The False Teaching (& Truth) of what happens at the Rapture.

[Absolutely]

It's the ONLY resurrection of the saved. Matt 22:30, Luke 14:14, Acts 24:15, 1 Cor 15:23.

Be my guest and address each verse and prove to me they don't speak of resurrrection in the singular.


Why do you purposely LIE about what we believe? Everyone knows 1 Thess 4.


No, that "privilege" belongs to the teachers who CANNOT provide ANY verse showing Jesus taking glorified believers to heaven.


I just soundly refuted your nutty views about Rev 14, so I don't use that chapter for understanding the singular resurrection.

BTW, are you going to admit that your view of the rapture is real bloody, now that I've shown you how the chapter ends.


Go ahead and explain WHY the rapture must be so bloody.


Right. You are in a very tight corner, what with all that blood to explain!!


You are again BLOODY WRONG.


Another LIE. Please show me the post # where I supposedly admitted to a "previous resurrection". Maybe you just don't read so well.

Rev 20 is about the singular resurrection.


You're just sorry, all right.


Self deceived is what you are really doing.

....I am not the one placing the dead resurrected after the living.

Not even close friend.
You bought that false doctrine.
Now are found defending it.

 

[Absolutely]

"""What is the big deal with Simon? Why are you so obsessed with him? What does it profit you? Why would anyone have "proof to the contrary"?
Of course neither I nor anyone else has "any proof to the contrary" about Simon. So your continued comments seem rather odd."""

....YES!!!!
NOW LIVE IT OUT IN YOUR REASONING!!!

AMEN to your newfound ability!!!

Read what you wrote.
Read it slowly.
Then go to rev 14.

You are welcome

^^^^^^^^^the red pill^^^^^^^^^

Postribbers....
PleaseTake it.

You Never will regret jettisoning that false mess.

 

[Absolutely]

It's the ONLY resurrection of the saved. Matt 22:30, Luke 14:14, Acts 24:15, 1 Cor 15:23.

Be my guest and address each verse and prove to me they don't speak of resurrrection in the singular.


Why do you purposely LIE about what we believe? Everyone knows 1 Thess 4.


No, that "privilege" belongs to the teachers who CANNOT provide ANY verse showing Jesus taking glorified believers to heaven.


I just soundly refuted your nutty views about Rev 14, so I don't use that chapter for understanding the singular resurrection.

BTW, are you going to admit that your view of the rapture is real bloody, now that I've shown you how the chapter ends.


Go ahead and explain WHY the rapture must be so bloody.


Right. You are in a very tight corner, what with all that blood to explain!!


You are again BLOODY WRONG.


Another LIE. Please show me the post # where I supposedly admitted to a "previous resurrection". Maybe you just don't read so well.

Rev 20 is about the singular resurrection.


You're just sorry, all right.


Self deceived is what you are really doing.

"""I just soundly refuted your nutty views about Rev 14, so I don't use that chapter for understanding the singular resurrection."""

Where?
Post number?

 

[Absolutely]

No, what totally destroys YOUR presumptions is that the reaping of the main harvest in Rev 14 is about killings, killings, and more killings.

14 I looked, and there before me was a white cloud, and seated on the cloud was one like a son of man with a crown of gold on his head and a sharp sickle in his hand.
15 Then another angel came out of the temple and called in a loud voice to him who was sitting on the cloud, “Take your sickle and reap, because the time to reap has come, for the harvest of the earth is ripe.”
16 So he who was seated on the cloud swung his sickle over the earth, and the earth was harvested.
17 Another angel came out of the temple in heaven, and he too had a sharp sickle.
18 Still another angel, who had charge of the fire, came from the altar and called in a loud voice to him who had the sharp sickle, “Take your sharp sickle and gather the clusters of grapes from the earth’s vine, because its grapes are ripe.”
19 The angel swung his sickle on the earth, gathered its grapes and threw them into the great winepress of God’s wrath.
20 They were trampled in the winepress outside the city, and blood flowed out of the press, rising as high as the horses’ bridles for a distance of 1,600 stadia.

Anyone who sees a rapture of believers in Rev 14 needs new eyes.

All the red words deal with sharp sickles and reaping and harvesting, which is what sharp sickles are FOR.

The blue words refer to the RESULT of using the sharp sickles and reaping and harvesting the earth.

LOTS AND LOTS OF BLOOD. As high as a horse's bridle, oh, for about 180 miles.

And you think Rev 14 is about a rapture.


Said the one who thinks that Jesus is going to swing His sharp sickle and rapture believers. And misses the small point that there will be SO MUCH BLOOD after He swings His sharp sickle that the blood will run as high as a horse's bridle for about 180 miles.


Maybe you just haven't read ALL of ch 14. Were you aware that the sharp sickle is RESPONSIBLE for all that blood?

Do you really think the resurrection and rapture will be all that BLOODY?


Were you aware of how much BLOOD will flow when Jesus swings His sharp sickle over the earth to reap and harvest??

Or were you OMITTING that clear fact?

How embarrassing. Thinking the "rapture" will be so BLOODY!!

You should only mention the rapture as "that BLOODY RAPTURE".

Rev 14:14
Jesus gathers ripe fruit with sickle in hand.

Then, after that gathering, ANOTHER, LATER GATHERING, BY AN ANGEL...NOT JESUS .....TO JUDGEMENT.

Do you know the penalty for Changing The wording of rev???

 

[FreeGrace2]

uh
The 2 groups of rev 14 ,in heaven BEFORE WHERE you are attempting to place the first resurrection.
Hello????

Right: hello???? Are you even awake? Before the singular resurrrection of the saved, how do you think ANYONE gets to heaven?

Right. By physical death. So, there is only 1 group in heaven. I don't care how you count them. Everyone in heaven is saved and there because they died. Period.

Omit that one please.

You will

I will certainly omit all of your claims.

Are you willing to admit that your view of "the rapture" is really really bloody?

 

[kleronomos]

And what is that you are saying from that scripture?

That Satan is our accuser and is in heaven and will be until he is cast out. It was in reference to your picture showing him at the bottom of the picture which I assumed was of current times but I don't know or understand it. It is very foreign to me personally. What you see in 'levels' I see in 'ages'.

Like the 3rd heaven Paul was taken to, I don't think in terms of 'HEIGHT'.

 

[FreeGrace2]

....I am not the one placing the dead resurrected after the living.

I don't either. You must be reading impaired.

Not even close friend.

It is your theory that isn't even close.

You bought that false doctrine.

Nope. You did.

Now are found defending it.

I defend the truth of Scripture. you defend opinions, assumptions, presumptions, and only God knows what else.

But what you DON'T HAVE is Scripture with which to defend all your theories.

 

[FreeGrace2]

"""I just soundly refuted your nutty views about Rev 14, so I don't use that chapter for understanding the singular resurrection."""

Where?
Post number?

You really need to follow along if you insist on responding to posters.

My post quoted Rev 14:14-20. It was about reaping the harvest and was all about BLOOD BLOOD BLOOD.

You really should read it. The Bible, that is.

According to all you're been claiming, your "rapture" is a BLOODY MESS.

The Scripture has Jesus swinging a sharp sickle, reaping and harvesting the EARTH. With ENOUGH BLOOD to rise to a horse's bridle for about 180 miles.

Now, explain how that fits into your rapture theory.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Rev 14:14
Jesus gathers ripe fruit with sickle in hand.

Then, after that gathering, ANOTHER, LATER GATHERING, BY AN ANGEL...NOT JESUS .....TO JUDGEMENT.

Do you know the penalty for Changing The wording of rev???

lol. I didn't change anything.

I DID expose your FALSE notions about Rev 14. v.14-20 are all about the same thing: BLOOD BLOOD BLOOD.

But go ahead and deny it. Doesn't matter.

 

[kleronomos]

`He hangs the earth on nothing..` (Job 26: 7)

Amazing. Now the city will be above the earth like the moon is now, but during the day time, for the nations walk in its LIGHT. As the earth spins through our solar system around the sun, the city revolves around the earth. That is the only way for all the nations to be able to walk in its light - physically and spiritually.

`And the city had no need of the sun or of the moon to shine in it, for the glory of God illuminated it, and the Lamb is its light. And the nations of those who are saved SHALL WALK IN ITS LIGHT and bring their glory and honour into it.` (Rev. 21: 22 & 23)

You are describing our CURRENT heaven and current earth. With no 'sea' all there will be is land. WE WILL BE (maybe already are) the center of whatever comes to be as GOD will dwell with us.

I don't know, but I don't think there will be a moon or a sun at all.



Matthew 13:41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; 42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.



Revelation 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

Revelation 21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

Revelation 21:3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people, and God Himself shall be with them, and be their God.

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

Revelation 21:5 And He that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

 

[Marilyn]

I know of those but the city descends to the Earth. That's pretty clear from the language in Revelation 21-22.

Rev 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
Rev 21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
Rev 21:3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.


If God was still way up high, that would not be God dwelling with men.

`God is Spirit...` (John 4: 23) God is omnipresent. He is everywhere present. He dwells by His Spirit with men on earth in the city and in the highest angelic realm.

Note: `Then i, John, saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down OUT OF HEAVEN FROM GOD.` (Rev. 21: 2)

 

[Marilyn]

The river is literal and it won't be a waterfall.

`And He showed me a pure river of the water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding from the throne of God and of the Lamb.` (Rev. 22: 1)

`I am the way the truth the LIFE.` (John 14: 6)

Jesus Himself is the LIFE, He is the river of LIFE.

 

[Marilyn]

FreeGrace2 said:
I believe it is a bit of a strectch to assume the city floats above the earth.

There is nothing in Rev 21 to suggest the city does not rest on the NE. We'll just have to see.

I don't see any relevance between my claim and this verse.


Presumption. Rev 22:14 describes people going "through the gates".


More presumption. What verses support this idea?


Not true. "With God, all things are possible."


If this is your only support, it isn't much.

How can the people of the earth walk in the LIGHT of the city if they live on the other side of the earth from where the city is?

`And the nations of those who are saved shall walk in its LIGHT.` (Rev. 21: 24)

 

[FreeGrace2]

ewq1938 said:
The river is literal and it won't be a waterfall.

`And He showed me a pure river of the water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding from the throne of God and of the Lamb.` (Rev. 22: 1)

`I am the way the truth the LIFE.` (John 14: 6)

Jesus Himself is the LIFE, He is the river of LIFE.

Did you forget what follows v.1?

2 down the middle of the great street of the city. On each side of the river stood the tree of life, bearing twelve crops of fruit, yielding its fruit every month. And the leaves of the tree are for the healing of the nations.

So you have King Jesus lying "down the middle of the great street of the city. And bearing 12 crops of fruit."

Sure.

 

[Marilyn]

ewq1938 said:
Rev 21:24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.

People will walk into the city so that proves it will be on the ground not to mention a river flowing from the throne in that city.

Seems you like to stretch things quite a bit. Flaiming chariots to get to the NJ? Really?


I would prefer a flying Lamborgini. Flaming or not.

I think a vehicle that God made to fly is better than fiery horses pulling chariots.

 

[Marilyn]

ewq1938 said:
The river is literal and it won't be a waterfall.

Did you forget what follows v.1?

2 down the middle of the great street of the city. On each side of the river stood the tree of life, bearing twelve crops of fruit, yielding its fruit every month. And the leaves of the tree are for the healing of the nations.

So you have King Jesus lying "down the middle of the great street of the city. And bearing 12 crops of fruit."

Sure.

It is the Lord`s CHARACTER that is being given and received.

 

[FreeGrace2]

How can the people of the earth walk in the LIGHT of the city if they live on the other side of the earth from where the city is?

`And the nations of those who are saved shall walk in its LIGHT.` (Rev. 21: 24)

Aren't you aware of the verse that says, "with God, all things are possible".

Do you really think that Jesus will be a river running down the middle of the great street and the sun, shining on all parts of the city?

Do you understand figures of speech?

 

[FreeGrace2]

I think a vehicle that God made to fly is better than fiery horses pulling chariots.

So then, who made the flaming chariot, if not God?

 

[FreeGrace2]

It is the Lord`s CHARACTER that is being given and received.

Of course. So don't treat figures of speech as literal.

 

[Marilyn]

That Satan is our accuser and is in heaven and will be until he is cast out. It was in reference to your picture showing him at the bottom of the picture which I assumed was of current times but I don't know or understand it. It is very foreign to me personally. What you see in 'levels' I see in 'ages'.

Like the 3rd heaven Paul was taken to, I don't think in terms of 'HEIGHT'.

That diagram is in NHNE.

`For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him.` (Col. 1: 16)