Walk : After the Spirit

[Kidron]

We ourselves have never had to deal with that in any shape or form.
But we have always had to deal with SIN, .

The reason you had to deal with sin, is not because of the fall of Satan.
So, where you go that idea, isn't found in the NT.
The reason you deal with sin, is because of the fall of Adam.
In the Garden, there was no transgression, because where there is no law there is no Transgression.

What Adam did was not break a LAW, as there were no laws yet.
Those came later with Moses.
What Adam did was disobey, in rebellion..

Satan did the same, and that is not because there was SIN in heaven.....
It was because there was SIN in LUCIFER.

 

[Kidron]

We were never Hebrew People under the LAW, we're Gentiles after the LAW was fulfilled. Our sin is no different than Eve's or those who were under the LAW. The LAW is not sin, they are LAWS not to commit these sins.

Paul , the apostle to the gentiles, in the time of the Gentiles wrote.....>"Christ has redeemed us from the Curse of the Law".
"we are not under the law, but under Grace".

These verses are NT verses, written to the body of Christ.

 

[SophieT]

Not Against the Brother at all, just want him to think of the LAW where it properly fits God's Plan:

well now see here...I never said you were against him, which would be personal; I asked why you were against what he was posting...a big difference there

perhaps your understanding of the law is also flawed?

The LAW was given by God to show if they do this [act] it is a sin because of this [Reason]. But the sin always existed before the Law, at the Fall of Satan. Sin was already in all of its forms by the time the Hebrew Slaves were given the LAW. Not only did God destroy the Earth with Water before the LAW, He destroyed Sodom and G. SIN was a natural human calamity.

are you now teaching sin 101?

Why then was the law given? It was added because of transgressions, until the arrival of the seed to whom the promise referred. It was administered through angels by a mediator. Galatians 3:19

The LAW [is not] sin, it defines sin.
The LAW is the dictionary of a sin and what it means against God.

who said the law was sin? I have only seen you say that.

Now, had the LAW been given before SIN, be different idealism.
The LAW is a God Dictionary of this SIN = this grievance.

what are you trying to say? you seem confused as to why the law was given, even though you have more than one place in scripture that will tell you exactly why it was given.

The LAW is a God Dictionary of this SIN

it is? so any sin I can commit outside of what is mentioned in scripture is not sin?

 

[SophieT]

We ourselves have never had to deal with that in any shape or form.
But we have always had to deal with SIN, which we could use the Dictionary from God, the LAW, and we can know the SIN and its Grievance to God.

you CAN'T deal with sin. have you dealt with sin or did Christ deal with sin on your behalf?

there is no dictionary from God...either that is your idea or you received that construct from someone else that does not understand what they are talking about

sin is not grievance. the wages of sin is death. that is not a grievance. that is eternal separation from your Creator

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Most of what you wrote is related to discipleship.
All WORKS , or self effort, that a believer DOES............that is not salvation, that is Discipleship.

Walking after the Spirit is not to try to copy the deeds of Jesus.
Its to exist in the place of real faith, in your belief system, your renewed mind.

ok well thanks for the talk anyways God bless

 

[Blade]

The reason you had to deal with sin, is not because of the fall of Satan.
So, where you go that idea, isn't found in the NT.
The reason you deal with sin, is because of the fall of Adam.
In the Garden, there was no transgression, because where there is no law there is no Transgression.

What Adam did was not break a LAW, as there were no laws yet.
Those came later with Moses.
What Adam did was disobey, in rebellion..

Satan did the same, and that is not because there was SIN in heaven.....
It was because there was SIN in LUCIFER.

In this world after Adam and Eve yes things were done because there was no law. It seems were dancing around with words no offense. Saying "disobey, rebellion" What was found in Satan was evil, inequity. Yes its written power of sin is the law. Sin was already there before the law. Again calling it rebellion or disobey it is still missing the mark. No law was needed.. if God said don't eat and you do.. its wrong. Before the law He told them..if you eat of this tree you will die. The price of sin is death. That has not Changed. How I see it.

 

[AandW]

The reason you had to deal with sin, is not because of the fall of Satan.
So, where you go that idea, isn't found in the NT.
The reason you deal with sin, is because of the fall of Adam.
In the Garden, there was no transgression, because where there is no law there is no Transgression.

What Adam did was not break a LAW, as there were no laws yet.
Those came later with Moses.
What Adam did was disobey, in rebellion..

Satan did the same, and that is not because there was SIN in heaven.....
It was because there was SIN in LUCIFER.

Eve's sin DAMNED us all to hell well before the LAW existed.
Sin happened before the LAW.
The LAW is not Sin [how misconceived does one have to be to believe God gave us SIN called the LAW]?

 

[AandW]

Paul , the apostle to the gentiles, in the time of the Gentiles wrote.....>"Christ has redeemed us from the Curse of the Law".
"we are not under the law, but under Grace".

These verses are NT verses, written to the body of Christ.

He said that to the Jews!

The Gentiles were not being held by the LAW.

 

[AandW]

who said the law was sin? I have only seen you say that.

From the one you're standing firm on!
"The power of sin is the Law".

There are NO connections to SIN and the power of SIN with the LAW of God!

 

[Pilgrimshope]

the law was given to reveal sin...Romans

nobody's pride and arrogance is broken. take a look around. does it look to you like people are having their pride and arrogance broken?

I can't even say that about many believers....pride and arrogance these days are treated like spiritual gifts in many places with people trying to assume the authority of God by changing the Bible and acting outside of the Bible and putting false prophets before the Bible

God has NOT said in most cases

no one is saying Christians are judged by the law...so why do some of you keep saying you are not under law? sounds to me like maybe you are not so sure

Why then was the law given? It was added because of transgressions, until the arrival of the seed to whom the promise referred. It was administered through angels by a mediator. Galatians 3:19

“Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭3:19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“”nobody's pride and arrogance is broken. “

yes they don’t allow the law do what it’s meant to do it’s meant to “shut the mouths of the self righteous who seek God by the works of the law and show them that all men are guilty before God “

your right lol. I one receives the word so they never come to this acceptable place

“The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.”
‭‭Psalm‬ ‭51:17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

God requires humility before Christ once the law holds us guilty and sentences us to death , we then better find some place for this part

“Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.

But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.”
‭‭James‬ ‭1:21-22‬ ‭KJV‬‬

My point wasn’t the state of the world or church , but what it says the intent of the law was to shut the mouths of men , and hold all
Guilty by giving us the knowledge of sins

without that the gospel makes no sense who needs forgiveness if the y don’t know thier sins or won’t acknowledge them? The law was to bring the world to Jesus in that way

“Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:24-25‬ ‭KJV‬‬

if we don’t forst know we’re a sinner and headed for hell , we can never find the value and worth of the gospel and take up the cross

 

[AandW]

Excellent Verse:
“Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:24-25‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[SophieT]

From the one you're standing firm on!
"The power of sin is the Law".

There are NO connections to SIN and the power of SIN with the LAW of God!

I didn't think you could get more confusing

you have proven me wrong

 

[tstumf]

Was reading Romans tonight and this scripture reminded me of this conversation here on CC. Haven’t seen where anyone mentioned it yet but please read Romans 7 :7-13
(The law and Sin) not sure weather it’s helpful or not but thought it was worth a mention on this thread.

 

[AandW]

I didn't think you could get more confusing

you have proven me wrong

From the one you're standing firm on!

Interesting, the first sentence is from a post I was making when I decided to delete it but the first sentence of my post shows it was not deleted.


What the post should have looked like:
Kidron said:
"The power of sin is the Law".

AandW said:
There are NO connections to SIN and the power of SIN with the LAW of God!

 

[Kidron]

. Sin was already there before the law.

Look closely.

"where there is no Law, there is no transgression".
This does not mean a person can't be disobedient.

Let me show you what i mean.
In Heaven, there is no Law. So, when "Iniquity" was found IN Lucifer, it was not found in Heaven.
It was found in Him.
Same with Adam.
It was found in him, and HE fell, which. brought the fall to us all.

 

[Kidron]

Eve's sin DAMNED us all to hell well before the LAW existed.
Sin happened before the LAW.
The LAW is not Sin [how misconceived does one have to be to believe God gave us SIN called the LAW]?

I have no idea what you are trying to prove.

But notice this.......> In Heaven, there is no Law, and there is no sin. Yet, Lucifer had sin in him....>"iniquity was found IN HIM">.

Same with Adam.......Adam lived before the law was given, and his sin of disobedience caused His spirit to become separated from God's Spirit.
This was his "Spiritual Death". and this is passed to all humans.
The remedy for this, is to be born again, as this restores Spiritual Union, between God and man.

Water baptism does not do this.
Keeping commandments can not do this.

Jesus said...."You MUST be born again", if you are to receive "the GIFT of Righteousness'""""" That is our restoration back into the Spirit of God.

 

[Kidron]

He said that to the Jews!

The Gentiles were not being held by the LAW.

In the time of the Gentiles there are 2 Dominions.

1. Law

2. Grace.

Every person is UNDER one of those dominions at all times.

The born again are ""not under the law but under Grace" because. ""Christ has redeemed us from the CURSE OF THE LAW".

 

[AandW]

Look closely.

"where there is no Law, there is no transgression".

That's because only when you live for God, there [is] a difference in the choices you make and actions you choose to complete.
If you don't live for God, then you won't worry about sinning.
When you live for God, there is a [real difference] between SIN and the Blood and Death of Christ.

But the LAW is Old Testament.
And Paul has gone through and pointed examples of [this was the LAW and how it use to be]. And then Paul explains, since the Cross, the LAW no longer has power over you. Christ is your Savior from the LAW. The LAW does not control your Status with God any more.

And Remember, Paul is still preaching to the Jews.

He doesn't become Teacher of the Gentiles until a Few Letters later. This is when we read Peter over Jews, Paul over Gentiles. So what you're reading from Paul [where there is no Law, there is no transgression], he is speaking to the JEWS, not to the Gentiles. The LAW only relates to the JEWS, not to the Gentiles!

 

[Kidron]

And Remember, Paul is still preaching to the Jews.

!

This is the difficult part for the believer to understand..
Which is....
When we are no longer under the Law, ....as "Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the Law", .... so then = the law has no more
authority to define us as a sinner, or our carnal behavior, as a "sin"

Romans 4:8 says that God does not charge sin to the born again.
Why not?
Because we are not under the Law., we are "under Grace".

Notice this verse......."you are not under the law, but UNDER GRACE"

And what does it mean to be under Grace?....Its means your born again SPIRIT is not under the Law, anymore, if you are born again.

 

[AandW]

In the time of the Gentiles there are 2 Dominions.

1. Law

2. Grace.

Every person is UNDER one of those dominions at all times.

The born again are ""not under the law but under Grace" because. ""Christ has redeemed us from the CURSE OF THE LAW".

God had MERCY upon the Jews being under the LAW through Christ, but He gave us GRACE by allowing us to be part of His Kingdom! Gentiles were never a part of God's Kingdom. And God designed it that way. Gentiles lived/died/going to burn forever by God's Design!

When Christ died, Gentiles were granted Grace to be in God's Fold [that has NOTHING to do with the Hebrew LAW]!


You're not a Jew that can trace your Heritage back to 70 A.D. and beyond. The LAW only applies to the JEWS!