F I R M A M E N T U M

[Mem]

Lets be clear that when you refer to the word you are referring exclusively to the kjv which is a translation of the original words used...

God instructed the original authors to 'write this in a book,' no where in scripture is there documentation that the kjv translators were given this directive directly by God as the former authors did, in any particular case of any individual word.

 

[DanielLL]

Lets be clear that when you refer to the word you are referring exclusively to the kjv which is a translation of the original words used...

Every word of Godis pure (tried; tested; refined).- Prov 30:5

And? The Kjv is the Word of God isn't it? It is "profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:", right?

 

[Mem]

Every word of Godis pure (tried; tested; refined).- Prov 30:5

And? The Kjv is the Word of God isn't it? It is "profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:", right?

You elevate the kjv translators to idol status if your claim is they are infallible.

 

[Mem]

You elevate the kjv translators to idol status if your claim is they are infallible.

And likewise, you elevate the english language over the LORD's language, along with all it's jots and tittles, in so doing.

 

[DanielLL]

LORD's language

רָקִיעַ the vault of heaven, or 'firmament,' regarded by Hebrews as solid, and supporting 'waters' above it

[חוּג] verb draw round, make a circle (Aramaic

circumivit; noun

, חוּגְתָּא, circle, vault of heavens)

 

[Mem]

רָקִיעַ the vault of heaven, or 'firmament,' regarded by Hebrews as solid, and supporting 'waters' above it

[חוּג] verb draw round, make a circle (Aramaic

circumivit; noun

, חוּגְתָּא, circle, vault of heavens)

I notice you have waters in quotes. Are these 'waters' the solid, liquid or gaseous form of
'waters' this vault is supporting?

 

[DanielLL]

Are these 'waters' the solid, liquid or gaseous form of
'waters' this vault is supporting?

Liquid waters, because it doesn't specify, it doesn't say gas nor ice, but either way, waters is not vaccum nor "outter-space".

 

[Mem]

Liquid waters, because it doesn't specify, it doesn't say gas nor ice, but either way, waters is not vaccum nor "outter-space".

Yet there is water vapor in the heavens, or 'sky.'

 

[Blain]

Well, you are quick to reject my "use of it", but you haven't presented me with any other "use" of the Word: "circle on the face of the deep".
How will you turn a two dimentional circle into a three dimentional sphere? Is that not making Scripture say what you want it to say? Are you going to do the things you accuse me of?


Matthew 19:26 But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.


You mean the curve of your imagination?

I have been in many many debates and seen verse after verse thrown around used as weapons against others used as tools to mock others scriptures cherry picked and taken out of context to say what a person wants it to say twisted and molded to fit agendas ect. Time after time I have seen the sacred word of God used as a play thing with no regard to the sacred treasure that is so I make it a point to understand scripture but to be very careful as to how I use it so very rarely will I use it in debates as to not use it in the manner I have often seen others do however I do use scripture to build the church I believee it is to be used to edify encourage and teach to make others stronger to inspire to strengthen not merely to prove our theories or agendas and certainly not to mock or be used simply to make our points seem more valid than they are. So while the things I say may be of scripture often times you will see me use scripture very carefully you will not see me using it so carelessly

I have no intention of using scripture to disprove you I have already proven the earth cannot be flat you just fail to realize it because you do not understand science you lack the understanding to realize you already lost this debate when you could not disprove the mass and gravity issue and your poor attempt to do so was no where near good enough to do so. Again as I said before science is merely the study of the world that God created and how it functions and proves his existance his fingerprints are all over the universe simply by studying science . Let me ask you thi, when you eat and drink does it not end up coming out of you from the other end? that is a fact it is also biology biology is a type of science the study of the human body and how it functions, when one part of the body like your liver quits working right the rest of the body stops working right that isn't mans tradition that is biology and guess what God desiged the body that way.

So you see just because you put a name on something doesn't change what it is, and just because you refuse to aknoledge something doesn't mean it doesn't work that way, I can pretend that I don't have diebetes and just call it mans tradition butit doesn't mean that I don't have it.

 

[Blain]

Well, you are quick to reject my "use of it", but you haven't presented me with any other "use" of the Word: "circle on the face of the deep".
How will you turn a two dimentional circle into a three dimentional sphere? Is that not making Scripture say what you want it to say? Are you going to do the things you accuse me of?


Matthew 19:26 But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.


You mean the curve of your imagination?

Also I am trying to press play on this and it is just an image I am going to need a more trust worthy source,

 

[Dino246]

Every word of Godis pure (tried; tested; refined).- Prov 30:5

And? The Kjv is the Word of God isn't it? It is "profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:", right?

Flawed argumentation. The KJV does not have the exclusive title to 'the word of God'. Not even in English.

 

[Clermont1029]

I find it crazy how all here feel attacked by Danielll. I have read through this thread and you can’t even acknowledge the possibility because science discovered something by an atheist men. I understand is argument completely and I know we’re living in end-times and deceit is rampant.
I would have to spend more time with these specific scriptures to discern for myself. I have seen no one here explain this verse any better and I also have no one provide a clear answer as to where or how the water from the flood was held in space.
I think I believe the earth is a globe but I’ve never been to space, why are all the images NASA post doctored? I think NASA is just a funnel and I don’t think they landed on the moon. Anyways, there are 2 people, those who belong to Christ and those who belong to Satan and without confirming by going to space you may be falling into a problem of trusting someone who is of Satan.
That’s my 2 cents anyways. I have found this form hostile and expected better when I joined and why I spend little time here. Heck, people here are arguing with people to get injected with a goo that contains aborted baby parts and was testing on aborted babies. Yes, the Christian thing to do is to run out and inject yourself with murdered babies and buy into a system that limits buying by people who haven’t received.
I’m not saying it’s wrong to be a liberal or republican but damn, you still haven’t figured out we’re either in end times or one heck of an awakening, you need to spend more time with God and the Bible vs arguing over of the earth is flat.
Go tell someone about Jesus, all of you.

 

[Blain]

Flawed argumentation. The KJV does not have the exclusive title to 'the word of God'. Not even in English.

This is true, while yes it is perhaps close close to the original text in some ways it doesn't begin to compare to the original greek and hebrew text. This isn't to say that the english translation is made void but if one were to read the bible in their original translations the bible would open up in an entirely new way. if only I had the capability to do so but I know my own limits learning to speak a new language let alone read one is not within my grasp.

 

[Blain]

I find it crazy how all here feel attacked by Danielll. I have read through this thread and you can’t even acknowledge the possibility because science discovered something by an atheist men. I understand is argument completely and I know we’re living in end-times and deceit is rampant.
I would have to spend more time with these specific scriptures to discern for myself. I have seen no one here explain this verse any better and I also have no one provide a clear answer as to where or how the water from the flood was held in space.
I think I believe the earth is a globe but I’ve never been to space, why are all the images NASA post doctored? I think NASA is just a funnel and I don’t think they landed on the moon. Anyways, there are 2 people, those who belong to Christ and those who belong to Satan and without confirming by going to space you may be falling into a problem of trusting someone who is of Satan.
That’s my 2 cents anyways. I have found this form hostile and expected better when I joined and why I spend little time here. Heck, people here are arguing with people to get injected with a goo that contains aborted baby parts and was testing on aborted babies. Yes, the Christian thing to do is to run out and inject yourself with murdered babies and buy into a system that limits buying by people who haven’t received.
I’m not saying it’s wrong to be a liberal or republican but damn, you still haven’t figured out we’re either in end times or one heck of an awakening, you need to spend more time with God and the Bible vs arguing over of the earth is flat.
Go tell someone about Jesus, all of you.

For the record we do not feel attacked by @DanielLL in fact at the beginning he was the one on the attacking position though I will give him credit for being less hostile than he was before. The issue is that we are using sound logic to make our points he is not many have tried to reason with him, you see a person being harassed by others but try to see it from our perspective as people who simply have been trying to reason with an unreasonable person. imagine being in our shoes trying to make your point giving your evidence but no amount is ever enough and is just rejected tossed aside and you are called a fool with scripture you are accused of rejected the word of God simply because you do not agree with a persons view or use of scripture

Now as far as nasa doctoring images I have not seen this what doctored picture are you speaking of?

 

[Dino246]

I find it crazy how all here feel attacked by Danielll.

A person who comes in here and immediately starts insulting others and assuming the worst of them earns the treatment he consequently receives, regardless of his message.

 

[Blain]

A person who comes in here and immediately starts insulting others and assuming the worst of them earns the treatment he consequently receives, regardless of his message.

Well while we should give correction and biblical rebuke we shouldn't give him the same treatment he gives us that isn't what we as believers are to as frustrating as he can be, like I said before he is not spiritually mature enough to discuss these matters he is all for giving his point and giving insults but good at recieving other peoples points and seems to take correction as attacks

 

[DanielLL]

I have no intention of using scripture to disprove you

You can't use Scripture the disprove Scripture. That is why you have to resort to the things of the world, the traditions of men and your own understanding. The Word says: "waters above the firmament" and "circle on the face of the deep". You have to live with it:

Proverbs 8:33 Hear instruction, and be wise, and refuse it not.
36 But he that sinneth against me wrongeth his own soul: all they that hate me love death.

The KJV does not have the exclusive title to 'the word of God'.

I said the KJV is the Word of God, The Holy Bible. I didn't say "exclusive" anywhere. I can use all other translations, they all go back to the same hebrew words. What is your problem with the KJV beeing the Word of God? I don't know Hebrew. Does that mean I can't read the Word of God?

 

[DanielLL]

A person who comes in here and immediately starts insulting others

You mean you and your insults?

getting your knickers in a twist

you want to be a jackdonkey, I'll treat you as one

silly conclusions made by misunderstanding, misinterpreting, or simply not reading the relevant verses

I've seen some silly arguments, but that takes the cake for today

your own bias and ignorance

embarrassing yourself, I will happily assist you in doing so.

your erroneous interpretations.

Have I ever insulted you? Or have I quoted verses from the Bible that convicted you of your err?

 

[Dino246]

You can't use Scripture the disprove Scripture.

But you can use Scripture to disprove erroneous interpretations of Scripture.

I said the KJV is the Word of God, The Holy Bible. I didn't say "exclusive" anywhere. I can use all other translations, they all go back to the same hebrew words. What is your problem with the KJV beeing the Word of God? I don't know Hebrew. Does that mean I can't read the Word of God?

You imply "exclusive" by the way you use the KJV wording. You present KJV terminology without presenting modern terminology.

I have no issue with the KJV being the word of God, but I categorically reject the ridiculous idea that it is so exclusively... which is what many people believe. If that's not you, fine... demonstrate it by presenting modern translations for your key verses.

 

[Dino246]

You mean you and your insults?

getting your knickers in a twist

you want to be a jackdonkey, I'll treat you as one

silly conclusions made by misunderstanding, misinterpreting, or simply not reading the relevant verses

I've seen some silly arguments, but that takes the cake for today

your own bias and ignorance

embarrassing yourself, I will happily assist you in doing so.

your erroneous interpretations.

None of those are insults.

"Getting your knickers in a twist" is simply a colourful way of saying "getting upset".

"Jackdonkey" is a straightforward assessment of your behaviour. Correct your behaviour.

You do demonstrate both ignorance (lack of knowledge) and bias (a priori selection of one side of a debate). Hence your embarrassment of yourself.

As for the rest, you may not like your ideas being criticized, or being told that you are wrong, but it doesn't help anyone to let you continue uncorrected. If you present your ideas on this forum, they are fair game for criticism. If you cannot distinguish between yourself and your ideas, you need more help than I can offer.

Have I ever insulted you? Or have I quoted verses from the Bible that convicted you of your err?

Oh... where shall I start?

"Err" is a verb, not a noun.

You haven't quoted any Scripture that has convicted me of my error. For that to happen, I'd have to be wrong.