Doctrine of Unconditional Election

[eternally-gratefull]

What was revealed to Rebekah before the children were born?

Romans 9:12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.



Romans 9:

10 And not only this; but when Rebecca also had conceived by one, even by our father Isaac;

11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth; )

12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.



Genesis 25:

22 And the children struggled together within her; and she said, If it be so, why am I thus? And she went to enquire of the LORD.

23 And the LORD said unto her, Two nations are in thy womb, and two manner of people shall be separated from thy bowels; and the one people shall be stronger than the other people; and the elder shall serve the younger.

Yes

and what is funny Is the elder BROTHER never served the younger He spent most of his life in hiding for fear his younger would kill him

In the end. The YOUNGER served the ELDER..

 

[eternally-gratefull]

[Gal 5:22 KJV] 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

True faith is given only through the Holy Spirit as one of His fruit upon becoming born-again. Just as one cannot give themselves
the Holy Spirit, neither can one give himself true faith (if that's what you're talking about). It is a gift. By this, those saved then receive their faith. Any supposed faith one might produce in-and-of themselves, would be an imperfect man-based faith, and as such, incapable of equating to, or providing righteousness. Only Christ's faith is perfect and therefore equal to righteousness

[Phl 3:9 KJV] 9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:

Two different types of faith here my friend.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You don't see my replies in your posts above ?
In my opinion, the gift of God is God. With Him, and through the Holy Spirit, comes all other spiritual gifts.

What about the gift of salvation?

Is that not the gift of Eph 2? Not God?

It is BEING SAVED BY GRACE

 

[rogerg]

What about the gift of salvation?

God is salvation

 

[rogerg]

Two different types of faith here my friend.

Impossible. Faith manifests itself into different attributes, but there is only one faith

[Eph 4:5-6 KJV] 5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
6 One God and Father of all, who [is] above all, and through all, and in you all.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

God is salvation

I did not ask that

I asked about eph 2, where Paul stated our salvation was the gift of God. by grace THROUGH FAITH. not of works.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Impossible. Faith manifests itself into different attributes, but there is only one faith

[Eph 4:5-6 KJV] 5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
6 One God and Father of all, who [is] above all, and through all, and in you all.

There is on faith that saved

But my faith that saves is not the only faith.

I do not get the spirit UNTIL I am saved and recieve him. So the gift of faith you speak of as fruit of the spirit. can not be the faith that gives salvation.

That would be the gift of salvation and Gods word which leads us to faith

 

[rogerg]

There is on faith that saved

But my faith that saves is not the only faith.

I do not get the spirit UNTIL I am saved and recieve him. So the gift of faith you speak of as fruit of the spirit. can not be the faith that gives salvation.

That would be the gift of salvation and Gods word which leads us to faith

[Eph 4:4-6 KJV]
4 [There is] one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
6 One God and Father of all, who [is] above all, and through all, and in you all.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

[Eph 4:4-6 KJV]
4 [There is] one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
6 One God and Father of all, who [is] above all, and through all, and in you all.

You can post this until your blue in the face.

It does not help you

This passage is talking about the faith of salvation. There is just one

It is not talking about the fruit of the spirit which is faith in different aspects of our life. Which has NOTHING TO DO with salvation.

 

[rogerg]

I did not ask that

I asked about eph 2, where Paul stated our salvation was the gift of God. by grace THROUGH FAITH. not of works.

"through faith": through Christ's faith. If it is the gift of God as you state, then, well, it is solely a gift -- a gift received when
God is received and by nothing we have done, or can do

 

[rogerg]

You can post this until your blue in the face.

It does not help you

This passage is talking about the faith of salvation. There is just one

It is not talking about the fruit of the spirit which is faith in different aspects of our life. Which has NOTHING TO DO with salvation.

[Phl 2:13 KJV] 13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of [his] good pleasure.

Wait, did you actually read the verse I posted? It clearly says, ONE FAITH, not two. Don't you believe Scripture? Or, do you believe it ok to add to it? From that one faith, comes many attributes
And yes, I can and will post it until I'm blue in the face, or until you get it. You can't ignore it just because you don't like it
-- maybe the problem is your understanding?

Here it is again:

[Eph 4:4-6 KJV]
4 [There is] one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
6 One God and Father of all, who [is] above all, and through all, and in you all.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

[Phl 2:13 KJV] 13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of [his] good pleasure.

Wait, did you actually read the verse I posted? It clearly says, ONE FAITH, not two. Don't you believe Scripture? Or, do you believe it ok to add to it? From that one faith, comes many attributes

No I read it

ONE FAITH ONE LORD ONE BAPTISM

I AGREE

What I disagree is my faith in God for salvation is nt the same as my faith in God for other things in my life. If that was true I would perfectly trust God for everything, the fact is I do not. God has gifted people with much greater faith than I have in areas.

I guess this is lost on you? You do not see these things?

And yes, I can and will post it until I'm blue in the face, or until you get it. You can't ignore it just because you don't like it

I got it 30 years ago. I wil not see it your way Because your wrong.

-- maybe the problem is your understanding?

Or maybe the problem is YOUR UNDERSTANDING?

Here it is again:

My responses are in bold text

[Eph 4:4-6 KJV]
4 [There is] one body, (the church)

and one Spirit (the Holy Spirit)

, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; (one gospel In the hope of eternal life who God, who can not lie promised before time began)
5 One Lord, The Lord Jesus Christ

one faith,(One faith which saved, Faith in Christ. Not faith in Christ plus works. which is another faith

one baptism, (Holy spirit baptism is what saved, Not water baptism
6 One God and Father of all, (amen, One Father

who above all, and through all, and in you all. Yep. He has been in me for about 45 years now..

Now are you going to try to school me again on what??

 

[rogerg]

What I disagree is my faith in God for salvation is nt the same as my faith in God for other things in my life. If that was true I would perfectly trust God for everything, the fact is I do not. God has gifted people with much greater faith than I have in areas.

I guess this is lost on you? You do not see these things?

Oh I understand you ,but your belief is in direct contradiction to what the Bible clearly teaches. You can't make
it so by saying it enough times. You choose not to be lead by the Bible, but instead by your own thoughts
of how you want it instead of how it actually is

 

[fredoheaven]

[Gal 5:22 KJV] 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

True faith is given only through the Holy Spirit as one of His fruit upon becoming born-again. Just as one cannot give themselves
the Holy Spirit, neither can one give himself true faith (if that's what you're talking about). It is a gift. By this, those saved then receive their faith. Any supposed faith one might produce in-and-of themselves, would be an imperfect man-based faith, and as such, incapable of equating to, or providing righteousness. Only Christ's faith is perfect and therefore equal to righteousness

[Phl 3:9 KJV] 9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:

Of course, we are going back to the same old days. It’s easy to pinpoint Galatians as a prooftext without understanding. The letter to the Galatian churches, those saved already by the grace of God through faith Galatians 3:26 “For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus”. Now in the passage given above, Paul shows the works of the flesh as against the fruit of the Holy Spirit which includes the faith. Here, faith is the God-given ability to live or walk by faith. The saving faith produces salvation when one “believe on/in Christ” and the practical daily faith of the believers are in reality the one bears from the Holy Spirit. Yes, this faith is given to those who are already saved, not in order to be saved, remember, Paul is speaking to the saved brethren, to the churches of Galatia. He is not in any reference to the outside, hence. It is called the fruit and never a root. By putting Phil 3:9 into a Calvinist frame would contradict the scripture I cited about “faith in Christ Jesus” so something must be wrong in that kind of interpretation. According to Paul, the “faith of” is to “believe in”. Yes the faith of Christ fulfills the law. God righteousness is revealed from faith to faith Romans 1:17. Yes nothing would I bring, simply to thy cross I cling. The sinner is saved by faith. He is justified by faith and now “the just shall live by faith”.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Oh I understand you ,but your belief is in direct contradiction to what the Bible clearly teaches. You can't make
it so by saying it enough times. You choose not to be lead by the Bible, but instead by your own thoughts
of how you want it instead of how it actually is

This is your opinion

You have yet to prove this point

Its sounds like an excuse I expect from the catholics. Only they use private interpretation.

It helps you no more than it helps them.

I am led by the word. And if this is the only argument you have. Then you are unable to help me or anyone for that matter

When you come into a chatroom and say listen to me or your not listening to God. Listen to me, or your not listening to the bible

You come across as proud and unteachable

 

[rogerg]

Of course, we are going back to the same old days. It’s easy to pinpoint Galatians as a prooftext without understanding. The letter to the Galatian churches, those saved already by the grace of God through faith Galatians 3:26 “For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus”.

[Gal 3:23 KJV] 23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.

"faith came"; faith was given to them; it came

Faith is given by the Holy Spirit to the Elect. It is by the presence/exhibiting/recognizing of that faith are we informed we are of the Children of God, but not the reverse. I'm not going to go through your entire reply now

 

[eternally-gratefull]

and there he goes with his red X again, because he can't show where I am wrong with what I say

Thank you sir. this just strengthens my FAITH in the word of God and what I see.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

[Gal 3:23 KJV] 23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.

"faith came"; faith was given to them; it came

Faith is given by the Holy Spirit to the Elect. It is by the presence/exhibiting/recognizing of that faith are we informed we are of the Children of God, but not the reverse. I'm not going to go through your entire reply now

Where did they get this faith from?

Magic from heaven?

Or from the word?

 

[rogerg]

Where did they get this faith from?

From Christ. Christ, though the Holy Spirit. This must be the 10th (at least) time I've posted this to you. Is there something about it
that you can't comprehend?

[Gal 5:22 KJV] 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

 

[rogerg]

and there he goes with his red X again, because he can't show where I am wrong with what I say

Thank you sir. this just strengthens my FAITH in the word of God and what I see.

All I've been doing is showing you. For some reason you are unable to grasp it. Maybe I shouldn't be, but I get
tired reposting the same answers over and over again. So, when you see a red 'x' ,just refer back to a prior post of mine
for an answer