The Way of the Sword in the Old Testament; Has it Ended?

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Nebuchadnezzer

Well-known member
Feb 8, 2019
1,134
205
63
#1
Conquer the Land by the Sword.
Leviticus 26:7-8
7 You shall chase your enemies, and they shall fall before you by the sword. 8 Five of you shall chase a hundred, and a hundred of you shall chase ten thousand, and your enemies shall fall before you by the sword.

David Takes Jerusalem by the Sword
1 Chronicles 11:1-6
4 And David and all Israel went to Jerusalem, that is, Jebus, where the Jebusites were, the inhabitants of the land. 5 The inhabitants of Jebus said to David, “You will not come in here.” Nevertheless, David took the stronghold of Zion, that is, the city of David. 6 David said, “Whoever strikes the Jebusites first shall be chief and commander.” And Joab the son of Zeruiah went up first, so he became chief.


Peter Goes the Way of the Sword, but He Is Corrected.
John 18:3-11
3 So Judas, having procured a band of soldiers and some officers from the chief priests and the Pharisees, went there with lanterns and torches and weapons. 4 Then Jesus, knowing all that would happen to him, came forward and said to them, “Whom do you seek?” 5 They answered him, “Jesus of Nazareth.” Jesus said to them, “I am he.”[a] Judas, who betrayed him, was standing with them. 6 When Jesus[b] said to them, “I am he,” they drew back and fell to the ground. 7 So he asked them again, “Whom do you seek?” And they said, “Jesus of Nazareth.” 8 Jesus answered, “I told you that I am he. So, if you seek me, let these men go.” 9 This was to fulfill the word that he had spoken: “Of those whom you gave me I have lost not one.” 10 Then Simon Peter, having a sword, drew it and struck the high priest's servant and cut off his right ear. (The servant's name was Malchus.) 11 So Jesus said to Peter, “Put your sword into its sheath; shall I not drink the cup that the Father has given me?”

Jesus Takes Jerusalem Without Sword and Says, "No More of This!"
Luke 22:47-51
47 While he was still speaking, there came a crowd, and the man called Judas, one of the twelve, was leading them. He drew near to Jesus to kiss him, 48 but Jesus said to him, “Judas, would you betray the Son of Man with a kiss?” 49 And when those who were around him saw what would follow, they said, “Lord, shall we strike with the sword?” 50 And one of them struck the servant of the high priest and cut off his right ear. 51 But Jesus said, “No more of this!” And he touched his ear and healed him.

Jesus Conquers His Kingdom Not with the Sword
John 18:36
36 Jesus answered, “My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, my servants would have been fighting, that I might not be delivered over to the Jews. But my kingdom is not from the world.”


Jesus Conquers His Kingdom with Love.
Matthew 5:43-44
43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you


Luke 10:1-3
Jesus Sends Out His Disciples to Conquer with Plowshares
10 After this the Lord appointed seventy-two others and sent them on ahead of him, two by two, into every town and place where he himself was about to go. 2 And he said to them, “The harvest is plentiful, but the laborers are few. Therefore pray earnestly to the Lord of the harvest to send out laborers into his harvest. 3 Go your way; behold, I am sending you out as lambs in the midst of wolves.

Isaiah 2:2-5
Isaiah Foretells Jesus Will Conquer; That the Way of the Sword Will End
2 It shall come to pass in the latter days
that the mountain of the house of the Lord
shall be established as the highest of the mountains,
and shall be lifted up above the hills;
and all the nations shall flow to it,
3 and many peoples shall come, and say:
“Come, let us go up to the mountain of the Lord,
to the house of the God of Jacob,
that he may teach us his ways
and that we may walk in his paths.”
For out of Zion shall go forth the law,
and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.
4 He shall judge between the nations,
and rebuke many people;
and they shall beat their swords into plowshares,
and their spears into pruning hooks;
nation shall not lift up sword against nation,
neither shall they learn war anymore.
5 O house of Jacob,
come, let us walk
in the light of the Lord.
 

Roughsoul1991

Senior Member
Sep 17, 2016
8,784
4,451
113
#2
Conquer the Land by the Sword.
Leviticus 26:7-8
7 You shall chase your enemies, and they shall fall before you by the sword. 8 Five of you shall chase a hundred, and a hundred of you shall chase ten thousand, and your enemies shall fall before you by the sword.

David Takes Jerusalem by the Sword
1 Chronicles 11:1-6
4 And David and all Israel went to Jerusalem, that is, Jebus, where the Jebusites were, the inhabitants of the land. 5 The inhabitants of Jebus said to David, “You will not come in here.” Nevertheless, David took the stronghold of Zion, that is, the city of David. 6 David said, “Whoever strikes the Jebusites first shall be chief and commander.” And Joab the son of Zeruiah went up first, so he became chief.


Peter Goes the Way of the Sword, but He Is Corrected.
John 18:3-11
3 So Judas, having procured a band of soldiers and some officers from the chief priests and the Pharisees, went there with lanterns and torches and weapons. 4 Then Jesus, knowing all that would happen to him, came forward and said to them, “Whom do you seek?” 5 They answered him, “Jesus of Nazareth.” Jesus said to them, “I am he.”[a] Judas, who betrayed him, was standing with them. 6 When Jesus[b] said to them, “I am he,” they drew back and fell to the ground. 7 So he asked them again, “Whom do you seek?” And they said, “Jesus of Nazareth.” 8 Jesus answered, “I told you that I am he. So, if you seek me, let these men go.” 9 This was to fulfill the word that he had spoken: “Of those whom you gave me I have lost not one.” 10 Then Simon Peter, having a sword, drew it and struck the high priest's servant and cut off his right ear. (The servant's name was Malchus.) 11 So Jesus said to Peter, “Put your sword into its sheath; shall I not drink the cup that the Father has given me?”

Jesus Takes Jerusalem Without Sword and Says, "No More of This!"
Luke 22:47-51
47 While he was still speaking, there came a crowd, and the man called Judas, one of the twelve, was leading them. He drew near to Jesus to kiss him, 48 but Jesus said to him, “Judas, would you betray the Son of Man with a kiss?” 49 And when those who were around him saw what would follow, they said, “Lord, shall we strike with the sword?” 50 And one of them struck the servant of the high priest and cut off his right ear. 51 But Jesus said, “No more of this!” And he touched his ear and healed him.

Jesus Conquers His Kingdom Not with the Sword
John 18:36
36 Jesus answered, “My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, my servants would have been fighting, that I might not be delivered over to the Jews. But my kingdom is not from the world.”


Jesus Conquers His Kingdom with Love.
Matthew 5:43-44
43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you


Luke 10:1-3
Jesus Sends Out His Disciples to Conquer with Plowshares
10 After this the Lord appointed seventy-two others and sent them on ahead of him, two by two, into every town and place where he himself was about to go. 2 And he said to them, “The harvest is plentiful, but the laborers are few. Therefore pray earnestly to the Lord of the harvest to send out laborers into his harvest. 3 Go your way; behold, I am sending you out as lambs in the midst of wolves.

Isaiah 2:2-5
Isaiah Foretells Jesus Will Conquer; That the Way of the Sword Will End
2 It shall come to pass in the latter days
that the mountain of the house of the Lord
shall be established as the highest of the mountains,
and shall be lifted up above the hills;
and all the nations shall flow to it,
3 and many peoples shall come, and say:
“Come, let us go up to the mountain of the Lord,
to the house of the God of Jacob,
that he may teach us his ways
and that we may walk in his paths.”
For out of Zion shall go forth the law,
and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.
4 He shall judge between the nations,
and rebuke many people;
and they shall beat their swords into plowshares,
and their spears into pruning hooks;
nation shall not lift up sword against nation,
neither shall they learn war anymore.
5 O house of Jacob,
come, let us walk
in the light of the Lord.
Spiritually a sword can do us no good. We are also not under a theocracy where God demands us to take the promise land which God did prepare by the sword as the Ottoman Empire fell, Hitler was stopped and this prepared for God's people to reclaim land that they had lost.

In Romans, the role of the government is to protect with the sword both in law and order and war.

Self Defense can be defended in scripture as well which doesn't deal with the spiritual but rather physical as God sees innocent life as sacred.

So until Jesus returns, we will see war, crime, and injustice. It is part of life. For evil to prevail, it is when good men do nothing. God often called out to His people on why they let evil prevail and even asking where are those who will stand against it?
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,704
3,649
113
#3
OOPS...

Revelation 19:15-21 (KJV) And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS. And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God; That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great. And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army. And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone. And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

Revelation 14:18-20 (KJV) And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe. And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God. And the winepress was trodden without the city, and blood came out of the winepress, even unto the horse bridles, by the space of a thousand and six hundred furlongs.

THE AGE OF GRACE IS PASSING AND JUDGMENT IS COMING!
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
12,763
113
#4
Isaiah Foretells Jesus Will Conquer; That the Way of the Sword Will End
Only after Christ has destroyed His enemies with the Sword of His Word. The Sword which goes out of His mouth (Revelation 19). So while the Gospel of grace in being preached right now, judgment is coming for those who refuse to repent. and those who are destroyed by Christ are destined for Hell.
 

oyster67

Senior Member
May 24, 2014
11,887
8,696
113
#5
Conquer the Land by the Sword.
Leviticus 26:7-8
7 You shall chase your enemies, and they shall fall before you by the sword. 8 Five of you shall chase a hundred, and a hundred of you shall chase ten thousand, and your enemies shall fall before you by the sword.

David Takes Jerusalem by the Sword
1 Chronicles 11:1-6
4 And David and all Israel went to Jerusalem, that is, Jebus, where the Jebusites were, the inhabitants of the land. 5 The inhabitants of Jebus said to David, “You will not come in here.” Nevertheless, David took the stronghold of Zion, that is, the city of David. 6 David said, “Whoever strikes the Jebusites first shall be chief and commander.” And Joab the son of Zeruiah went up first, so he became chief.


Peter Goes the Way of the Sword, but He Is Corrected.
John 18:3-11
3 So Judas, having procured a band of soldiers and some officers from the chief priests and the Pharisees, went there with lanterns and torches and weapons. 4 Then Jesus, knowing all that would happen to him, came forward and said to them, “Whom do you seek?” 5 They answered him, “Jesus of Nazareth.” Jesus said to them, “I am he.”[a] Judas, who betrayed him, was standing with them. 6 When Jesus[b] said to them, “I am he,” they drew back and fell to the ground. 7 So he asked them again, “Whom do you seek?” And they said, “Jesus of Nazareth.” 8 Jesus answered, “I told you that I am he. So, if you seek me, let these men go.” 9 This was to fulfill the word that he had spoken: “Of those whom you gave me I have lost not one.” 10 Then Simon Peter, having a sword, drew it and struck the high priest's servant and cut off his right ear. (The servant's name was Malchus.) 11 So Jesus said to Peter, “Put your sword into its sheath; shall I not drink the cup that the Father has given me?”

Jesus Takes Jerusalem Without Sword and Says, "No More of This!"
Luke 22:47-51
47 While he was still speaking, there came a crowd, and the man called Judas, one of the twelve, was leading them. He drew near to Jesus to kiss him, 48 but Jesus said to him, “Judas, would you betray the Son of Man with a kiss?” 49 And when those who were around him saw what would follow, they said, “Lord, shall we strike with the sword?” 50 And one of them struck the servant of the high priest and cut off his right ear. 51 But Jesus said, “No more of this!” And he touched his ear and healed him.

Jesus Conquers His Kingdom Not with the Sword
John 18:36
36 Jesus answered, “My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, my servants would have been fighting, that I might not be delivered over to the Jews. But my kingdom is not from the world.”


Jesus Conquers His Kingdom with Love.
Matthew 5:43-44
43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you


Luke 10:1-3
Jesus Sends Out His Disciples to Conquer with Plowshares
10 After this the Lord appointed seventy-two others and sent them on ahead of him, two by two, into every town and place where he himself was about to go. 2 And he said to them, “The harvest is plentiful, but the laborers are few. Therefore pray earnestly to the Lord of the harvest to send out laborers into his harvest. 3 Go your way; behold, I am sending you out as lambs in the midst of wolves.

Isaiah 2:2-5
Isaiah Foretells Jesus Will Conquer; That the Way of the Sword Will End
2 It shall come to pass in the latter days
that the mountain of the house of the Lord
shall be established as the highest of the mountains,
and shall be lifted up above the hills;
and all the nations shall flow to it,
3 and many peoples shall come, and say:
“Come, let us go up to the mountain of the Lord,
to the house of the God of Jacob,
that he may teach us his ways
and that we may walk in his paths.”
For out of Zion shall go forth the law,
and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.
4 He shall judge between the nations,
and rebuke many people;
and they shall beat their swords into plowshares,
and their spears into pruning hooks;
nation shall not lift up sword against nation,
neither shall they learn war anymore.
5 O house of Jacob,
come, let us walk
in the light of the Lord.
The physical sword of the old Testament foreshadows our spiritual warfare today. So many physical/material things of the OT act as symbols for NT spiritual things. Another fine example is the material prosperity of OT men of God.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,424
113
#6
Conquer the Land by the Sword.
Leviticus 26:7-8
7 You shall chase your enemies, and they shall fall before you by the sword. 8 Five of you shall chase a hundred, and a hundred of you shall chase ten thousand, and your enemies shall fall before you by the sword.

David Takes Jerusalem by the Sword
1 Chronicles 11:1-6
4 And David and all Israel went to Jerusalem, that is, Jebus, where the Jebusites were, the inhabitants of the land. 5 The inhabitants of Jebus said to David, “You will not come in here.” Nevertheless, David took the stronghold of Zion, that is, the city of David. 6 David said, “Whoever strikes the Jebusites first shall be chief and commander.” And Joab the son of Zeruiah went up first, so he became chief.


Peter Goes the Way of the Sword, but He Is Corrected.
John 18:3-11
3 So Judas, having procured a band of soldiers and some officers from the chief priests and the Pharisees, went there with lanterns and torches and weapons. 4 Then Jesus, knowing all that would happen to him, came forward and said to them, “Whom do you seek?” 5 They answered him, “Jesus of Nazareth.” Jesus said to them, “I am he.”[a] Judas, who betrayed him, was standing with them. 6 When Jesus[b] said to them, “I am he,” they drew back and fell to the ground. 7 So he asked them again, “Whom do you seek?” And they said, “Jesus of Nazareth.” 8 Jesus answered, “I told you that I am he. So, if you seek me, let these men go.” 9 This was to fulfill the word that he had spoken: “Of those whom you gave me I have lost not one.” 10 Then Simon Peter, having a sword, drew it and struck the high priest's servant and cut off his right ear. (The servant's name was Malchus.) 11 So Jesus said to Peter, “Put your sword into its sheath; shall I not drink the cup that the Father has given me?”

Jesus Takes Jerusalem Without Sword and Says, "No More of This!"
Luke 22:47-51
47 While he was still speaking, there came a crowd, and the man called Judas, one of the twelve, was leading them. He drew near to Jesus to kiss him, 48 but Jesus said to him, “Judas, would you betray the Son of Man with a kiss?” 49 And when those who were around him saw what would follow, they said, “Lord, shall we strike with the sword?” 50 And one of them struck the servant of the high priest and cut off his right ear. 51 But Jesus said, “No more of this!” And he touched his ear and healed him.

Jesus Conquers His Kingdom Not with the Sword
John 18:36
36 Jesus answered, “My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, my servants would have been fighting, that I might not be delivered over to the Jews. But my kingdom is not from the world.”


Jesus Conquers His Kingdom with Love.
Matthew 5:43-44
43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you


Luke 10:1-3
Jesus Sends Out His Disciples to Conquer with Plowshares
10 After this the Lord appointed seventy-two others and sent them on ahead of him, two by two, into every town and place where he himself was about to go. 2 And he said to them, “The harvest is plentiful, but the laborers are few. Therefore pray earnestly to the Lord of the harvest to send out laborers into his harvest. 3 Go your way; behold, I am sending you out as lambs in the midst of wolves.

Isaiah 2:2-5
Isaiah Foretells Jesus Will Conquer; That the Way of the Sword Will End
2 It shall come to pass in the latter days
that the mountain of the house of the Lord
shall be established as the highest of the mountains,
and shall be lifted up above the hills;
and all the nations shall flow to it,
3 and many peoples shall come, and say:
“Come, let us go up to the mountain of the Lord,
to the house of the God of Jacob,
that he may teach us his ways
and that we may walk in his paths.”
For out of Zion shall go forth the law,
and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.
4 He shall judge between the nations,
and rebuke many people;
and they shall beat their swords into plowshares,
and their spears into pruning hooks;
nation shall not lift up sword against nation,
neither shall they learn war anymore.
5 O house of Jacob,
come, let us walk
in the light of the Lord.
In the old testament God sometimes declared a holy war against people who were hopelessly evil. It is an eternal principle, true of the eternal God, that God hates evil.

Psalm 11:5 The Lord tests the righteous, but his soul hates the wicked and the one who loves violence.

After Christ said the kingdom of heaven has come near, God has not declared a holy war any longer, but it is still an eternal principle of the Lord that He abhors evil.

Romans 12:9 Let love be genuine. Abhor what is evil; hold fast to what is good.

17 From that time Jesus began to proclaim, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven has come near.”
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,195
6,508
113
#7
1Co 10:9 Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents.
1Co 10:10 Neither murmur ye, as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed of the destroyer.
1Co 10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.
1Co 10:12 Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.
 

Nebuchadnezzer

Well-known member
Feb 8, 2019
1,134
205
63
#8
Only after Christ has destroyed His enemies with the Sword of His Word. The Sword which goes out of His mouth (Revelation 19). So while the Gospel of grace in being preached right now, judgment is coming for those who refuse to repent. and those who are destroyed by Christ are destined for Hell.
The way of the sword has ended for Jesus's followers. Yes or no?
 

Nebuchadnezzer

Well-known member
Feb 8, 2019
1,134
205
63
#9
OOPS...

Revelation 19:15-21 (KJV) And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS. And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God; That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great. And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army. And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone. And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

Revelation 14:18-20 (KJV) And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe. And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God. And the winepress was trodden without the city, and blood came out of the winepress, even unto the horse bridles, by the space of a thousand and six hundred furlongs.

THE AGE OF GRACE IS PASSING AND JUDGMENT IS COMING!
The "Age of Grace" never passes for Gods's children.
Therefore, do on to others as you want done to you. Judge and you too will be judged.
We are not to bring the judgement - the sword.
We are to bring the gospel message - the plowshare - with love just as Jesus brought it with love. Yes we also have to warn of the coming judgement. But we ourselves do not bring that judgement.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,704
3,649
113
#10
The "Age of Grace" never passes for Gods's children.
Therefore, do on to others as you want done to you. Judge and you too will be judged.
We are not to bring the judgement - the sword.
We are to bring the gospel message - the plowshare - with love just as Jesus brought it with love. Yes we also have to warn of the coming judgement. But we ourselves do not bring that judgement.
Where did I say the Age of Grace passes for God's children?
My point is that Judgment on the Christ rejecters is coming and it will come in the form of a hard Judgment where much blood will be spilt and pain inflicted from on High.

Obviously, I don't ascribe to a Joel Osteen theology.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
12,763
113
#11
The way of the sword has ended for Jesus's followers. Yes or no?
Yes. But it has not ended for Jesus (2 Thess 1:6-10; 2:8).
6 Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you;
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day...
... And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
 
Jan 14, 2021
1,599
526
113
#12
"[Jesus:] Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword." - Mat 10:34 KJV
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,424
113
#13
"[Jesus:] Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword." - Mat 10:34 KJV
I don't think this post is related to that scripture. God declared a holy war against sin in the old testament, now for thousands of years God has not declared a holy war. That is what this post is about it seems to me.

I think it is important for us to understand this.
 

Nebuchadnezzer

Well-known member
Feb 8, 2019
1,134
205
63
#14
Where did I say the Age of Grace passes for God's children?
My point is that Judgment on the Christ rejecters is coming and it will come in the form of a hard Judgment where much blood will be spilt and pain inflicted from on High.

Obviously, I don't ascribe to a Joel Osteen theology.
Do you assume I do?
 
Jan 14, 2021
1,599
526
113
#16
I don't think this post is related to that scripture. God declared a holy war against sin in the old testament, now for thousands of years God has not declared a holy war. That is what this post is about it seems to me.

I think it is important for us to understand this.
It's perfectly related because it is Christ Himself saying that He is on earth not to send peace, but a sword. The question is about the context of what a "sword" means.

now for thousands of years God has not declared a holy war
That depends on whose account of history we are discussing.
 
B

Blackpowderduelist

Guest
#17
Comparing Israel conquering the "promised" land to Peter attempting to defend Jesus is comparing apples to cod fish.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,424
113
#18
It's perfectly related because it is Christ Himself saying that He is on earth not to send peace, but a sword. The question is about the context of what a "sword" means.

That depends on whose account of history we are discussing.
We are speaking of God asking us for a holy war, and the scripture relating Christ and a sword is not a scripture asking us to have a holy war, as God asked that the Amorites be done away with.
 

Nebuchadnezzer

Well-known member
Feb 8, 2019
1,134
205
63
#19
Why should I? All you did was quote a number of Scriptures in your OP without comment.
You want me to give comment?

OK,

These verses support a separation of church and state.

“Separation of church and state, frees a church and its members from the coercive power of the state so that the exercise of religion is unimpeded” (What’s the Catholic View on Church and State). The church should not be manipulated to promote and execute the wills of the government and the government should not interfere with a person’s religious beliefs and practices. Many of the fighters that signed up to fight in the crusades did so as a result of the persuasive speech by Pope Urban II, fearing going to hell if they did not. Emperor Alexius I imposed his desires for the State onto the Church by urging the Pope to help him fight the Muslims, overtaking so much land, so that he would have his other interests met. The results of all of the crusades proved to be violent and disastrous. The Muslims killed the Jews, the Christians killed the Muslims, the Muslims killed the Christians and it continued for over 200 years, all in the name of religion.
https://www.cram.com/essay/The-Crusades-Of-Pope-Urban-II/F3Y4VY9UREEX

On November 27, 1095, Pope Urban II makes perhaps the most influential speech of the Middle Ages, giving rise to the Crusades by calling all Christians in Europe to war against Muslims in order to reclaim the Holy Land, with a cry of “Deus vult!” or “God wills it!”
https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/pope-urban-ii-orders-first-crusade
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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#20
Jesus answered, “My kingdom is not of this world..."