Are WOMEN Pastors Biblical??

[101G]

Acts2 WAS NOT the fulfillment of Joel 2. I understand that how you as a Pentecostal need for that to be the case......
but it is not!

well the apostle Peter LIED? no, Joel 2:28 "And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:"Joel 2:29 "And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit."

now Peter, Acts 2:16 "But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;"Acts 2:17 "And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:" Acts 2:18 "And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:" Acts 2:19 "And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:" Acts 2:20 "The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:"Acts 2:21 "And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved."

so "BEFORE" the Day of the Lord, his return, then these things, will happen and the OUT pouring of the Spirit was done on Pentecost. supportive scripture, Acts 2:33 "Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear."
here, "shed forth" is the Greek word,
G1632 ἐκχέω ekcheo (ek-che'-ō) v.
ἐκχύνω ekchuno (ek-chï '-nō) [by variation]
1. to pour forth.
2. (figuratively) to bestow.
[from G1537 and cheo “to pour”]
KJV: gush (pour) out, run greedily (out), shed (abroad, forth), spill

POUR OUT? what did Joel say, Joel 2:28 "And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:" BING, there it is "pour out", and the apostle Peter said, "which ye now see and hear." NOW, NOW, so the out pouring of the Spirit happen on the DAY of Pentecost, so your STATEMENT is FALSE.

NOW, the moon, and the sun,

Matthew 24:29 "Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:"

HOLD IT, "Immediately after the tribulation of those days ", after the tribulation of THOSE DAYS, ok, let see, next verse, Matthew 24:30 "And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory."

Mark 13:24 "But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light," Mark 13:25 "And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken." Mark 13:26 "And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory."

well the coming of the Son of Man has not yet happen. but the out pouring of the Holy Spirit has. so Acts 2 still stand.

PICJAG,
101G.

 

[Evmur]

In Acts 2......did the Sun stop shinning?
the moon turn to blood?
Was there earthquakes?

Acts2 WAS NOT the fulfillment of Joel 2. I understand that how you as a Pentecostal need for that to be the case......
but it is not!

The famous parenthesis.

Found in many portions of prophecy where parts have been fulfilled and parts are yet to be fulfilled.

 

[Evmur]

In Acts 2......did the Sun stop shinning?
the moon turn to blood?
Was there earthquakes?

Acts2 WAS NOT the fulfillment of Joel 2. I understand that how you as a Pentecostal need for that to be the case......
but it is not!

You are not baptised with the Holy Ghost and power?

 

[Dino246]

Some (who have me on Ignore) are arguing that because Acts 2 was not a complete fulfillment of Joel 2, it was not a fulfillment at all.

Consider this:

In Luke 4, Jesus is handed the scroll of Isaiah and reads chapter 61:1-2a. He does not read the latter part of verse 2, where it says, "and the day of vengeance of our God". After reading, He sits down and says, "Today this scripture has been fulfilled in your hearing."

If we apply the same reasoning that is being used for Joel 2/Acts 2, then Jesus was wrong because Isaiah 61 was not fulfilled in its entirety.

Um, no; neither Jesus nor Peter were wrong. A prophecy does not need to be completely fulfilled for it to be genuinely fulfilled.

Now, can we get back to the thread topic?

 

[Major]

You are not baptised with the Holy Ghost and power?

Yes sir I was. But what has that got to do with Acts 2 being the fulfillment of Joel?????

The very second I accept Christ and was born again I was Baptized with the Holy Ghost!

1 Corinthians 12:13 says,..........
“For we were all baptized by one Spirit so as to form one body—whether Jews or Gentiles, slave or free—and we were all given the one Spirit to drink.”

Interestingly, here Paul is speaking to “all,” that is, all the Christians, claiming they have all been baptized by the Holy Spirit. Thus, it is to be understood that the baptism of the Holy Spirit is something all Christians experience.

This immersion in the Holy Spirit, in fact, takes place at conversion.

 

[Major]

The famous parenthesis.

Found in many portions of prophecy where parts have been fulfilled and parts are yet to be fulfilled.

That is somewhat true.

Prophecy is always something that is coming.

The famous parenthesis.

Found in many portions of prophecy where parts have been fulfilled and parts are yet to be fulfilled.

Peter quotes extensively from Joel 2:28-32 in his Pentecost sermon (2:17-21). In Acts 2:17, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, Peter changes the phrase “after this” in Joel 2:28 to “in the last days,” underscoring the fact that his citation of the Joel passage was not being fulfilled in his day, but must await the future time of the tribulation. “Last Days,” as used by Peter refers to the tribulation (cf. Deut. 4:30; 31:29; Isa. 2:2; Jer.- 2 - 23:20; 30:24; 48:47; Ezek. 38:16; Dan. 2:28; 10:14; Micah 4:1). After Israel experiences the material blessings described in Joel 2:21-27, they will experience the spiritual blessings noted in 2:28-29. What does Joel describe in 2:28-32? Joel describes the activity of God’s Spirit at work in events surrounding a yet future second coming of Christ. Thus, Peter’s point is that of similarity between what the Holy Spirit will do in the future with the nation of Israel and what He was doing almost 2,000 years ago. T

 

[Dino246]

Would someone who is not on Major's Ignore list please copy-paste my last post (#1924) without my name attached. Please don't "Reply" to mine or he still won't see it.

 

[101G]

In Luke 4, Jesus is handed the scroll of Isaiah and reads chapter 61:1-2a. He does not read the latter part of verse 2, where it says, "and the day of vengeance of our God". After reading, He sits down and says, "Today this scripture has been fulfilled in your hearing."

If we apply the same reasoning that is being used for Joel 2/Acts 2, then Jesus was wrong because Isaiah 61 was not fulfilled in its entirety.

Um, no; neither Jesus nor Peter were wrong. A prophecy does not need to be completely fulfilled for it to be genuinely fulfilled.


GINOLJC, to all.
that was a GOOD assessment, may I add, because it was the Lord Jesus who spirit, notice the small cap s in spirit that was poured out. and the same was expressed in Joel 2:28 "And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:"

here, in the KJV, we clearly see God, who is LORD say, MY "spirit", small case s in spirit, so you're correct,

PICJAG,
101G.

 

[Major]

In Luke 4, Jesus is handed the scroll of Isaiah and reads chapter 61:1-2a. He does not read the latter part of verse 2, where it says, "and the day of vengeance of our God". After reading, He sits down and says, "Today this scripture has been fulfilled in your hearing."

If we apply the same reasoning that is being used for Joel 2/Acts 2, then Jesus was wrong because Isaiah 61 was not fulfilled in its entirety.

Um, no; neither Jesus nor Peter were wrong. A prophecy does not need to be completely fulfilled for it to be genuinely fulfilled.


GINOLJC, to all.
that was a GOOD assessment, may I add, because it was the Lord Jesus who spirit, notice the small cap s in spirit that was poured out. and the same was expressed in Joel 2:28 "And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:"

here, in the KJV, we clearly see God, who is LORD say, MY "spirit", small case s in spirit, so you're correct,

PICJAG,
101G.

Which is what I said! Thanks for the validation!

 

[101G]

Peter quotes extensively from Joel 2:28-32 in his Pentecost sermon (2:17-21). In Acts 2:17, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, Peter changes the phrase “after this” in Joel 2:28 to “in the last days,” underscoring the fact that his citation of the Joel passage was not being fulfilled in his day,

thanks for the reply, but you ERROR, Jesus was this fulfillment, LISTEN GOOD in Flesh and in Spirit.. Peter did not change anything. I do not agree with your assessment.

Peter said this, Acts 2:33 "Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear." and was not the Son to speak to us in the Last days? let the bible tell us, Hebrews 1:2 "Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;"

PICJAG,
101G

 

[101G]

@Major
you said, "Acts2 WAS NOT the fulfillment of Joel 2. I understand that how you as a Pentecostal need for that to be the case......
but it is not!"

well the Lord Jesus disagree with you, Acts 1:4 "And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me." Acts 1:5 "For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence." well the Holy Ghost was given on Pentecost, in ACTS chapter 2.

so that nullify you statement.

PICJAG,
101G.

 

[Major]

@Major
you said, "Acts2 WAS NOT the fulfillment of Joel 2. I understand that how you as a Pentecostal need for that to be the case......
but it is not!"

well the Lord Jesus disagree with you, Acts 1:4 "And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me." Acts 1:5 "For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence." well the Holy Ghost was given on Pentecost, in ACTS chapter 2.

so that nullify you statement.

PICJAG,
101G.

No sir............I agree 100% that the Holy Spirit came and baptized believers at Pentecost because that is exactly what the Bible says.

But nowhere in Acts 2 WHEN the Holy Spirit came do we see happen what Joel said .

There was NO earthquake.
The Sun did not go dark.
The moon did not turn to blood.

You can NOT make something happen that did not happen!!!!

Joel specifically said ...."IN THE LAST DAYS". We have lived 2000 years since Pentecost. Do you think that Pentecost was the last days?????

 

[Major]

thanks for the reply, but you ERROR, Jesus was this fulfillment, LISTEN GOOD in Flesh and in Spirit.. Peter did not change anything. I do not agree with your assessment.

Peter said this, Acts 2:33 "Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear." and was not the Son to speak to us in the Last days? let the bible tell us, Hebrews 1:2 "Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;"

PICJAG,
101G

Whether you agree with me or not is none of my concern.

Yes... Hebrews said what you quoted but that has nothing to do with what Joel said in his second chapter now does it??????

Hebrews 1:2 simply means that we are to follow what Jesus said not what we think or what anyone else said.

Acts 2 was NOT a fulfillment of Joel 2.

Peter quoted Joel in Acts 2:17-21........
“And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God, that I will pour out My Spirit on all flesh; your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your you men shall see visions, your old men shall dream dreams. And on My menservants and on My maidservants I will pour out My Spirit in those days; and they shall prophesy. I will show signs in heaven above and signs in the earth beneath: blood and fire and vapor of smoke. The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the coming of the great and notable day of the Lord. And it shall come to pass that whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved".

Was there a sign in heaven???
Was there signs in the earth???
Was there blood????
Was there vapor???
Was there smoke????
Did the Sun go dark???
Did the moon turn to blood???
Did the 2nd Coming of Jesus take place????

READ what it says my friend NOT what people have told you!

 

[Evmur]

Yes sir I was. But what has that got to do with Acts 2 being the fulfillment of Joel?????

The very second I accept Christ and was born again I was Baptized with the Holy Ghost!

1 Corinthians 12:13 says,..........
“For we were all baptized by one Spirit so as to form one body—whether Jews or Gentiles, slave or free—and we were all given the one Spirit to drink.”

Interestingly, here Paul is speaking to “all,” that is, all the Christians, claiming they have all been baptized by the Holy Spirit. Thus, it is to be understood that the baptism of the Holy Spirit is something all Christians experience.

This immersion in the Holy Spirit, in fact, takes place at conversion.

Why then do christians differ so greatly in experience? this has been a feature of church history, often remarked upon by such men as Wesley and Spurgeon.

What occurs during times of great awakenings and revival?

 

[Evmur]

Whether you agree with me or not is none of my concern.

Yes... Hebrews said what you quoted but that has nothing to do with what Joel said in his second chapter now does it??????

Hebrews 1:2 simply means that we are to follow what Jesus said not what we think or what anyone else said.

Acts 2 was NOT a fulfillment of Joel 2.

Peter quoted Joel in Acts 2:17-21........
“And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God, that I will pour out My Spirit on all flesh; your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your you men shall see visions, your old men shall dream dreams. And on My menservants and on My maidservants I will pour out My Spirit in those days; and they shall prophesy. I will show signs in heaven above and signs in the earth beneath: blood and fire and vapor of smoke. The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the coming of the great and notable day of the Lord. And it shall come to pass that whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved".

Was there a sign in heaven???
Was there signs in the earth???
Was there blood????
Was there vapor???
Was there smoke????
Did the Sun go dark???
Did the moon turn to blood???
Did the 2nd Coming of Jesus take place????

READ what it says my friend NOT what people have told you!

That is like somebody folding their arms when Jesus turned water into wine and saying "that was great but why is there no opening the eyes of the blind and healing the cripples?"

God is not working to your timetable, you can be sure that before this age ends all those signs will be accomplished.

 

[lamad]

No sir............I agree 100% that the Holy Spirit came and baptized believers at Pentecost because that is exactly what the Bible says.

But nowhere in Acts 2 WHEN the Holy Spirit came do we see happen what Joel said .

There was NO earthquake.
The Sun did not go dark.
The moon did not turn to blood.

You can NOT make something happen that did not happen!!!!

Joel specifically said ...."IN THE LAST DAYS". We have lived 2000 years since Pentecost. Do you think that Pentecost was the last days?????

Major, did you ever read?

Luk 4:
18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
19 To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.
20 And he closed the book,

He was reading from Isaiah:

Isa. 61:
1 The Spirit of the Lord God is upon me, because the Lord has anointed and qualified me to preach the Gospel of good tidings to the meek, the poor, and afflicted; He has sent me to bind up and heal the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the [physical and spiritual] captives and the opening of the prison and of the eyes to those who are bound,
2 To proclaim the acceptable year of the Lord [the year of His favor] and the day of vengeance of our God, to comfort all who mourn,

Why did Jesus not quote the ENTIRE passage, including what is bolded? It is very simple: Jesus next statement:
Luk 4:21...Today this Scripture has been fulfilled while you are present and hearing.

Jesus quoted ONLY that portion of the passage that was being fulfilled that day.

The point? PART Of this Isaiah prophecy was fulled when Jesus was walking the earth - perhaps 30 AD. Yet, the very next phrase of this prophecy has yet to be fulfilled: it is not time for God's vengeance to be poured out.

I think you know this, so I suspect you only want to disagree.

 

[surfer14]

What do you hope to harvest by preventing women from serving God and blaming us exclusively for all the perversions of mankind?

Lucy,
No one is saying that women can't serve God. No one.
No one is blaming women exclusively for all the perversions of mankind. No one.

Why would you say that kind of thing? It's so unhealthy. It doesn't help in the search for truth. And it's toxic for your own mind because it establishes those who happen to disagree with you as your adversary rather than teammate. We are on the same team here. Really.

The truth is that the bible basically calls for Christianity to be patriarchal. Women aren't to lead. They should certainly still serve. It's just pretty obvious that they aren't supposed to lead. Have there been good leaders than were women? Sure. Does this mean that we're supposed to throw out God's guidance? No.

Feminism runs deeply in modern society. It is a siren's call for women everywhere and it destroys all who yield to it. I would encourage you to resist it. I would encourage you to ask God to reveal where feminism has worked its way into your mind.

Lord God, I pray for Lucy. Help her to see your plan for her. Help her to know you more and more. Help her to see what feminism does to people. Help her to fight it. And lest she think I'm talking down to her, Lord help me with my own issues. Help me, God, to rid myself of all the sin that keeps me down and holds me back from being the man you made me to be. In Jesus name, Amen.

 

[101G]

No sir............I agree 100% that the Holy Spirit came and baptized believers at Pentecost because that is exactly what the Bible says.

But nowhere in Acts 2 WHEN the Holy Spirit came do we see happen what Joel said .

There was NO earthquake.
The Sun did not go dark.
The moon did not turn to blood.

You can NOT make something happen that did not happen!!!!

Joel specifically said ...."IN THE LAST DAYS". We have lived 2000 years since Pentecost. Do you think that Pentecost was the last days?????

Error, these all thing do not happen at one or at the same time.
so are you saying God lied when he throught his apostle Peter siad this, Acts 2:16 "But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;"
THAT RIGHT THERE KILLED ANY THING YOU SAY IS NOT WHAT JOEL SPOKE OF.

Acts 2:17 "And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:"Acts 2:18 "And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:"

Acts 2:19 "And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:"
Acts 2:20 "The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:"
THERE IT IS BEFORE, BEFORE, BEFORE, THE LORD .... COME. so you;re reprove by the bible.

Acts 2:21 "And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved."

so when people erfuse to believe the bible, leave them alone.

PICJAG.
101G.

 

[Toto]

No they are not. Paul makes that clear. The more appropriate question is do you believe what the Bible says about the role of women in church.

 

[Dino246]

No they are not. Paul makes that clear. The more appropriate question is do you believe what the Bible says about the role of women in church.

The more appropriate question is where are the passages where Paul allegedly makes clear that "women pastors (sic) are not biblical".

Do you believe that the Bible is coherent, or that doctrine is drawn from disparate passages taken out of context?