WE are judged by what we do vs. we are saved by faith alone.

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eternally-gratefull

Guest
That’s a beautiful verse you quoted. And it is God’s truth but how we understand it has to be harmonized with other verses.
Matthew 19:18-19
Matthew 18:35
1 Cor 6:9-10
Gal 5:19-21
Eph 5:3-6
Matthew 25:41-46
Rev. 22:12-16

All those verses tell us what becomes of those who live an unrepentant and unrighteous life. That especially goes for Christians.
1 John 3 says a child of God can not live in sin.

did John lie? Or is your interpretation of all those verses in error?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
1 John 3 says a child of God can not live in sin.

did John lie? Or is your interpretation of all those verses in error?

you say that’s a beautiful verse, yet you dare saying that verse is wrong, so how can it be beautiful
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
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It looks like you have successfully avoided any Church that has a sound understanding of the difference between law and Gospel.
Here is where Judgment fits into the Gospel message...

John 5:24 (NASB) "Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

But you want me to believe that judgment is part of the Gospel? You need to spend less time on forums and more time with God's Word.
Actually, that's good advice for all of us.
Friend, you have to spend time to interpret that verse.
You have to read Matt 25 as well so you able to interpret that verse.
Does not come to Judgement on that verse mean not come to punishment.

Like a people on the right, Jesus not punish them.
I check dictionary one of the definition of judgement is

Quote
2 a misfortune or calamity viewed as a divine punishment.
"the crash had been a judgment on the parents for wickedness"

End quote

Judgement can mean Devine punishment

Yes if you believe in Jesus, mean also believe what He say how He will judge, you prepare and exercise love, feed the hungry, exactly as say in Matt 25.

Let me remind you Matt 25 is part of the gospel, not ot, NT
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
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Hey Brother, I’ve been reading your posts and I’m glad to see you’re not giving in 👍.

The reason why you’re getting so much opposition is because someone that believes in eternal security simply can’t believe you need obedience to God in order to be saved. If you need obedience, then the argument for eternal security is shattered. Good luck though! Maybe you’ll get through.
Thanks brother, actually I went to baptist church where they teach osas , but I try to read bible myself and believe directly from the Bible. I have been there for 25 years but recently I move out of town and attend the church near where I live, it doesn't believe osas
 
Jan 31, 2021
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FreeGrace2 said:
I asked you for the verse that SAYS to "invite Jesus in".

Again, do you have any verses? Or is this just your own opinion?
Read the verse I give you and answer my question did Jesus ever force get in or only when you invite
OK, I'll take that as "no, I don't have any verse that supports or teaches what I have said". Got it.

John 15
4 Remain in me, as I also remain in you. No branch can bear fruit by itself; it must remain in the vine. Neither can you bear fruit unless you remain in me.

As I(Jesus) remain in you

One more time
Jesus remain in you by force or need your invitation?
I have already asked if you understand anything about "fellowship". Well, do you?

If you don't, there's no point in trying to explain John 15 to you.
 
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You don't understand what faith us, faith mean trust to the point surrender, invite Jesus to be the leader
This proves that you don't know the meaning of "faith".

Surrendering goes under the heading of "works". We are NOT saved by works, but by grace through faith.

So, if your definition were correct, then Eph 2:8,9 contradicts itself.
 
Jan 31, 2021
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Hey Brother, I’ve been reading your posts and I’m glad to see you’re not giving in 👍.

The reason why you’re getting so much opposition is because someone that believes in eternal security simply can’t believe you need obedience to God in order to be saved. If you need obedience, then the argument for eternal security is shattered. Good luck though! Maybe you’ll get through.
Maybe you could provide some verses that plainly teach that salvation is through obedience then. Can you?
 
Jan 31, 2021
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That’s a beautiful verse you quoted. And it is God’s truth but how we understand it has to be harmonized with other verses.
Matthew 19:18-19
Matthew 18:35
1 Cor 6:9-10
Gal 5:19-21
Eph 5:3-6
Matthew 25:41-46
Rev. 22:12-16

All those verses tell us what becomes of those who live an unrepentant and unrighteous life. That especially goes for Christians.
Could you at least summarize and give us a few of what "becomes" those who sin?

What I'd really like, though, is a clear verse about actually losing salvation, or about a believer who ends up in hell.

When I ask for a "clear verse", I'm NOT looking for any parables, or metaphors. They can be taken in a whole lot of ways that simply fit the opinion of the poster.
 

GodMyFortress

Active member
May 9, 2021
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1 John 3 says a child of God can not live in sin.

did John lie? Or is your interpretation of all those verses in error?
I believe sin separates us from God. God doesn’t separate me from him, my sin that I freely choose does.

If I choose to commit adultery against my wife, 1 Corinthians says I will not inherit the kingdom of God. At the moment I decided to do that, I turned my back on God and what he expects from Christians. He still loves me and wants me to be saved, but he will not reward me with heaven unless I make that right and confess my sin.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
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FreeGrace2 said:
I asked you for the verse that SAYS to "invite Jesus in".

Again, do you have any verses? Or is this just your own opinion?

OK, I'll take that as "no, I don't have any verse that supports or teaches what I have said". Got it.


I have already asked if you understand anything about "fellowship". Well, do you?

If you don't, there's no point in trying to explain John 15 to you.
What do you mean by fellowship?
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
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This proves that you don't know the meaning of "faith".

Surrendering goes under the heading of "works". We are NOT saved by works, but by grace through faith.

So, if your definition were correct, then Eph 2:8,9 contradicts itself.
To me look otherwise you don't understand what faith is.

This a verse you give

8 For it is by grace you have been saved,through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast. 10 For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.

Salvation not by work, it is true, as soon as you accept Christ and die on the next second, you are save

But faith have a fruit.

To me john 15 is another side of faith. You entrust to Jesus to the point you in Him and He in you than you bear fruit.
So when you entrust yourself to Him. Or have faith you bear the fruit.

Salvation not by work but some time create a lot of work.

What happen to Noah, his faith cause him work thousand of hours to build an arch.

Paul, his faith cause him work preaching the gospel risk his life.

Not by work but create a lot of work. Or your faith may not for real

Let me repeat my example
God told Noah, :"I will flood the earth, build an arch to save your family."

Noah :" I believe you Lord/I have faith in you Lord"

Then Noah sleep and never build an arch

What kind of faith he has?
 

Gardenias

Well-known member
Oct 27, 2020
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Lol,I must have the one Jackson123 is speaking to blocked!
It looks like he is writing a blog.
Carry on Jackson!
 
Jan 31, 2021
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I believe sin separates us from God.
The Bible tells us differently.

Romans 8:35 - 35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall trouble or hardship or persecution or famine or nakedness or danger or sword?

The answer is No one. More than that, Paul lists all the things that WON'T separate us from Christ's love.

38 For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers,
39 neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

The bolded words include EVERYTHING that can happen in the present or the future. That would include sin.

Even sin can't separate us. Why? Because Christ died for sin. It's no longer an issue in salvation.

God doesn’t separate me from him, my sin that I freely choose does.
For the believer, you are correct. Your sin will separate you from fellowship with God. That is why John gave us 1 Jn 1:9, so we can be restored to fellowship through confession of our sins.

If I choose to commit adultery against my wife, 1 Corinthians says I will not inherit the kingdom of God.
It is a mistake to assume "not inheriting the kingdom" means "not entering the kingdom". It doesn't, regardless of what your pastor may say.

To "inherit the kingdom" is the same as saying "reign with Him".

2 Tim 2:12 - if we endure, we will also reign with him. If we deny him, he will also deny us;

Some translations have "disown", but if that were the meaning, then that verse is contradictory with Romans 8:35. And Paul wrote both of them.

What Christ will deny us is the privilege of reigning with Him.

Same teaching in Romans 8:17b- co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his sufferings in order that we may also share in his glory.

iow, in order to "share in His glory" which means the same as "to reign with Him" in 2 Tim 2:12, we have to "share in His sufferings", which means we have to "endure".

At the moment I decided to do that, I turned my back on God and what he expects from Christians. He still loves me and wants me to be saved, but he will not reward me with heaven unless I make that right and confess my sin.
No, once you have been given eternal life, which occurs AT THE MOMENT of saving faith in Him, per John 5:24, Jesus says recipients of erternal life shall never perish, in John 10:28.

Do you believe what Jesus teaches?
 
Jan 31, 2021
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What do you mean by fellowship?
I asked if you do. Well, do you? I would like to know what you think that refers to before I answer your question.

If you have no idea, then just say so, and I'll proceed.
 

GodMyFortress

Active member
May 9, 2021
432
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28
Let me repeat my example
God told Noah, :"I will flood the earth, build an arch to save your family."

Noah :" I believe you Lord/I have faith in you Lord"

Then Noah sleep and never build an arch

What kind of faith he has?
Perfectly said.
 
Jan 31, 2021
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To me look otherwise you don't understand what faith is.
I understand your opinion. But it's still wrong.

This a verse you give

8 For it is by grace you have been saved,through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast. 10 For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.

Salvation not by work, it is true, as soon as you accept Christ and die on the next second, you are save

But faith have a fruit.
No, faith doesn't have a fruit. It has salvation.

To me john 15 is another side of faith. You entrust to Jesus to the point you in Him and He in you than you bear fruit.
So when you entrust yourself to Him. Or have faith you bear the fruit.
Jesus was speaking to 11 SAVED disciples. He was telling them about what is required to bear fruit.

Salvation not by work but some time create a lot of work.
Your opinion is very confused.

What happen to Noah, his faith cause him work thousand of hours to build an arch.
No, his faith didn't cause him to do anything. I've already explained the difference. Faith leads us, but doesn't CAUSE us.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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That’s a beautiful verse you quoted. And it is God’s truth but how we understand it has to be harmonized with other verses.
Matthew 19:18-19
Matthew 18:35
1 Cor 6:9-10
Gal 5:19-21
Eph 5:3-6
Matthew 25:41-46
Rev. 22:12-16

All those verses tell us what becomes of those who live an unrepentant and unrighteous life. That especially goes for Christians.
Pick your best verse out of that list and we'll discuss it.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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Let me remind you Matt 25 is part of the gospel, not ot, NT
It might be part of your Gospel, but I'd be hard pressed to twist it to mean good news (gospel).
Was it Mt 25 that died for your sins, was it Mt 25 that conquered death, was it Mt 25 that forgives all your sins?