Less well-known Rapture verses. The case for the Rapture is compelling.

[Jordan]

Peter preaching to the Jews: "Believe in Jesus...He is the Messiah..."
Paul's gospel: believe in the death, burial and resurrection of the Lord.

Two different message to two different people groups.

The Lords message is the same for all, for all are sinners, even as we speak.

The idea that there are two different groups is racist and causes no end of strife, jealousy and wars.

Salvation is the same for all. Service is the same for all, once realise we are all one and the same. The Lord loves all races, nationalities exactly the same, He created them all. A truth, that offends many church people who join to be superior to other sinners like themselves.

Basic CHRISTianity

 

[Jordan]

Big Smiles, the forum is to debate and communicate, hopefully you will learn something concerning Gods words

Yes as a missionary, for fifty years, I have learned that people are the same around the world and the Lord loves them all equally.

And what is going on in the world now in the END TIMES, has been prophesied to happenbecause the zLords love has been replaced by materialism and self pride and arrogancy etc.

But if you differ and don;t know these things from the Living WORD and experience, theres still time. i

 

[lamad]

The Lords message is the same for all, for all are sinners, even as we speak.

The idea that there are two different groups is racist and causes no end of strife, jealousy and wars.

Salvation is the same for all. Service is the same for all, once realise we are all one and the same. The Lord loves all races, nationalities exactly the same, He created them all. A truth, that offends many church people who join to be superior to other sinners like themselves.

Basic CHRISTianity

Why then did Paul say, "to the Jew first, then to the Gentile? Why did Jesus call the Cyro-Phoenician woman a dog? Why was Peter's message different than Paul's? Why, at the first Jerusalem Conference did the leaders decide a different message for the Gentiles?

Gentile's were not looking for a Messiah, only the Jews were. I guess God is racist.

 

[Jordan]

Why then did Paul say, "to the Jew first, then to the Gentile? Why did Jesus call the Cyro-Phoenician woman a dog? Why was Peter's message different than Paul's? Why, at the first Jerusalem Conference did the leaders decide a different message for the Gentiles?

Gentile's were not looking for a Messiah, only the Jews were. I guess God is racist.

Both Jews and Gentiles missed the Messiah, they are exactly the same ... until they open their eyes and receive the Lord who created all.

Two groups, different laws is a racist doctrine.

The Pope said, Jews don't need to be witnessed to... I disagree. All need JESUS, all people are sinners Basic Christianity, basic simple truth. The Lord is not a racist, God is not a racist. God demands that all must choose. No exceptions.

Jacob had to choose. All must choose

 

[FreeGrace2]

Your claims are false, when Jesus Christ returns the last enemy death is destroyed, as the resurrection and changing takes place

You have nothing to add or advance any discussion. All you do is make your pompous claims, without ANY evidence from Scripture to back them up. You're as closed minded as anyone can be.

I am thankful that there are other posters who not only claim to be open minded about the Millennium, but ask intelligent questions.

Your eschatology has the glorified body being received, and death still existing in your claim of a mortal Millennial Kingdom on earth

So what? The Bible makes clear that there will be death in the Millennium. Aren't you aware of Matt 5?
21 “You have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘You shall not murder,and anyone who murders will be subject to judgment.’
22 But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, ‘Raca,’ is answerable to the court. And anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell.

Jesus was speaking of His Millennial Reign here.

1 Corinthians 15:22-26 & 51-54KJV
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

v.24 doesn't prove an "immediate" delivering up the kingdom to God", as you presume. It simply indicates that "the end" is coming.

What you love to miss is v.25 which says "For He MUST REIGN, till He has put all enemies under his feet."

That actually and literally occurs in Rev 20 when Satan is released near the end of the Millennium and he goes out to deceive the nations once again, and Christ destroys all of the unbelievers. Then comes the GWT judgment.

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

OK, so what's your point here? v.54 explains what the resurrection/rapture means and does for believers.

And from this moment on, NO resurrected/raptured believer will experience death again.

Since you think the Millennium ENDS at the Second Coming of Christ, that means we should have been IN the Millennium already, given the world's condition and all. So your own theory doesn't hold up to the verses you quote.\

As I've shown.

 

[FreeGrace2]

It's very simple: if you don't WANT to go to heaven during the trib; just do nothing: it will happen.

Laughable. Where in the world do you get your strange ideas? Where does the Bible support this very strange idea of yours?

When Christ resurrects and raptures believers, you'd better believe that He misses NO ONE.

To suggest otherwise is simply absurd.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Peter preaching to the Jews: "Believe in Jesus...He is the Messiah..."
Paul's gospel: believe in the death, burial and resurrection of the Lord.

Two different message to two different people groups.

Huh? Are you actually suggesting that "the Lord" and "the Messiah" are 2 different people???

Paul and Peter preached the exact same message to Jews and Gentiles alike. It is absurd to claim otherwise.

Read through Acts and see for yourself what Paul and Peter preached. While Peter mainly went to Jews (there was Cornelius and his entire household and friends who were all Gentiles) and Paul, after much preaching to Jews, finally focused on Gentiles, their messages were the same. Full stop.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
In fact, I acknowledged that God destroyed all of S & G. Why don't you read my posts before making such embarrassing responses?

But, how does "destroy them all" from S & G relate to Revelation? You never explain yourself.

Playing Games In Distraction, As If The Bold Red Below Isn't Understandable

You defy the simple words of God below, ignoring the truth of the Lords destruction at his return/revealing

(Destroyed Them All)

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

So, you think the VERY DAY of Christ's Second Advent he wipes out everyone. Go ahead and keep your head in the sand and in this one verse. There are many verses that show what all happens when Christ comes back. 1,000 years, in fact, of activity before He destroys them all. But you don't lke or understand Rev 20, so why do I keep bothering explaining anything to you?

 

[FreeGrace2]

Where would those mortal humans come from after the sheep and goat judgement in Matthew 25, if you hold the doctrine that everyone who is saved during the Tribulation will have the same status as us in the Body of Christ?

You are either thrown into the lake of fire, or enter the millennial kingdom after Matthew 25:31-46.

I believe the judgment of Matt 25 refers to the GWT judgment of Rev 20:11-15, in which ALL unbelievers are cast into the lake of fire.

So that means the Millennial kingdom is BEFORE, not AFTER, Matt 25.

Problem solved.

 

[Guojing]

I believe the judgment of Matt 25 refers to the GWT judgment of Rev 20:11-15, in which ALL unbelievers are cast into the lake of fire.

So that means the Millennial kingdom is BEFORE, not AFTER, Matt 25.

Problem solved.

Oh so you believe we are currently living in the millennial kingdom?

 

[Guojing]

Why then did Paul say, "to the Jew first, then to the Gentile? Why did Jesus call the Cyro-Phoenician woman a dog? Why was Peter's message different than Paul's? Why, at the first Jerusalem Conference did the leaders decide a different message for the Gentiles?

Gentile's were not looking for a Messiah, only the Jews were. I guess God is racist.

Your doctrine is that of an mid acts dispensationalist, but interestingly you also believe signs and wonders are still for today.

 

[Truth7t7]

FreeGrace2 said:
In fact, I acknowledged that God destroyed all of S & G. Why don't you read my posts before making such embarrassing responses?

But, how does "destroy them all" from S & G relate to Revelation? You never explain yourself.

So, you think the VERY DAY of Christ's Second Advent he wipes out everyone. Go ahead and keep your head in the sand and in this one verse. There are many verses that show what all happens when Christ comes back. 1,000 years, in fact, of activity before He destroys them all. But you don't lke or understand Rev 20, so why do I keep bothering explaining anything to you?

Playing Games In Distraction, As If The Bold Red Below Isn't Understandable

You defy the simple words of God below, ignoring the truth of the Lords destruction at his return/revealing

(Destroyed Them All)

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

 

[Truth7t7]

I believe the judgment of Matt 25 refers to the GWT judgment of Rev 20:11-15, in which ALL unbelievers are cast into the lake of fire.

So that means the Millennial kingdom is BEFORE, not AFTER, Matt 25.

Problem solved.

There is only one time the book of life will be open, and that will be at the final judgement, at the second coming of Jesus Christ

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
I believe the judgment of Matt 25 refers to the GWT judgment of Rev 20:11-15, in which ALL unbelievers are cast into the lake of fire.

So that means the Millennial kingdom is BEFORE, not AFTER, Matt 25.

Problem solved.

Oh so you believe we are currently living in the millennial kingdom?

Huh? Of course not. The Millennial Kingdom begins with Christ's Second Advent.

I explained the timeline. What did you miss?

 

[FreeGrace2]

Playing Games In Distraction, As If The Bold Red Below Isn't Understandable

You defy the simple words of God below, ignoring the truth of the Lords destruction at his return/revealing

(Destroyed Them All)

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

Just another tired old copy & paste post.

 

[Truth7t7]

You have nothing to add or advance any discussion. All you do is make your pompous claims, without ANY evidence from Scripture to back them up. You're as closed minded as anyone can be.

I am thankful that there are other posters who not only claim to be open minded about the Millennium, but ask intelligent questions.


So what? The Bible makes clear that there will be death in the Millennium. Aren't you aware of Matt 5?
21 “You have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘You shall not murder,and anyone who murders will be subject to judgment.’
22 But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, ‘Raca,’ is answerable to the court. And anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell.

Jesus was speaking of His Millennial Reign here.


v.24 doesn't prove an "immediate" delivering up the kingdom to God", as you presume. It simply indicates that "the end" is coming.

What you love to miss is v.25 which says "For He MUST REIGN, till He has put all enemies under his feet."

That actually and literally occurs in Rev 20 when Satan is released near the end of the Millennium and he goes out to deceive the nations once again, and Christ destroys all of the unbelievers. Then comes the GWT judgment.


OK, so what's your point here? v.54 explains what the resurrection/rapture means and does for believers.

And from this moment on, NO resurrected/raptured believer will experience death again.

Since you think the Millennium ENDS at the Second Coming of Christ, that means we should have been IN the Millennium already, given the world's condition and all. So your own theory doesn't hold up to the verses you quote.\

As I've shown.

Pinocchio's Nose Grew A Foot With Your Response

Your claims are false, when Jesus Christ returns the last enemy death is destroyed, as the resurrection and changing takes place

Your eschatology has the glorified body being received, and death still existing in your claim of a mortal Millennial Kingdom on earth

1 Corinthians 15:22-26 & 51-54KJV
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

 

[FreeGrace2]

There is only one time the book of life will be open, and that will be at the final judgement, at the second coming of Jesus Christ

Right AND wrong.

You are right that the book of life will be opened at the GWT judgment. Rev 20:11-15 says so.

You are DEAD wrong that the GWT judgment occurs at the Second Coming of Christ.

Rev 19 details the Second Advent, and Rev 20 explains what happens BETWEEN Christ's Second Advent and the GWT judgment.

But since you don't like Rev 20, I don't know why I continue to bother explaining the truth.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Pinocchio's Nose Grew A Foot With Your Response

Too bad for that wooden headed dummy. So what?

Your claims are false

Yours are. Blatantly. And so clearly without any Scriptural support whatsoever.

when Jesus Christ returns the last enemy death is destroyed, as the resurrection and changing takes place

I explained all that. It's yours to reject. That's not my problem.

Your eschatology has the glorified body being received, and death still existing in your claim of a mortal Millennial Kingdom on earth

Again, I explained all that.

1 Corinthians 15:22-26 & 51-54KJV
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

And all you can do is keep repeating yourself, as if that will make it all true somehow.

If you didn't have copy & paste, you'd have nothing at all.

You can't refute me, so all you do is make your very empty claims that I am wrong, blah blah blah. A sure sign that you do not have the truth.

 

[Absolutely]

Both Jews and Gentiles missed the Messiah, they are exactly the same ... until they open their eyes and receive the Lord who created all.

Two groups, different laws is a racist doctrine.

The Pope said, Jews don't need to be witnessed to... I disagree. All need JESUS, all people are sinners Basic Christianity, basic simple truth. The Lord is not a racist, God is not a racist. God demands that all must choose. No exceptions.

Jacob had to choose. All must choose

Romans had the distinction.

God has 2 covenants.
The second had superceeded the first..
Illustrated in the ot by the younger most always recieving the blessing with the older being disenfranchised.

In romans, those cut off ( first covenant Jews) are PROMISED BEING GRAFTED BACK IN.

That grafting back is through Jesus.
One method and savior
.
Two covenant people.

Think covenant.

That is WHY we have the gt in the first place. It is jacobs trouble. Israels trouble.
The 144k are ethnic blood Jews. Those gathered in rev 14 are main harvest jews. ( the 144k being harvested immediately prior as first fruits).

The FIRST MIRACLE had to be at a wedding. Had to be Jewish. Had to involve wine. And the declaration had to be made " you saved the best for last"
The Jew comes in last. Rev 14....and the book of ruth.

 

[lamad]

Both Jews and Gentiles missed the Messiah, they are exactly the same ... until they open their eyes and receive the Lord who created all.

Two groups, different laws is a racist doctrine.

The Pope said, Jews don't need to be witnessed to... I disagree. All need JESUS, all people are sinners Basic Christianity, basic simple truth. The Lord is not a racist, God is not a racist. God demands that all must choose. No exceptions.

Jacob had to choose. All must choose

I agree, all need the gospel, but it is a fact of scripture that it went to the Jew first and that Paul's gospel was different. At the Jerusalem Conference, the Jewish leaders made that decision final.

Acts 15
10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?

19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:
20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:

Romans had the distinction.

God has 2 covenants.
The second had superceeded the first..
Illustrated in the ot by the younger most always recieving the blessing with the older being disenfranchised.

In romans, those cut off ( first covenant Jews) are PROMISED BEING GRAFTED BACK IN.

That grafting back is through Jesus.
One method and savior
.
Two covenant people.

Think covenant.

That is WHY we have the gt in the first place. It is jacobs trouble. Israels trouble.
The 144k are ethnic blood Jews. Those gathered in rev 14 are main harvest jews. ( the 144k being harvested immediately prior as first fruits).

The FIRST MIRACLE had to be at a wedding. Had to be Jewish. Had to involve wine. And the declaration had to be made " you saved the best for last"
The Jew comes in last. Rev 14....and the book of ruth.

Amazing - since they were first!