Must one believe that Jesus is God in order to be saved?

[DavidTree]

“And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.”
‭‭1 Timothy‬ ‭3:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2:9‬ ‭KJV‬‬

You can tinker and explain things away but you can’t seperate God . Before Christ was born in the flesh no one really knew God because he hadn’t yet made himself Known to Man .

God was made flesh and walked among us , taught us , suffered and died for us and afterwards

“And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.”
‭‭John‬ ‭17:5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

he humbled himself and took the seed of man upon himself to deliver us from death. When your seeing Jesus pray to the father , it’s because he’s teaching us how to be his children. His life on earth he became a man and humbled himself made himself subject to God because that’s mans place, afterwards he returned to his glory who is the creator himself who walked among us but many don’t recognize him

“All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. In him was life; and the life was the light of men. ….

He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. He came unto his own, and his own received him not.”
‭‭John‬ ‭1:3-4, 10-11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

if you agree God created the world there shouldn’t be a doubt who Jesus is.

“for by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭1:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

by him and also For him you don’t really see or Know God until you see Jesus where the father son and Holy Ghost are found in one being

“For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2:9‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Yosemite Sam says: "And don't you forget it......."

 

[Pilgrimshope]

You said: No God formed before Christ and none will be formed after means that Christ is the only one formed by the Spirit of the Father."

NO - NOPE - DEFINTELY NOT

Christ was not formed by the Father = "Jesus is the same Elohim(God) that created all things from the beginning.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made
And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.

before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I, am the LORD;
and beside Me there is no Saviour.”

amen it’s just the lord Jesus explaining that it is him who speaks even before he became flesh and him who speaks in the gospel , and him who speaks through his spirit

“Therefore my people shall know my name: therefore they shall know in that day that I am he that doth speak: behold, it is I.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭52:6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world…
‭‭John‬ ‭17:6‬ ‭

“I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins. Then said they unto him, Who art thou? And Jesus saith unto them, Even the same that I said unto you from the beginning.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:24-25‬ ‭

I don’t think anyone’s a heretic or anything sometimes we just don’t understand it fully yet

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Yosemite Sam says: "And don't you forget it......."

Haha doesn’t he say “ rackin , fracking , froopim froggim oooo i hate that rabbit !! “

 

[Magenta]

Just asking here: You do understand that "the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world" was the purpose for Elohim(God) becoming a man in the form of His Son and that there was no man before Elohim created man = Yes/No?

I don't really understand your question. The eternality of Jesus, the omniscience of His Deity, as Creator of all that is, giver and sustainer of life... He knew the path the natural man would take, and that a Spiritual rebirthing of man was necessary; He knew none could fulfill the requirement for righteousness but Him alone, and for that reason He purposed to incarnate before the world was even created, that we may by grace through faith in His shed righteous blood for the remission of sin escape the second death and attain to life ever after.

 

[DavidTree]

amen it’s just the lord Jesus explaining that it is him who speaks even before he became flesh and him who speaks in the gospel , and him who speaks through his spirit

“Therefore my people shall know my name: therefore they shall know in that day that I am he that doth speak: behold, it is I.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭52:6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world…
‭‭John‬ ‭17:6‬ ‭

“I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins. Then said they unto him, Who art thou? And Jesus saith unto them, Even the same that I said unto you from the beginning.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:24-25‬ ‭

I don’t think anyone’s a heretic or anything sometimes we just don’t understand it fully yet

After the anguish of His soul, He will see the light of life and be satisfied.
By His knowledge My righteous Servant will justify many, and He will bear their iniquities.
Isa 53:11

Behold, the Lord God shall come with a strong hand,
And His arm shall rule for Him;
Behold, His reward is with Him,
And His work before Him.
11He will feed His flock like a shepherd;
He will gather the lambs with His arm,
And carry them in His bosom,
And gently lead those who are with young.

12Who has measured the waters in the hollow of His hand,
Measured heaven with a span
And calculated the dust of the earth in a measure?
Weighed the mountains in scales
And the hills in a balance?
Who has directed the Spirit of the Lord,
Or as His counselor has taught Him?
With whom did He take counsel, and who instructed Him,
And taught Him in the path of justice?
Who taught Him knowledge,
And showed Him the way of understanding?

 

[DavidTree]

I don't really understand your question. The eternality of Jesus, the omniscience of His Deity, as Creator of all that is, giver and sustainer of life... He knew the path the natural man would take, and that a Spiritual rebirthing of man was necessary; He knew none could fulfill the requirement for righteousness but Him alone, and for that reason He purposed to incarnate before the world was even created, that we may by grace through faith in His shed righteous blood for the remission of sin escape the second death and attain to life ever after.

I asked the question because there is false doctrine declaring: "Jesus was man before the foundation of the world"
It had popped it's ugly head here on this thread.

Do not fall into that quagmire.

Peace

 

[Magenta]

I asked the question because there is false doctrine declaring: "Jesus was man before the foundation of the world"
It had popped it's ugly head here on this thread.

Do not fall into that quagmire.

Peace

Oh... well, some say Jesus is still a man, I have seen that, and Scripture refers to Him that way.

For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus...

But, no, I do not think/believe Jesus was a human being before He incarnated. Ha, that idea strikes me as odd.

 

[DavidTree]

Oh... well, some say Jesus is still a man, I have seen that, and Scripture refers to Him that way.

For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus...

But, no, I do not think/believe Jesus was a human being before He incarnated. Ha, that idea strikes me as odd.

This false teaching comes from the mechanisms of unbelief:
#1 - to separate Jesus the Son from being the Elohim from the Beginning (the Word was Elohim)
#2 - establish a erroneous interpretation of "the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world" resulting in #3
#3. - Jesus is a god-man that was 'formed/created' by God, therefore not fully Elohim(God) from the Beginning

 

[Magenta]

This false teaching comes from the mechanisms of unbelief:
#1 - to separate Jesus the Son from being the Elohim from the Beginning (the Word was Elohim)
#2 - establish a erroneous interpretation of "the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world" resulting in #3
#3. - Jesus is a god-man that was 'formed' by God, therefore not fully Elohim(God) from the Beginning

Sounds eerily familiar to Mormonism

 

[DavidTree]

Sounds eerily familiar to Mormonism.

Mormonism: Jesus was the god-man-son created on the Right Hand of God then Lucifer is the created son-of-god on the Left Hand of God = therefore Jesus and Lucifer/satan are brothers

 

[Magenta]

Mormonism: Jesus was the god-man-son created on the Right Hand of God then Lucifer is the created son-of-god on the Left Hand of God

According to them, God was once a man like us (not to be confused with the incarnation of Christ, which they believe was accomplished by God having sexual relations with Mary ), and those found worthy will become a god like God and have their own universe to rule over

 

[Pilgrimshope]

I don't really understand your question. The eternality of Jesus, the omniscience of His Deity, as Creator of all that is, giver and sustainer of life... He knew the path the natural man would take, and that a Spiritual rebirthing of man was necessary; He knew none could fulfill the requirement for righteousness but Him alone, and for that reason He purposed to incarnate before the world was even created, that we may by grace through faith in His shed righteous blood for the remission of sin escape the second death and attain to life ever after.

also though we need to accept his words of life

 

[Magenta]

also though we need to accept his words of life

He is life

 

[DavidTree]

According to them, God was once a man like us (not to be confused with the incarnation of Christ, which they believe was accomplished by God having sexual relations with Mary ), and those found worthy will become a god like God and have their own universe to rule over

If, before Time/the Beginning, God was once a man like us then we have no hope.

But in this (before the incarnation) we have our confidence:

Behold, the Lord God shall come with a strong hand,
And His arm shall rule for Him;
Behold, His reward is with Him,
And His work before Him.
11He will feed His flock like a shepherd;
He will gather the lambs with His arm,
And carry them in His bosom,
And gently lead those who are with young.

12Who has measured the waters in the hollow of His hand,
Measured heaven with a span
And calculated the dust of the earth in a measure?
Weighed the mountains in scales
And the hills in a balance?
13Who has directed the Spirit of the Lord,
Or as His counselor has taught Him?
14With whom did He take counsel, and who instructed Him,
And taught Him in the path of justice?
Who taught Him knowledge,
And showed Him the way of understanding?
Isaiah 40

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Oh... well, some say Jesus is still a man, I have seen that, and Scripture refers to Him that way.

For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus...

But, no, I do not think/believe Jesus was a human being before He incarnated. Ha, that idea strikes me as odd.

remember how man was originally made in Gods image ? In the New Testament God made himself in our image to redeem us to himself !! Showing us who we are created to be the children of God made in the image of Jesus Christ the man ( who was manifest in our form ) !

What I mean to say is

“Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; and deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham. Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭2:14-18‬ ‭KJV‬‬

our God is not one who sits by and watches his children die he is the God who sees , and saves !!! Even when it was our own darn fault in the first place

 

[Magenta]

For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham. Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭2:14-18‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Hebrews 2:10-11


I just realized the verse citation on this is wrong I'll fix it It is Hebrews 2:17

 

[Pilgrimshope]

He is life

yes and he offers it to those who believe the gospel !

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

whereas if we reject his word

“He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

…And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.”
‭‭John‬ ‭12:48, 50‬ ‭KJV‬‬

and so as we grow up in him who is life not rejecting his words but accepting them in faith

“For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

Do all things without murmurings and disputings: that ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;

holding forth the word of life; that I may rejoice in the day of Christ, that I have not run in vain, neither laboured in vain.”
‭‭Philippians‬ ‭2:13-16‬ ‭

“That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life;”
‭‭1 John‬ ‭1:1‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[Runningman]

Yes you must believe Jesus of Nazareth is literally God to be saved.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

After the anguish of His soul, He will see the light of life and be satisfied.
By His knowledge My righteous Servant will justify many, and He will bear their iniquities.
Isa 53:11

Behold, the Lord God shall come with a strong hand,
And His arm shall rule for Him;
Behold, His reward is with Him,
And His work before Him.
11He will feed His flock like a shepherd;
He will gather the lambs with His arm,
And carry them in His bosom,
And gently lead those who are with young.

12Who has measured the waters in the hollow of His hand,
Measured heaven with a span
And calculated the dust of the earth in a measure?
Weighed the mountains in scales
And the hills in a balance?
Who has directed the Spirit of the Lord,
Or as His counselor has taught Him?
With whom did He take counsel, and who instructed Him,
And taught Him in the path of justice?
Who taught Him knowledge,
And showed Him the way of understanding?

As to the man servant ? The word I would suspect like all Men do. Remember he was a baby and grew and learned but as to his gospel the Holy Ghost I would say the father !!

And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.”
‭‭John‬ ‭12:48, 50‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Hebrews 2:10-11


I just realized the verse citation on this is wrong I'll fix it It is Hebrews 2:17

it’s wrong ? Is it missing the word “all “