PAULINE DOCTRINE: SLAYING YOUR OWN SINFUL SELF

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#1
The Death of Christ is a type of the Christian’s life, which is to be one long, protracted, and daily dying to sin, to self, to the world. The crucifixion of the old manhood is to be the life’s work of every Christian, through the power of faith in that Cross by which ‘the world is crucified unto Me, and I unto the world.’ That thought comes over and over again in all forms of earnest presentation in the Apostle Paul’s teaching. Do not slur it over as if it were a mere fanciful metaphor. It carries in its type a most solemn reality.

The truth is, that, if a Christian, you have a double life. There is Christ, with His power, with His Spirit, giving you a nature which is pure and sinless, incapable of transgression, like His own. The new man, that which is born of God, sinneth not, cannot sin. But side by side with it, working through it, working in it, leavening it, indistinguishable from it to your consciousness, by anything but this that the one works righteousness and the other works transgression, there is the ‘old man,’ ‘the flesh,’ ‘the old Adam,’ your own godless, independent, selfish, proud being. And the one is to slay the other!

Ah, let me tell you, these words—crucifying, casting out the old man, plucking out the right eye, maiming self of the right hand, mortifying the deeds of the body—they are something very much deeper and more awful than poetical symbols and metaphors. They teach us this, that there is no growth without sore sorrow. Conflict, not progress, is the word that defines man’s path from darkness into light. No holiness is won by any other means than this, that wickedness should be slain day by day, and hour by hour. In long lingering agony often, with the blood of the heart pouring out at every quivering vein, you are to cut right through the life and being of that sinful self; to do what the Word does, pierce to the dividing asunder of the thoughts and intents of the heart, and get rid by crucifying and slaying—a long process, a painful process—of your own sinful self.

And not until you can stand up and say, ‘I live, yet not I, but Christ liveth in me,’ have you accomplished that to which you are consecrated and vowed by your sonship—‘being conformed unto the likeness of His death,’ and ‘knowing the fellowship of His sufferings.’ Phil 3:10.

*****

Ponder over the precious words above. It is always good to study the Bible for oneself, rather than receive a faulty doctrine from popular Bible schools. We have become too theoretical, and the practical Christian life is missing in many of us. Unless we deny ourselves and carry the cross given to us, we cannot be the disciples of Christ who are heirs to the glorious inheritance.

Your views on the above?
 

Aldg19

Well-known member
May 11, 2021
579
309
63
#2
It’s wonderful to know you all I’m leaving to focusing on my life it’s was a wonderful time learning with you all but it’s definitely been a wonderful 3 weeks with you I learned so much but i hope that you understand why I’m leaving it’s best for me to start my music journey with country music and I’m moving to Nashville I have been dreaming about doing country music forever it’s officially real thanks for your love and support I love you so much and I can’t wait to see you and meet you in heaven someday
 
Mar 4, 2020
8,614
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#3
I think Paul was referring to the physical dangers he encountered as a traveling apostle when he said "I die daily." I don't think he was referring to a daily spiritual death that Christians must go through on a daily occurrence:

1 Corinthians 15:30-32
30And why stand we in jeopardy every hour? 31I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily. 32If after the manner of men I have fought with beasts at Ephesus, what advantageth it me, if the dead rise not? let us eat and drink; for to morrow we die.

Rather, we have already gone through a spiritual death and resurrection and are currently walking in newness of life:

Romans 6:3-11
3Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?4Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. 5For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection: 6Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. 7For he that is dead is freed from sin.8Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him: 9Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him. 10For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God. 11Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Galatians 2:20-21
20I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. 21I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

So I don't think Paul taught a daily dying to self, rather he taught what Jesus taught about dying once and then being born again:

Luke 9:23-34
23And he said to them all, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me. 24For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: but whosoever will lose his life for my sake, the same shall save it.

John 12:24-25
24Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit. 25He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal.
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#4
The Death of Christ is a type of the Christian’s life, which is to be one long, protracted, and daily dying to sin, to self, to the world. The crucifixion of the old manhood is to be the life’s work of every Christian, through the power of faith in that Cross by which ‘the world is crucified unto Me, and I unto the world.’ That thought comes over and over again in all forms of earnest presentation in the Apostle Paul’s teaching. Do not slur it over as if it were a mere fanciful metaphor. It carries in its type a most solemn reality.

The truth is, that, if a Christian, you have a double life. There is Christ, with His power, with His Spirit, giving you a nature which is pure and sinless, incapable of transgression, like His own. The new man, that which is born of God, sinneth not, cannot sin. But side by side with it, working through it, working in it, leavening it, indistinguishable from it to your consciousness, by anything but this that the one works righteousness and the other works transgression, there is the ‘old man,’ ‘the flesh,’ ‘the old Adam,’ your own godless, independent, selfish, proud being. And the one is to slay the other!

Ah, let me tell you, these words—crucifying, casting out the old man, plucking out the right eye, maiming self of the right hand, mortifying the deeds of the body—they are something very much deeper and more awful than poetical symbols and metaphors. They teach us this, that there is no growth without sore sorrow. Conflict, not progress, is the word that defines man’s path from darkness into light. No holiness is won by any other means than this, that wickedness should be slain day by day, and hour by hour. In long lingering agony often, with the blood of the heart pouring out at every quivering vein, you are to cut right through the life and being of that sinful self; to do what the Word does, pierce to the dividing asunder of the thoughts and intents of the heart, and get rid by crucifying and slaying—a long process, a painful process—of your own sinful self.

And not until you can stand up and say, ‘I live, yet not I, but Christ liveth in me,’ have you accomplished that to which you are consecrated and vowed by your sonship—‘being conformed unto the likeness of His death,’ and ‘knowing the fellowship of His sufferings.’ Phil 3:10.

*****

Ponder over the precious words above. It is always good to study the Bible for oneself, rather than receive a faulty doctrine from popular Bible schools. We have become too theoretical, and the practical Christian life is missing in many of us. Unless we deny ourselves and carry the cross given to us, we cannot be the disciples of Christ who are heirs to the glorious inheritance.

Your views on the above?
19For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.
20I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

I think this verse applies to all believers regardless of their maturity.
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#5
The Death of Christ is a type of the Christian’s life, which is to be one long, protracted, and daily dying to sin, to self, to the world. The crucifixion of the old manhood is to be the life’s work of every Christian, through the power of faith in that Cross by which ‘the world is crucified unto Me, and I unto the world.’ That thought comes over and over again in all forms of earnest presentation in the Apostle Paul’s teaching. Do not slur it over as if it were a mere fanciful metaphor. It carries in its type a most solemn reality.

The truth is, that, if a Christian, you have a double life. There is Christ, with His power, with His Spirit, giving you a nature which is pure and sinless, incapable of transgression, like His own. The new man, that which is born of God, sinneth not, cannot sin. But side by side with it, working through it, working in it, leavening it, indistinguishable from it to your consciousness, by anything but this that the one works righteousness and the other works transgression, there is the ‘old man,’ ‘the flesh,’ ‘the old Adam,’ your own godless, independent, selfish, proud being. And the one is to slay the other!

Ah, let me tell you, these words—crucifying, casting out the old man, plucking out the right eye, maiming self of the right hand, mortifying the deeds of the body—they are something very much deeper and more awful than poetical symbols and metaphors. They teach us this, that there is no growth without sore sorrow. Conflict, not progress, is the word that defines man’s path from darkness into light. No holiness is won by any other means than this, that wickedness should be slain day by day, and hour by hour. In long lingering agony often, with the blood of the heart pouring out at every quivering vein, you are to cut right through the life and being of that sinful self; to do what the Word does, pierce to the dividing asunder of the thoughts and intents of the heart, and get rid by crucifying and slaying—a long process, a painful process—of your own sinful self.

And not until you can stand up and say, ‘I live, yet not I, but Christ liveth in me,’ have you accomplished that to which you are consecrated and vowed by your sonship—‘being conformed unto the likeness of His death,’ and ‘knowing the fellowship of His sufferings.’ Phil 3:10.

*****

Ponder over the precious words above. It is always good to study the Bible for oneself, rather than receive a faulty doctrine from popular Bible schools. We have become too theoretical, and the practical Christian life is missing in many of us. Unless we deny ourselves and carry the cross given to us, we cannot be the disciples of Christ who are heirs to the glorious inheritance.

Your views on the above?
We have to be careful were not drifting into teaching asceticism.
 
Apr 15, 2017
2,867
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#6
The Death of Christ is a type of the Christian’s life, which is to be one long, protracted, and daily dying to sin, to self, to the world. The crucifixion of the old manhood is to be the life’s work of every Christian, through the power of faith in that Cross by which ‘the world is crucified unto Me, and I unto the world.’ That thought comes over and over again in all forms of earnest presentation in the Apostle Paul’s teaching. Do not slur it over as if it were a mere fanciful metaphor. It carries in its type a most solemn reality.

The truth is, that, if a Christian, you have a double life. There is Christ, with His power, with His Spirit, giving you a nature which is pure and sinless, incapable of transgression, like His own. The new man, that which is born of God, sinneth not, cannot sin. But side by side with it, working through it, working in it, leavening it, indistinguishable from it to your consciousness, by anything but this that the one works righteousness and the other works transgression, there is the ‘old man,’ ‘the flesh,’ ‘the old Adam,’ your own godless, independent, selfish, proud being. And the one is to slay the other!

Ah, let me tell you, these words—crucifying, casting out the old man, plucking out the right eye, maiming self of the right hand, mortifying the deeds of the body—they are something very much deeper and more awful than poetical symbols and metaphors. They teach us this, that there is no growth without sore sorrow. Conflict, not progress, is the word that defines man’s path from darkness into light. No holiness is won by any other means than this, that wickedness should be slain day by day, and hour by hour. In long lingering agony often, with the blood of the heart pouring out at every quivering vein, you are to cut right through the life and being of that sinful self; to do what the Word does, pierce to the dividing asunder of the thoughts and intents of the heart, and get rid by crucifying and slaying—a long process, a painful process—of your own sinful self.

And not until you can stand up and say, ‘I live, yet not I, but Christ liveth in me,’ have you accomplished that to which you are consecrated and vowed by your sonship—‘being conformed unto the likeness of His death,’ and ‘knowing the fellowship of His sufferings.’ Phil 3:10.

*****

Ponder over the precious words above. It is always good to study the Bible for oneself, rather than receive a faulty doctrine from popular Bible schools. We have become too theoretical, and the practical Christian life is missing in many of us. Unless we deny ourselves and carry the cross given to us, we cannot be the disciples of Christ who are heirs to the glorious inheritance.

Your views on the above?
We are saved if we are led of the Spirit and not all people who claim Jesus allow the Spirit to lead them.

Gal 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
Gal 5:23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
Gal 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
Gal 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.

If a person hates sin and does not want sin by the Spirit they can abstain from sin so there is no excuse.

When it says a person that is led of the Spirit is not under the law it means that they are saved and they are not sinning therefore the law cannot touch them for prosecution.

But if they sin they are back under the law until they repent and allow the Spirit to lead them.

Every time we sin we forfeit repentance until we repent and do not want the sin anymore, and God knows the heart if they truly mean it.

2Ti 3:5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
2Ti 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Some people have a form of living for God but do not allow the Spirit to lead them which they are ever learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth for they did not receive the Spirit when they confessed Christ.

That is because they hold unto a belief system that says sin does not affect their relationship with God so they keep sinning thinking they are alright.

2Ti 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Every person that confesses Christ has to depart from iniquity led by the Spirit which is what seals them unto the day of redemption not confess Christ and live in sin and believe you are alright.

Not every person that claims Jesus as Lord will be able to dwell with Jesus for they did not do the will of the Father but were workers of iniquity which they would not depart from iniquity.

Rom 11:20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
Rom 11:21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Rom 11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

When a person repents of their sins they must continue in God's goodness to act like Christ or they will be cut off like the Jews were cut off if they did not abide by the truth.

1Co 15:33 Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners.
1Co 15:34 Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.

Isa 59:2 But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.

1Co 9:26 I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:
1Co 9:27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

Castaway
adokimos
ad-ok'-ee-mos
From G1 (as a negative particle) and G1384; unapproved, that is, rejected; by implication worthless (literally or morally): - castaway, rejected, reprobate.

Paul said if he did not abstain from sin then he would be rejected.

When led of the Spirit we still have the capacity to sin and if we do sin we have to repent and get rid of the sin and move forward in the Spirit.

Rev 3:14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
Rev 3:15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
Rev 3:16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked.

The 7 Churches is a prophesy of how the Church age will go in popularity at the time of the Church which there is the Roman Catholic Church there, and then the Protestant movement that still had problems, and then the 6th Church which Jesus did not have a problem with that Church.

And then the 7th Church which is going on now in popularity with people being hypocrites and believing the prosperity Gospel which we see many people loving money and material things.

Which this can only happen at the time of technology which Proverbs 30:11-14 tells us of the last generation before Jesus comes back that they will devour the poor from off the earth and the needy from among men which can only happen at the time of technology for more money is flowing and they can reach more people and branch out farther to make money.

And if the Christians are involved in the heaping of money and material things that is happening now how much worse is the world.

Which we see they are devouring the poor from off the earth and the needy from among men as millions of dollars, and billions of dollars is not enough for them, but they keep heaping and heaping, and reaping and reaping, and keeping and keeping.

Paul said if they think godliness is gain to withdraw yourselves from them having food and clothing be content, for the love of money is the root of all evil for it neglects the poor and needy which is not love, and love is the fulfilling of the law, and charity, love in action, is greater than faith, and faith works by love.
 
#7
MattforJesus:"We are saved if we are led of the Spirit"
Untrue. We are saved by the Blood of Jesus Christ.

When a person is born again, he is indwelt by the Holy Spirit.
Carnal Christians are not led by the Holy Spirit.
They all the flesh and the world to dominate their lives.
But they are believers, and though carnal they are saved.
Such carnal believers have no reward at the Bema (Judgment Seat) of Christ.
Some may also receive 'stripes', in Christ's parables about 'servants' - those who 'serve' their Lord and Master.
 
#8
It’s wonderful to know you all I’m leaving to focusing on my life it’s was a wonderful time learning with you all but it’s definitely been a wonderful 3 weeks with you I learned so much but i hope that you understand why I’m leaving it’s best for me to start my music journey with country music and I’m moving to Nashville I have been dreaming about doing country music forever it’s officially real thanks for your love and support I love you so much and I can’t wait to see you and meet you in heaven someday
Before you leave, a piece of solid spiritual advice: SURRENDER your life to Christ! Let him make it clear that 'country music' is HIS WILL.
A true Christian delights in doing God's will.

Blessings, Aldg!:):):)
 
Apr 15, 2017
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#9
MattforJesus:"We are saved if we are led of the Spirit"
Untrue. We are saved by the Blood of Jesus Christ.

When a person is born again, he is indwelt by the Holy Spirit.
Carnal Christians are not led by the Holy Spirit.
They all the flesh and the world to dominate their lives.
But they are believers, and though carnal they are saved.
Such carnal believers have no reward at the Bema (Judgment Seat) of Christ.
Some may also receive 'stripes', in Christ's parables about 'servants' - those who 'serve' their Lord and Master.
We are saved by being led of the Spirit but the blood that washes away our sins allows us to be led of the Spirit to be Christlike.

The blood will not save us if we do not allow the Spirit to lead us for then we are operating by the flesh.

Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

If a person wilfully sins holding unto sins then the sacrifice of Jesus cannot wash it away for God will not take away something they hold unto.

If they are not led of the Spirit then they are of the flesh and will do things of the flesh so the blood of Jesus cannot wash away their sins.

I know the blood of Jesus saves us by washing away our sins, but if a person is not led of the Spirit then they cannot be saved.

If that is the case then hypocrisy would not matter for they are saved no matter how they act, and if that is the case then why have a thread that states slaying your own sinful nature if it it does not matter.

And if it does matter then we have to be led of the Spirit to stay saved.

It is all about receiving the Spirit to have a relationship with God which the blood allows us to receive the Spirit.
 
Mar 4, 2020
8,614
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#10
[QUOTE="MattforJesus, post: 4570235, member: 254688"Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

If a person wilfully sins holding unto sins then the sacrifice of Jesus cannot wash it away for God will not take away something they hold unto.
[/QUOTE]

Full context of this scripture says it's about animal sacrifices. In the old covenant when people sinned after their animal sacrifice there was no longer a sacrifice for sins until the next time. Unlike animal sacrifices, Christ is sacrificed one time. Christ's single sacrifice is sufficient to spiritually perfect the believer regardless if they sin again after the fact.

Take a few steps back in the chapter and observe these verses:

Hebrews 10:14-17
14For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. 15Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
16This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.
 
Mar 4, 2020
8,614
3,691
113
#11
Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

If a person wilfully sins holding unto sins then the sacrifice of Jesus cannot wash it away for God will not take away something they hold unto.
Full context of this scripture says it's about animal sacrifices. In the old covenant when people sinned after their animal sacrifice there was no longer a sacrifice for sins until the next time. Unlike animal sacrifices, Christ is sacrificed one time. Christ's single sacrifice is sufficient to spiritually perfect the believer regardless if they sin again after the fact.

Take a few steps back in the chapter and observe these verses:

Hebrews 10:14-17
14For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. 15Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
16This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.
 
#12
MattforJesus: 'We are saved by being led of the Spirit but the blood that washes away our sins allows us to be led of the Spirit to be Christlike.'

Monstrous statement! Matt, do you read your Bible daily? Have you given your testimony in church as to how you were saved? Anyone who makes a monstrous statement like this is declaring that he has no idea whatsoever of what it is to be born again (born of the Spirit from heaven above).

I need a break from ChristianChat! This monstrous statement by Matt makes me feel that ChristianChat needs a thorough spring-cleaning. So goodbye for now!
 
Apr 15, 2017
2,867
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#13
Full context of this scripture says it's about animal sacrifices. In the old covenant when people sinned after their animal sacrifice there was no longer a sacrifice for sins until the next time. Unlike animal sacrifices, Christ is sacrificed one time. Christ's single sacrifice is sufficient to spiritually perfect the believer regardless if they sin again after the fact.

Take a few steps back in the chapter and observe these verses:

Hebrews 10:14-17
14For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. 15Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
16This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.
Heb 10:23 Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised;)
Heb 10:24 And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:
Heb 10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.
Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
Heb 10:28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
Heb 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

It sounded like it was speaking to people who are Christians and the sacrifice of Jesus.

Jesus did shed blood once for all, but if a person lives in sin how can the blood of Jesus wash it away is what it seems like it was saying.
 
Apr 15, 2017
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#14
MattforJesus: 'We are saved by being led of the Spirit but the blood that washes away our sins allows us to be led of the Spirit to be Christlike.'

Monstrous statement! Matt, do you read your Bible daily? Have you given your testimony in church as to how you were saved? Anyone who makes a monstrous statement like this is declaring that he has no idea whatsoever of what it is to be born again (born of the Spirit from heaven above).
We are saved by the blood of Jesus but we must allow the Spirit to lead us to stay saved.