The Call of Abraham, our calling too...How will we respond? (Gen 12-17)

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

BenAvraham

Senior Member
Aug 30, 2015
914
288
63
#1
PARASHAH: “Lech Lecha” (go forth yourself) GENESIS 12:1-17:27


“Now YHVH said unto Abram: Get thee out of thy country and from thy kindred, and from thy father’s house, unto a land that I will show thee” these are the opening words that YHVH speaks unto Abram. A Midrash interprets this to mean; “Go forth to find your authentic self to learn who you are meant to be”

This might be a command to every person on earth. We are to “go forth” and find “Adonai” and discover who He intends us to be! Our destiny should be entirely in HIS hands. If you hear His voice, how will you respond? or rather, how will "we" respond? with YES, here I am! or "later dude, I'm doing my own thing now."

Now we might ask, “why did YHVH choose Abram to begin his chosen people?” No one really knows the “why?” only that he DID choose him. Perhaps he had a curious and searching mind, searching for the real and true God.

We must remember that there was no such person as a “Jew” back then. Abram was a Mesopotamian, from the Chaldean city of “Ur” similar to the Hebrew “Ir” which means “city”. He was raised as an idol worshipper, and his family’s business, according to the rabbis, was making and selling idols.

Hebrew tradition teaches that when Abram was young, he attended the “School of Shem”. Shem, the son of Noah taught youths about the true God, Adonai-Elohim, the great El Shaddai, so, Abram might have known something about Elohim from Shem, that is if the story is true. But like I said, it is a story based on tradition.

We only know that YHVH chose Abram, and he accepted and obeyed the voice of YHVH. Here is a commandment and the blessings of obeying the commandment. “Leave your father’s house and go to a land which I will show you.” We see that G-d wanted Abram to distance himself from idol worshipping and everything connected with such. Once he obeyed the voice of HaShem, THEN… the blessings would come;

“I will make of thee a great nation”, “I will bless thee and make thy name great (shem Gadol) and be thou a blessing”, “I will bless them that bless thee and curse them that curse thee”, “In thee shall all the families of the world be blessed” we later see that under “being a great nation” we could add the promise; “Your seed will be like the dust of the earth” and also “like the stars of heaven” What do these promises involve?

First of all, let’s look at the words; “Dust of the earth” and “stars of heaven”. Am Israel becoming like the “dust” of the earth, in that they were “trampled upon” by many nations that wanted to extinguish the Jewish people, yet they were also as the “stars of heaven” they shone with the light of Adonai, they brought the worship of the ONE true GOD, Adonai-Elohim-Yeshuah. And from Am Israel, came “Yeshua” who is the “Light of the World”

Once that Abram obey the voice of YHVH, and he arrived in the land of Canaan, then came the testings.

We see that Adonai wanted to test his faith like He tests us all in many different ways. Yes, we all want blessings, but at times, blessings come with a price.

“Am Gadol” a great nation or a great people. It started with Yitzchak, the first and only son of Abram and Sarah. From him we know the story; Yitzchak > Ya’akov > 12 tribes > multitudes! As a sign, YHVH changed the name of Abram to Abraham. If we look at the paleo Hebrew symbolism in the name “Abram” we see “Alef” “Beit” “resh” “mem”. 4 letters, “4” symbolized the 4 corners of the earth. The descendants of Abraham are in all 4 corners of the earth. But we can see these letters meaning or symbolizing “the father who is the head of a multitude”. Also, we can read this as; God blesses the first house with a multitude”.

Later, YHVH changes his name by adding the letter “hey” (h). Now it is “abraHam”. What is the significance of the “H”? Well, one way we can look at it is that the “hey” (h) is the only letter in the Hebrew Alef-bet that is pronounced with one “breathing out air”. When you pronounce “h” we send out a puff of air from our mouth. We can also say “wind” in Hebrew; “Ruach” it also means “spirit”. SO…we can say that “YHVH sent out the “spirit of life” into the womb of Sarah through the seed of Abraham. Also, the ancient meaning of the letter “hey” is “Behold!” so, we can say “Behold, a multitude is coming from Abraham and Sarah!” starting with Yitzchak.

Yet we cannot forget about Ishmael, who was the son of Abraham and Hagar, the Egyptian. The promise extended to him too, although this was not part of God’s “perfect” will. He “permitted” the union between Abraham and Hagar, yet with consequences; the Arab nations who are the enemies of Israel. “Ishmael” means “God listens (to man)” “Ish+shema+El. (reading right to left) HOWEVER, if we read from left to right we get “Man listens to God” and every man that listens to God, in obedience, whether Arab or any other ethnic identity, that man will be blessed also.

Adonai stated also that “in thee, all of the families of the world would be blessed”. The greatest blessing is in Yeshua HaMashiach. From the seed of Abraham, came the nation of Israel, and we know that Mary and Joseph, the guardians of Yeshua were of the seed of Abraham, and more closely, the seed of David. We need to look not so much at physical blessings, nor biological/genealogical blessings. We might be of Jewish ancestry, but that does not secure for us salvation, we need to look at Yeshua our Messiah, who is our “Yeshuateinu” (our salvation)

This chapter also states that “Abram took his wife Sarai and his brother’s son Lot, and all the wealth that they had amassed and the persons that they had acquired in Haran and they set out for the land of Canaan”

Some translations say “souls” instead of “persons”. We can assume that by these words “acquired persons or souls” that Abram and Sarai were “soul winners” that they converted many “souls” in Haran to the belief in the one TRUE GOD, that they abandoned the false deities and were thus “grafted in” sort of saying, into the “Mishpochah Abram” (the family of Abram) They also probably bought servants and slaves, and I am sure that they witnessed to them too.

The Word also states that Abraham acquired much “wealth” and took it with him of course. This wealth was in the form of gold, silver, and livestock. We all have internal “wealth” which is the knowledge and wisdom which comes from studying God’s word, and that is what we take with us where ever we go. We are to “share” this wealth with others through teaching and preaching the WORD and be witnesses of the “Living WORD”

Once they arrived in Canaan, they would be “Gerim” from the word “Ger” which means a “sojourner” that is a person who is not a native of that land, but who will live there. We could consider ourselves as “sojourners” on this planet called “earth” this earth is not our permanent home, even though we were born “earthlings” our true home is in Heaven, the New Jerusalem.

Now we look at Lot, Abraham’s nephew, Lot started arguing over land for cattle. So, Abraham says for him to select one area and he would go in the other direction. So, Lot chose “Sodom!” the land around it looked very fertile. That is the way the land of sin appears to people. It looks attractive. So, Lot pitched his tent TOWARDS Sodom…then…he actually enters and LIVES in Sodom. And so, it is with sin. We might get attracted to it, get closer to it, and finally, indulge in it! So, be careful!

Another fact we read is that Abram stopped in two places, “Shechem” and “Betel” there he built altars and worshiped Adonai there. We do the same, but we do not build stone altars. We worship Adonai in spirit and in truth. An interesting fact about the place “Beth-El, it means “House of God”. Yet the Canaanites worshiped a false deity which was also called “El” the difference between the god “El” of the Canaanites and “El Elyon” or “El Elohim” is that we worship the true EL, the “One who is Strong and who Leads and Instructs” as symbolized in the two Paleo-Hebrew letters; “Aleph and Lamed”

There were three promises made to Abraham. His seed would be like the dust of the earth. His seed would be like the stars of heaven, his seed would be like the sands of the sea. Can you count the stars? Can you count the grains of sand on the beach? Can you count dust? Here is something to think about. We walk on dust, we trample it underfoot. Israel has been trampled underfoot and has been looked down upon by many nations, yet, the dust still lasts, it will always be. Leave a car out in the desert for 50 years, and the dust will wear it away into rusted metal, yet the “dust” will always be, and so will Israel.

Circumcision! This is an important area, but some make it TOO important. YHVH instructed Abraham to be circumcised and that every male should also be circumcised. This was and is a mark of the covenant. But what about today? Is it still important? Yes, it is, but in the physical aspect of the same. For male health and cleanliness, it is good for every baby boy to be circumcised. YHVH is more concerned about our heart condition. Moshe stated that the “foreskin of our hearts should be circumcised”. Spiritually speaking, the “foreskin” of our hearts is the carnal ways that we all have, being that we are a fallen race and have the inbred original sin.

“So, circumcise your heart and stiffen your neck no longer” (Deut 10:16)
 
Sep 15, 2019
9,991
5,546
113
#2
Circumcision! This is an important area, but some make it TOO important. YHVH instructed Abraham to be circumcised and that every male should also be circumcised. This was and is a mark of the covenant. But what about today? Is it still important? Yes, it is, but in the physical aspect of the same.
In the physical aspect, or the spiritual? If it was important in the physical aspect, why did Paul preach against it for the Galatians?

For male health and cleanliness, it is good for every baby boy to be circumcised.
While I don't believe God would command something unhealthy for His people, there are also risks parents have to weigh up for this procedure. I understand in ancient times, it was a simpler (religious) process, whereas now, it is often done in hospitals and can present a greater level of risk dependent on staff skill and procedure used.

YHVH is more concerned about our heart condition. Moshe stated that the “foreskin of our hearts should be circumcised”. Spiritually speaking, the “foreskin” of our hearts is the carnal ways that we all have, being that we are a fallen race and have the inbred original sin.
While I agree that the "foreskin" of our hearts was indicative of our fallen race and inbred original sin, circumcision is a state, is it not? Either we are in right relationship with God (covenanted) or we are not (uncircumcised hearts)? The carnal ways we all have are not often miraculously removed at conversion, and we go through a sanctification process where these are put away. So I'm not sure sanctification is the same as circumcision of the heart, but more the process that follows it.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#3
PARASHAH: “Lech Lecha” (go forth yourself) GENESIS 12:1-17:27


“Now YHVH said unto Abram: Get thee out of thy country and from thy kindred, and from thy father’s house, unto a land that I will show thee” )
The kingdom of the Hebrews was a kingdom that prophesied the kingdom that Jesus brought to us.

John and Baptist said God sent Jesus to tell us": Matt. 3: 2 andsaying, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is near.”.

The kingdom of Israel had many earthly type commands and earthly rewards that were a prophecy of the kingdom that Christ brought to us. As all kingdoms are, they had laws to go by.

Now, we are to be citizens of the kingdom of heaven. Christ is the president, the CEO, the leader of this kingdom, and we give him leadership with complete faith in his lead. If there is a conflict between the laws of the kingdom of the world we live in and the kingdom that Jesus tells us of, then our loyalties much be with the kingdom of heaven. This kingdom is eternal, if we decide to choose the kingdom of the world we are choosing a temporary kingdom. We must choose what we have faith in.
 

justbyfaith

Well-known member
Sep 16, 2021
4,707
462
83
#4
Isa 51:1, Hearken to me, ye that follow after righteousness, ye that seek the LORD: look unto the rock whence ye are hewn, and to the hole of the pit whence ye are digged.
Isa 51:2, Look unto Abraham your father, and unto Sarah that bare you: for I called him alone, and blessed him, and increased him.


Gen 15:6, And <Abraham> believed in the LORD; and he counted it to him for righteousness.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#5
Isa 51:1, Hearken to me, ye that follow after righteousness, ye that seek the LORD: look unto the rock whence ye are hewn, and to the hole of the pit whence ye are digged.
Isa 51:2, Look unto Abraham your father, and unto Sarah that bare you: for I called him alone, and blessed him, and increased him.


Gen 15:6, And <Abraham> believed in the LORD; and he counted it to him for righteousness.
How many Christians today believe everything Jesus told them with absolute faith in the rightness of his instructions? How about what Jesus said about our enemies? Or about the treasures we are to gather? How important is appearances to Christians? How important is entertainment to Christians as opposed to contentment and joy?

Christianity is shedding the world's values one by one and accepting the values of the Lord within us.
 

justbyfaith

Well-known member
Sep 16, 2021
4,707
462
83
#6
How many Christians today believe everything Jesus told them with absolute faith in the rightness of his instructions? How about what Jesus said about our enemies? Or about the treasures we are to gather? How important is appearances to Christians? How important is entertainment to Christians as opposed to contentment and joy?

Christianity is shedding the world's values one by one and accepting the values of the Lord within us.
Most assuredly, it matter who we are in the secret and in the quiet place.

Who we are when no one else is looking is who we really are.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
60,335
29,583
113
#8
Its the hardest thing to face. Our true self
In seeing ourselves as the sinners we are before a just and Holy God, by far so much better are we able to understand the depth of His love and grace, that He forgives us in spite of our failures, and indeed, we all fall short. Take heart. You are a new creation in Christ! :)
 

MatthewWestfieldUK

Well-known member
May 13, 2021
871
498
63
#10
In seeing ourselves as the sinners we are before a just and Holy God, by far so much better are we able to understand the depth of His love and grace, that He forgives us in spite of our failures, and indeed, we all fall short. Take heart. You are a new creation in Christ! :)
When alone in a police cell i found that facing myself actually lowered my temperature. The chill is weird. Idk my folks in church who got in trouble with police . Everyone here seems very good
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
60,335
29,583
113
#11
When alone in a police cell i found that facing myself actually lowered my temperature. The chill is weird. Idk my folks in church who got in trouble with police . Everyone here seems very good
Perhaps it was a presage of the inevitable end result of carrying on
in the manner that landed you in jail in the first place. You know?
 

MatthewWestfieldUK

Well-known member
May 13, 2021
871
498
63
#12
Perhaps it was a presage of the inevitable end result of carrying on
in the manner that landed you in jail in the first place. You know?
I think facing what I has become vs what church was saying was hard to accept. I think my pain was internal .i struggled to talk about it .church don't want to discuss awarf topics
 

justbyfaith

Well-known member
Sep 16, 2021
4,707
462
83
#13
We can walk in victory for prolonged seasons in our lives; but when sin creeps back in it can get us doing things in the secret place and in the quiet place that are less than kosher.

That is why it is important to set aside a time of prayer every day and to pray for your personal walk every time you go to prayer.
 
Aug 20, 2021
1,863
310
83
#14
We can walk in victory for prolonged seasons in our lives; but when sin creeps back in it can get us doing things in the secret place and in the quiet place that are less than kosher.

That is why it is important to set aside a time of prayer every day and to pray for your personal walk every time you go to prayer.
pray always not a set time without ceasing for that you have to be in love with god.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#15
Most assuredly, it matter who we are in the secret and in the quiet place.

Who we are when no one else is looking is who we really are.
According to James, and according to what Christ will do for us when he returns, our deeds show who we really are.
 
Aug 20, 2021
1,863
310
83
#16
TOOLS
Rev 14:13
And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them.
 

justbyfaith

Well-known member
Sep 16, 2021
4,707
462
83
#17
pray always not a set time without ceasing for that you have to be in love with god.
Not sure why you are questioning my love for God.

I can assure you that I love Him with all of my heart. I have receive His Spirit by faith (Galatians 3:14, Ephesians 1:13-14). And therefore His love has been shed abroad in my heart through the Holy Ghost whom He has given to me (Romans 5:5).
 
Aug 20, 2021
1,863
310
83
#18
Not sure why you are questioning my love for God.

I can assure you that I love Him with all of my heart. I have receive His Spirit by faith (Galatians 3:14, Ephesians 1:13-14). And therefore His love has been shed abroad in my heart through the Holy Ghost whom He has given to me (Romans 5:5).
:( my bad.
i'm not like:mad:,,,,, i'm going to get this justbyfaith person,,,to b honest i'm not sure myself.I can say my motive is not evil,,,,,,and ur???? the scripture does say all the time,,not at a set time.
 
O

Omegatime

Guest
#20
PARASHAH: “Lech Lecha” (go forth yourself) GENESIS 12:1-17:27


“Now YHVH said unto Abram: Get thee out of thy country and from thy kindred, and from thy father’s house, unto a land that I will show thee” these are the opening words that YHVH speaks unto Abram. A Midrash interprets this to mean; “Go forth to find your authentic self to learn who you are meant to be”

This might be a command to every person on earth. We are to “go forth” and find “Adonai” and discover who He intends us to be! Our destiny should be entirely in HIS hands. If you hear His voice, how will you respond? or rather, how will "we" respond? with YES, here I am! or "later dude, I'm doing my own thing now."

Now we might ask, “why did YHVH choose Abram to begin his chosen people?” No one really knows the “why?” only that he DID choose him. Perhaps he had a curious and searching mind, searching for the real and true God.

We must remember that there was no such person as a “Jew” back then. Abram was a Mesopotamian, from the Chaldean city of “Ur” similar to the Hebrew “Ir” which means “city”. He was raised as an idol worshipper, and his family’s business, according to the rabbis, was making and selling idols.

Hebrew tradition teaches that when Abram was young, he attended the “School of Shem”. Shem, the son of Noah taught youths about the true God, Adonai-Elohim, the great El Shaddai, so, Abram might have known something about Elohim from Shem, that is if the story is true. But like I said, it is a story based on tradition.

We only know that YHVH chose Abram, and he accepted and obeyed the voice of YHVH. Here is a commandment and the blessings of obeying the commandment. “Leave your father’s house and go to a land which I will show you.” We see that G-d wanted Abram to distance himself from idol worshipping and everything connected with such. Once he obeyed the voice of HaShem, THEN… the blessings would come;

“I will make of thee a great nation”, “I will bless thee and make thy name great (shem Gadol) and be thou a blessing”, “I will bless them that bless thee and curse them that curse thee”, “In thee shall all the families of the world be blessed” we later see that under “being a great nation” we could add the promise; “Your seed will be like the dust of the earth” and also “like the stars of heaven” What do these promises involve?

First of all, let’s look at the words; “Dust of the earth” and “stars of heaven”. Am Israel becoming like the “dust” of the earth, in that they were “trampled upon” by many nations that wanted to extinguish the Jewish people, yet they were also as the “stars of heaven” they shone with the light of Adonai, they brought the worship of the ONE true GOD, Adonai-Elohim-Yeshuah. And from Am Israel, came “Yeshua” who is the “Light of the World”

Once that Abram obey the voice of YHVH, and he arrived in the land of Canaan, then came the testings.

We see that Adonai wanted to test his faith like He tests us all in many different ways. Yes, we all want blessings, but at times, blessings come with a price.

“Am Gadol” a great nation or a great people. It started with Yitzchak, the first and only son of Abram and Sarah. From him we know the story; Yitzchak > Ya’akov > 12 tribes > multitudes! As a sign, YHVH changed the name of Abram to Abraham. If we look at the paleo Hebrew symbolism in the name “Abram” we see “Alef” “Beit” “resh” “mem”. 4 letters, “4” symbolized the 4 corners of the earth. The descendants of Abraham are in all 4 corners of the earth. But we can see these letters meaning or symbolizing “the father who is the head of a multitude”. Also, we can read this as; God blesses the first house with a multitude”.

Later, YHVH changes his name by adding the letter “hey” (h). Now it is “abraHam”. What is the significance of the “H”? Well, one way we can look at it is that the “hey” (h) is the only letter in the Hebrew Alef-bet that is pronounced with one “breathing out air”. When you pronounce “h” we send out a puff of air from our mouth. We can also say “wind” in Hebrew; “Ruach” it also means “spirit”. SO…we can say that “YHVH sent out the “spirit of life” into the womb of Sarah through the seed of Abraham. Also, the ancient meaning of the letter “hey” is “Behold!” so, we can say “Behold, a multitude is coming from Abraham and Sarah!” starting with Yitzchak.

Yet we cannot forget about Ishmael, who was the son of Abraham and Hagar, the Egyptian. The promise extended to him too, although this was not part of God’s “perfect” will. He “permitted” the union between Abraham and Hagar, yet with consequences; the Arab nations who are the enemies of Israel. “Ishmael” means “God listens (to man)” “Ish+shema+El. (reading right to left) HOWEVER, if we read from left to right we get “Man listens to God” and every man that listens to God, in obedience, whether Arab or any other ethnic identity, that man will be blessed also.

Adonai stated also that “in thee, all of the families of the world would be blessed”. The greatest blessing is in Yeshua HaMashiach. From the seed of Abraham, came the nation of Israel, and we know that Mary and Joseph, the guardians of Yeshua were of the seed of Abraham, and more closely, the seed of David. We need to look not so much at physical blessings, nor biological/genealogical blessings. We might be of Jewish ancestry, but that does not secure for us salvation, we need to look at Yeshua our Messiah, who is our “Yeshuateinu” (our salvation)

This chapter also states that “Abram took his wife Sarai and his brother’s son Lot, and all the wealth that they had amassed and the persons that they had acquired in Haran and they set out for the land of Canaan”

Some translations say “souls” instead of “persons”. We can assume that by these words “acquired persons or souls” that Abram and Sarai were “soul winners” that they converted many “souls” in Haran to the belief in the one TRUE GOD, that they abandoned the false deities and were thus “grafted in” sort of saying, into the “Mishpochah Abram” (the family of Abram) They also probably bought servants and slaves, and I am sure that they witnessed to them too.

The Word also states that Abraham acquired much “wealth” and took it with him of course. This wealth was in the form of gold, silver, and livestock. We all have internal “wealth” which is the knowledge and wisdom which comes from studying God’s word, and that is what we take with us where ever we go. We are to “share” this wealth with others through teaching and preaching the WORD and be witnesses of the “Living WORD”

Once they arrived in Canaan, they would be “Gerim” from the word “Ger” which means a “sojourner” that is a person who is not a native of that land, but who will live there. We could consider ourselves as “sojourners” on this planet called “earth” this earth is not our permanent home, even though we were born “earthlings” our true home is in Heaven, the New Jerusalem.

Now we look at Lot, Abraham’s nephew, Lot started arguing over land for cattle. So, Abraham says for him to select one area and he would go in the other direction. So, Lot chose “Sodom!” the land around it looked very fertile. That is the way the land of sin appears to people. It looks attractive. So, Lot pitched his tent TOWARDS Sodom…then…he actually enters and LIVES in Sodom. And so, it is with sin. We might get attracted to it, get closer to it, and finally, indulge in it! So, be careful!

Another fact we read is that Abram stopped in two places, “Shechem” and “Betel” there he built altars and worshiped Adonai there. We do the same, but we do not build stone altars. We worship Adonai in spirit and in truth. An interesting fact about the place “Beth-El, it means “House of God”. Yet the Canaanites worshiped a false deity which was also called “El” the difference between the god “El” of the Canaanites and “El Elyon” or “El Elohim” is that we worship the true EL, the “One who is Strong and who Leads and Instructs” as symbolized in the two Paleo-Hebrew letters; “Aleph and Lamed”

There were three promises made to Abraham. His seed would be like the dust of the earth. His seed would be like the stars of heaven, his seed would be like the sands of the sea. Can you count the stars? Can you count the grains of sand on the beach? Can you count dust? Here is something to think about. We walk on dust, we trample it underfoot. Israel has been trampled underfoot and has been looked down upon by many nations, yet, the dust still lasts, it will always be. Leave a car out in the desert for 50 years, and the dust will wear it away into rusted metal, yet the “dust” will always be, and so will Israel.

Circumcision! This is an important area, but some make it TOO important. YHVH instructed Abraham to be circumcised and that every male should also be circumcised. This was and is a mark of the covenant. But what about today? Is it still important? Yes, it is, but in the physical aspect of the same. For male health and cleanliness, it is good for every baby boy to be circumcised. YHVH is more concerned about our heart condition. Moshe stated that the “foreskin of our hearts should be circumcised”. Spiritually speaking, the “foreskin” of our hearts is the carnal ways that we all have, being that we are a fallen race and have the inbred original sin.

“So, circumcise your heart and stiffen your neck no longer” (Deut 10:16)
Shem died in the year 2158 from creation and Abraham was born in the year 1948 from creation so it is easily possible that Abraham knew Shem. One hundred and ten years span makes this most probable, both being in the generational line of Christ.