Pentecostalism's sketchy origins

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

Aidan1

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2021
1,680
705
113
From Jesus' own MOUTH, He said:

15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;

18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
What Did Yeshua say?

1) Go and Preach to the World
2) He that BELIEVES and IS BAPTIZED is saved and not be damned

How will you know Who is SAVED?
From Verse 17:
1) they will have SIGNS that follow them

What are these SIGNS that follow those who are SAVED and BELIEVE?
1) They will Cast of Devils
2) They will Speak with new TONGUES
3) like Paul did when picking up drift wood a Venomous snake bit him and nothing happened
4) If they drink something deadly it will not hurt them
5) They shall lay hands on the sick and the sick will be HEALED


You claim to be saved.
Which of the 5 SIGNS of being SAVED have you been able to do?

Have you ever cast out devils?
Have you ever Spoke in Tongues?
Have you ever been bitten by a poisonous snake and the Faith God gave you was better than modern medicine?
Have you ever been poisoned by no fault of your own and survived?
Have you ever put your hands on someone and prayed for healing and they were healed?

If you've never done any of these things, do you believe you are saved?

And REMEMBER, this is Christ saying this. And His Words are the SAME yesterday-today-forever. So they NEVER change.

What have you done that the SIGNS that follow you tell me you're SAVED?
Complain about Pentecostals and Speaking in Tongues?
Yeah, that is DEFINITELY YOUR SIGNS!
A Complainer of God's Holy Word!
If your theory would be rigtht. Then worldwide are only pentecostals and charismatics are saved. All other christian believers then gone lost.
Will you say this. That only pentecostals and charismatics are children of God?
 

Aidan1

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2021
1,680
705
113
no, but all the gifts are to every Christian as The Holy Spirit enables. YOU think they hAVE STOPPED BUT HAVE NO PROOF from the word of God. Those like you say " it had to go away or we would see it and the news would report it".
Here is something you don't either in your church those getting saved and healed yet you say why are healing not happening I agree,


Why are you not seeing it at your church? Don't you pray for people? That right you pray God's will yet you don't see in the word of God where Jesus desires to heal people through you. You are just afraid and have no faith. Do all get saved? No, does that means we don't try to lead them to Christ? NO! Do all get healed? no! does that mean we don't cry out to God for one to be healed in the name of Jesus and believe HE will do t, and if it doesn't happen accept the answer. You think one is causing false hope? No, those who think such have no hope.
I answered to the claim that all believers which are baptised with the Holy Spirit receive the gift of speaking in tongues.
Paul clear says, that this is not.
So why you bring up different points instead to answer of my point and try to show me that I am wrong? Maby you cant show me from the bible that I am wrong?
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
12,170
4,000
113
Bro. I don't hate you. Why I should? Because you have a different view?
Please your comment as you have been told has been hateful so don't tell me you love me when you suggest I have a devil or receiving from the Holy Spirit something that is of the devil. You are a liar. Not only in this post but many others on the topic you have said many times those who speak in tongues are fake pagan and of the devil. You meant those things when you said them.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
12,170
4,000
113
I answered to the claim that all believers which are baptised with the Holy Spirit receive the gift of speaking in tongues.
Paul clear says, that this is not.
So why you bring up different points instead to answer of my point and try to show me that I am wrong? Maby you cant show me from the bible that I am wrong?
you have been shown.
 
Jun 9, 2021
1,871
425
83
If your theory would be rigtht. Then worldwide are only pentecostals and charismatics are saved. All other christian believers then gone lost.
Will you say this. That only pentecostals and charismatics are children of God?
No, if my theory is right, then we are all held to what Christ said, not to what Denominations claim. And it just so happens that Pentecostals follow what Jesus says in Mark 16.

The real question then, Why does your Denomination [NOT FOLLOW AND OBEY] what Jesus said?
 

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
Apr 21, 2021
7,501
3,116
113
The growth comes because we win souls. let's talk about those errors which you perceive and the truth that sets us free.
I'll answer your question if you first answer mine? Where exactly in the New Testament does it predict an end-time worldwide revival. :)
 

ResidentAlien

Well-known member
Apr 21, 2021
7,501
3,116
113
There are different kinds of peace, a graveyard is quite peaceful and orderly, the graves are set out in neat rows.
I agree. But that's not what Paul's talking about in this context. He's calling for orderly worship in a church that had gotten out of control.

It has been suggested, based on the example from Acts 2:13, that it's somehow a good thing to be out of control to the point of being mocked by bystanders as being "drunk." If that was such a good thing, why didn't Paul congratulate the Corinthians for being "drunk and disorderly" in the Spirit? Why didn't he say "good job, let's have more of this?"
 
Jun 9, 2021
1,871
425
83
I'll answer your question if you first answer mine? Where exactly in the New Testament does it predict an end-time worldwide revival. :)

Not sure why that is a Doctrine or perceived as a Doctrine. What that teaching is that [we NEED an end time Revival], not that there will be one. But Acts 2:17 and Joel 2:28 both states: In the last days it will be, God declares, that I will pour out my Spirit upon all flesh.

Now, if we are in the Last Days before the beginning of Tribulation, this Verse should fit right in that time frame. If God does pour out His Spirit onto all flesh, 8 billion plus, that has the spark to creating an End Time Revival!
 
Jun 9, 2021
1,871
425
83
I agree. But that's not what Paul's talking about in this context. He's calling for orderly worship in a church that had gotten out of control.

It has been suggested, based on the example from Acts 2:13, that it's somehow a good thing to be out of control to the point of being mocked by bystanders as being "drunk." If that was such a good thing, why didn't Paul congratulate the Corinthians for being "drunk and disorderly" in the Spirit? Why didn't he say "good job, let's have more of this?"
You mean Paul would frown upon Peter and the Upper Room? If God was upset, Peter would not have made the impact he did all throughout the Book of Acts. I think it's safe to say that Peter's example is acceptable to God!
 
Jun 9, 2021
1,871
425
83
If so I dont would ask for.

If i may ask, what Denomination are you?
And since the mainstream Denominations like Baptist, Wesleyan, Methodist, Presbyterian, Catholic, United Church of Christ all now accept and allow same sex Preachers/Pastors/Bible teachers, have you ever been in a church service when a HOMOSEXUAL man was preaching?
 

Aidan1

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2021
1,680
705
113
No, if my theory is right, then we are all held to what Christ said, not to what Denominations claim. And it just so happens that Pentecostals follow what Jesus says in Mark 16.

The real question then, Why does your Denomination [NOT FOLLOW AND OBEY] what Jesus said?
Im thankful that your view is not right. Not the signs are the proof to belong to Jesus.
Many people today running and searching for signs and miracles. Jesus said that there will be people who have done miracles and cadtvout demons and the Lord will say: i dont know you.
Btw, my personell opinion is that there is no denomination which can claime to be 100% right in all biblical issues.
The leaders of my church are open for charismatic/pentecostal issues, without practising it in the church.
 
Jun 9, 2021
1,871
425
83
Im thankful that your view is not right. Not the signs are the proof to belong to Jesus.
Many people today running and searching for signs and miracles. Jesus said that there will be people who have done miracles and cadtvout demons and the Lord will say: i dont know you.
Btw, my personell opinion is that there is no denomination which can claime to be 100% right in all biblical issues.
The leaders of my church are open for charismatic/pentecostal issues, without practising it in the church.

How are my Mark 16 views wrong if Jesus is the One who said them and I am quoting Jesus?

Are you calling Jesus a Liar?

You have to be, because nothing I said was my own opinion but I am copying the Words of Jesus!
 
Jun 9, 2021
1,871
425
83
Im thankful that your view is not right. Not the signs are the proof to belong to Jesus.
Many people today running and searching for signs and miracles. Jesus said that there will be people who have done miracles and cadtvout demons and the Lord will say: i dont know you.
Btw, my personell opinion is that there is no denomination which can claime to be 100% right in all biblical issues.
The leaders of my church are open for charismatic/pentecostal issues, without practising it in the church.

You really don't have a clue do you?
 
Jun 9, 2021
1,871
425
83
I quote Jesus Christ, Who is [ALL] of our Lord and Savior, and you call my quotes lies, Jesus Words a lie?
 

Aidan1

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2021
1,680
705
113
Please your comment as you have been told has been hateful so don't tell me you love me when you suggest I have a devil or receiving from the Holy Spirit something that is of the devil. You are a liar. Not only in this post but many others on the topic you have said many times those who speak in tongues are fake pagan and of the devil. You meant those things when you said them.
What I said is that I cant find the pentecostal teaching about the baptising with the Holy Spirit and as sign for this is given the gift of speaking in tongues is taught in the bible to other believers.
And till today nobody could Show me the opposit.
Yes, if there are side effects of this baptism as it is found in spiritism, to which concluision I should come?
Why I should believe a man made doctrine without testing i with the word of God?. Why the Lord gave me the gift to discern spirits?
 

Aidan1

Well-known member
Mar 17, 2021
1,680
705
113
I quote Jesus Christ, Who is [ALL] of our Lord and Savior, and you call my quotes lies, Jesus Words a lie?
Are all teachings and promisses Jesus gave for us today?
 

Evmur

Well-known member
Feb 28, 2021
4,856
2,515
113
London
christianchat.com
I agree. But that's not what Paul's talking about in this context. He's calling for orderly worship in a church that had gotten out of control.

It has been suggested, based on the example from Acts 2:13, that it's somehow a good thing to be out of control to the point of being mocked by bystanders as being "drunk." If that was such a good thing, why didn't Paul congratulate the Corinthians for being "drunk and disorderly" in the Spirit? Why didn't he say "good job, let's have more of this?"
I have never been a holy roller but I certainly know what it is like to reel a little in meetings where there is what might be described as "a weight of glory" some folks wouldn't even know what that is, some folks never experience the Holy Spirit's presence in a meeting at all.

How is overflowing joy manifested? huh? do you stand like statues?

I love the story of a senior perhaps Britain's most senior Evangelical leader's wife who of course were very critical of the Toronto blessing, so she decided to do an article for the women's section of a magazine. She with a friend decided to go in person to a meeting to witness first hand the shenanigans.

She slipped in at the back, but no sooner had she entered the meeting and kerzzzapp

She was flat on her back, slain in the Spirit ... and so wonderful was the experience that she did not get up any time soon.

See you don't like all this but you've got to stop it, all the growling and backbiting ... God really, really does not like it. That doesn't mean everything is ok. But it is in meetings where people express themselves in what you feel is somewhat unseeming ways that people are getting free from all manner of bondages and addictions and inner hurts and prejudices go right out of the window.

Just accept that people are different and have different ways of expressing themselves.

I am not one to roll about in the aisles but certainly I like to dance a little and shout praise to the Lord and like as not I'm apt to hug somebody and tell them I love them.

And I am the most British person you'll ever meet.