At the point where they impose upon us that which is antithetical to the command of the Lord, we must follow God not man.
So we will have to decide how is best to serve our neighbors when that time comes. However in the mean while we can return to God's plan for our families by with drawing from babylon. We can stop funding our enemies by paying our debts off as soon as possible. We can sell our suburbans home for which we owe tremendous debt and buy out further where our money we can have a few acres to grow gardens, and have some self sustainability. We can sell the new cars that we owe debt on, and buy cash cars that are less luxury and modern, we can withdraw our children from their indoctrination camps, both public school and colleges. We can bring our children home for education or to Christian schools, and send our youth to Christian colleges for educations. Mom can stay home and raise the kiddos and dad can go work in the public sector to pay the bills. We can learn to farm and garden and repair our own stuff that breaks. We can with draw so that when such mandates are made they hardly affect us. We can alleviate the suffering of our neighbors in such ways. Because we can grow more than we need. We can produce and share. I am now working on my homestead trying to make it into a small farm.
Another thing we can do is stop funding those who hate us. Don't use target, or coke a cola or starbucks, those are just examples. Get out of debt as soon as possible, so we don't pay interest to corporations that support politics that are anti Christian.
Turn off sports, cable tv, and such. Kick facebook and twitter, and all those social media outlets that promote anti Christian values and use you as a means to profit.
We don't have to create communes and with draw completely, but reduce; step by step just don't need them any more. Become a community independent of govco and it's cronies. That is what the Christians of ancient times did.

 

[posthuman]

Wasn't the beast that that John was shown already "in the pit" at the time the angel explained it to John? https://biblehub.com/interlinear/revelation/17-8.htm How did it exist,receive it's wound prior to the Papacy?

didn't Judas go to "his own place" ((Acts 1:25)) and why did John marvel at the beast ((Revelation 17:7)) -- who ((at the time John writes)) was, is not, but will be? what is this "place" that is specific to Judas, and why does he have his own place?

does John recognize who he is looking at?
who is about to come up out of the abyss and "go to his destruction"?
how many people does the scripture explicitly say Satan entered?
anyone else called "son of destruction" in the Bible? ((John 17:12, 2 Thessalonians 2:3 - "the man"))

 

[Blik]

These are important questions. I have lived during the time Hitler asked people to murder others, and they obeyed. Wikipedia lists 24 genocides since 1940.

I was so impressed with the book War and Peace by Tolstoy. The book points out that dictators evolve from the beliefs of the common man in any nation. A study of history confirms this. Scripture confirms this, as we study the destruction of Sodom. God would preserve Sodom if he found a small number of people in the town who accepted Him as their God.

It is true that scripture asks us to accept the government we find ourselves in, but we are also to do the best we can to make that government a Godly one.

 

[Platosgal]

Yes I don't remember hearing anything about them trying to get elected to the Roman senate or campaigning for policy changes in the republic or getting involved in politics at all, really. And I remember Paul's advice to believers was to aspire to live a quiet life, working with their hands - not even trying to turn everyone into missionaries but to serve God where they were and live humbly, letting their lives be a witness.

So i am a bit of a 'stay out of it' kind of person, I mean, I vote, and I may talk to people a little about politics but it's not what I want to talk about, I think it is a distraction from our faith, and I am extremely suspicious of a certain political party actively trying to make merchandise of Christians and subtly deceive them into becoming their devoted pawns & spread their propaganda. IMHO they have had a lot of success.

I consider all politics worldly, and many Christians hate and slander me for it. But my stance is that my citizenship is in heaven, and a good soldier doesn't get himself entangled in such affairs.

I agree

Countries and Earth itself are all subject to the law of Entropy
Everything, Every perspective, All that this system has to offer is transitory and disposable
However
What we must do is keep from division- and draw close to God in every way so when its time to flee
We are ready,
Currently the number of Christian martyrs is on the increase
The next generation is being taught to hate us
The time of Christian peace is over
We are joining history
Throughout history real Christianity came at a cost
Now its time to count the cost