electric cars
- Thread starter Lanolin
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I do not own one nor will I ever.
However, we were at an event recently standing in the parking lot talking with the guy parked next to us ( ironically about classic collector cars
) when a man pulls up in an electric hybrid car, stops, rolls down his window to ask some questions (he wasn't from the area). The men got to talking about his car to which he said he HATES it, that it's one of the worst "investments" he's ever made, and how his mileage wasn't as good as his "old" fuel powered car.
However, we were at an event recently standing in the parking lot talking with the guy parked next to us ( ironically about classic collector cars
) when a man pulls up in an electric hybrid car, stops, rolls down his window to ask some questions (he wasn't from the area). The men got to talking about his car to which he said he HATES it, that it's one of the worst "investments" he's ever made, and how his mileage wasn't as good as his "old" fuel powered car.
The biggest problem with EV is charging at night.
Approximately half of the population lives in multi family housing. (Apartments)
And these Apartments usually have some sort of parking facility for those who own automobiles. But the issue comes with installing charging stations in them and the increased burden these charging stations will place upon the electric infrastructure.
In some countries electricity is free...in others it's a private company but heavily regulated.
So...how would half of the population charge their vehicles? And if the electric grid has an increased demand of 40% (or more) megawatts placed upon it...how is that going to work? (Not well)
And then the rural areas flat out can't use an electric car...none of the batteries can hold sufficient power...or will die very quickly from such heavy use.
These challenges and more are coming. There have been some suggestions but none of them have actually panned out to be a good idea as yet.
Approximately half of the population lives in multi family housing. (Apartments)
And these Apartments usually have some sort of parking facility for those who own automobiles. But the issue comes with installing charging stations in them and the increased burden these charging stations will place upon the electric infrastructure.
In some countries electricity is free...in others it's a private company but heavily regulated.
So...how would half of the population charge their vehicles? And if the electric grid has an increased demand of 40% (or more) megawatts placed upon it...how is that going to work? (Not well)
And then the rural areas flat out can't use an electric car...none of the batteries can hold sufficient power...or will die very quickly from such heavy use.
These challenges and more are coming. There have been some suggestions but none of them have actually panned out to be a good idea as yet.
theres charging stations
but people living in aprtments in the city are not the ones that truly need to own cars - as they have good access to public transport, taxis, ubers etc
its more people in the outer suburbs (suburbs are designed for the automobile) that have their own built in garages that own cars
its interesting that the development of suburbs and motorways went hand in hand with the rise of the (cheap) automobile and it could have gone down the electric route rather than the gas route when push come to shove, and instead of. gas stations there could have been electric stations. But it was gas that won out, as it was at the time, much much cheaper , and the gas/oil companies had their monopolies and trade deals already
however oil and gas has a huge environmental cost as we are finding, not to mention oil spills etc, air pollution. If the car was not so popular and cheap, it wouldnt have compounded the problem.
I think cars are wonderful but they may have had their heyday already
the future is not going to be reliant on oil since its clearly going to run out, but electric cars do need a lot of infrastructure in place to support them as they are not affordable for most at this time.
although I do think a ready supply of alcohol to fuel cars could easily be obtained and cars could run on that lol
instead of people drinking it,
but people living in aprtments in the city are not the ones that truly need to own cars - as they have good access to public transport, taxis, ubers etc
its more people in the outer suburbs (suburbs are designed for the automobile) that have their own built in garages that own cars
its interesting that the development of suburbs and motorways went hand in hand with the rise of the (cheap) automobile and it could have gone down the electric route rather than the gas route when push come to shove, and instead of. gas stations there could have been electric stations. But it was gas that won out, as it was at the time, much much cheaper , and the gas/oil companies had their monopolies and trade deals already
however oil and gas has a huge environmental cost as we are finding, not to mention oil spills etc, air pollution. If the car was not so popular and cheap, it wouldnt have compounded the problem.
I think cars are wonderful but they may have had their heyday already
the future is not going to be reliant on oil since its clearly going to run out, but electric cars do need a lot of infrastructure in place to support them as they are not affordable for most at this time.
although I do think a ready supply of alcohol to fuel cars could easily be obtained and cars could run on that lol
instead of people drinking it,
All these easy solutions you are throwing out are not so easy once you look into them.
I could blithely solve the problems of every parent who has a recalcitrant child too. But I would be talking through my hat because I have never had a kid.
personally I would prefer donkey or camel or elephant as a mode of transport, but, those days are long gone (plus there was the problem of manure, however, that would have been free for the garden)
e-scooters have been trialled, at first they were a nuisance but people seemed to take to them only in the inner city, where you paid for each ride and left it somewhere
rental e-bikes were a bit of a bust.
I counted about 10 gas stations in my immediate area of 1km radius
I dont see charging to be much of a problem at home but depends how often you would use your car and what for...would you need to charge it every night or what. How much could it store and how far could it go.
I think with petrol/diesel its relatively simple to just top up as long as you can get to a station, just the expense really, and again not everyone owns a car anyway
I dont get ppl who think or assume that everyone does. A lot of people dont drive at all
e-scooters have been trialled, at first they were a nuisance but people seemed to take to them only in the inner city, where you paid for each ride and left it somewhere
rental e-bikes were a bit of a bust.
I counted about 10 gas stations in my immediate area of 1km radius
I dont see charging to be much of a problem at home but depends how often you would use your car and what for...would you need to charge it every night or what. How much could it store and how far could it go.
I think with petrol/diesel its relatively simple to just top up as long as you can get to a station, just the expense really, and again not everyone owns a car anyway
I dont get ppl who think or assume that everyone does. A lot of people dont drive at all
First off oil is not going to run out. We are just using the existing oil wells faster than those areas in the earth's crust can produce oil. Hydrocarbon fuels are in abundance throughout the universe as heat and pressure create them. So thinking that it comes from dinosaurs or vegetation is inaccurate at best. Yes, it exists just below the shale that has fossilized sea shells...but that's where the temperature and pressure are perfect to form petroleum out of existing minerals...not vegetation.
Secondly....multi-family dwellers are now going to be penalized for wanting to use something other than public transportation? When was the last time you actually rode on commuter public transportation? Not to mention that these days public transportation is full of coronavirus and all sorts of nasty things. If you don't end up beaten and robbed while riding it.
Those pay-for-use charging stations cost 4 times as much as the electric company. So it's almost as much as a normal tank of gas....but with a huge repair bill coming for the battery replacement. And instead of a 5 minute refill at the petrol station....it's now a 20 minute stop...if you happen to find one open.
These days with efficiency standards your average petroleum burning vehicle that is maintained is very very clean. Very little exhaust.
The main reason why China is so dirty is because of centralized heating in the cities. The Government states a specific day and poof...heat is either on or off. And the citizens then turn to burning coal in buckets to stay warm. Not in a special furnace designed to be efficient and clean...literally buckets of coal are burnt. The resulting smog is so thick you can't see the sidewalk in front of your building much less across the street. It isn't automobiles causing their smog issues...or even industry. (Which does plenty on its own of destroying the planet)
And the rare earth elements necessary for each liON cell is a literal environmental disaster once again.
dont know what china's coal buring has got to do with electric cars...? weird how people keep mentioning it
also, yes oil will run out because who is going to wait hundreds or thousands of years for it to form again
they are already trying to frack it which suggests the wells are dry!
newsflash people actually DO ride on commuter transports EVERYDAY to get to work and school. what planet do you live on? not everyone has a car or anywhere to park it.
also, yes oil will run out because who is going to wait hundreds or thousands of years for it to form again
they are already trying to frack it which suggests the wells are dry!
newsflash people actually DO ride on commuter transports EVERYDAY to get to work and school. what planet do you live on? not everyone has a car or anywhere to park it.
also, not many people have a private jet plane either lol
you fly on commercial jet which shock horror you may have to share with OTHER people
and sometimes you might have to ride on a ferry because oh no I dont have a private yacht!
wow that would just ruin my day having to share a ride with someone else I dont even know. How do you people live with yourselves?
its not everyones brithright to have a car ya know
you fly on commercial jet which shock horror you may have to share with OTHER people
and sometimes you might have to ride on a ferry because oh no I dont have a private yacht!
wow that would just ruin my day having to share a ride with someone else I dont even know. How do you people live with yourselves?
its not everyones brithright to have a car ya know
ok well
something to think about because, I heard nz govt is actually phasing out gas/petrol cars by a certain date
so, whether its electric, ethanol or some other kind of car, one wont be able to fill up with petrol eventually, just like a switch over happened with analogue tvs to digital, and land lines to wi fi
and steam locomotive to deisel and then electric.
depending on what cars available and technology at the time.
I mean you could still conceivably use an old car if its still has its warrant of fitness but you wouldnt be able to buy that kind anymore or the gas to fill it.
like does anyone still use BETA or VHS video cassettes? or did they get one of those hybrid recorders that played cassettes ANd dvds lol
something to think about because, I heard nz govt is actually phasing out gas/petrol cars by a certain date
so, whether its electric, ethanol or some other kind of car, one wont be able to fill up with petrol eventually, just like a switch over happened with analogue tvs to digital, and land lines to wi fi
and steam locomotive to deisel and then electric.
depending on what cars available and technology at the time.
I mean you could still conceivably use an old car if its still has its warrant of fitness but you wouldnt be able to buy that kind anymore or the gas to fill it.
like does anyone still use BETA or VHS video cassettes? or did they get one of those hybrid recorders that played cassettes ANd dvds lol
Gasoline...what are they going to do with it?
Petroleum products are in every aspect of our lives anymore. From roads to tires...everything out there is made in part by Petroleum products...including your morning vitamins. Your breakfast was grown with fertilizers made from Petroleum products.
When they refine Petroleum, one of the first products that comes out of it is the gasoline. Then the other products are made from the bitumen that remains.
China is mentioned because they are a large nation with a lot of people who are very very inefficient with their use of energy. They are the chief polluting nation in the world. India is second.
Africa is another one. But it's not necessarily just one nation that is polluting the environment.
I've been told, but not seen it for myself, that in the middle east ocean docks where they fill tankers there's a layer of oil on the ocean an inch thick at all times and that the water is filled with snakes.
Talk about hostile environment...
So...
I can see where things will need to change. No doubt about it. Western Cultures that voraciously purchase these things and poor nations that don't care to be clean about them is polluting the planet. And forcing people into electric cars is not the answer. There's the real issue. These things are horribly wasteful, expensive, and not cleaner than an internal combustion engine...which is the claim.
So...
If we need to do something to stop "greenhouse" gasses. Then the first thing that needs to go is the smelting of aluminum. It's ten times worse than steel. But everyone's favorite drinks come in aluminum cans. We also make airplanes and engines out of the stuff...car wheel rims too. But the gasses emitted during aluminum smelting are the absolute worst...and they don't leave the atmosphere like CO² does. (Which is what your car produces)
The "carbon dioxide footprint" is somewhat of a misnomer. The bacteria in the soil is producing more than vehicle exhaust ever dreamed about. Especially unfarmed territory. Everyone talks about how wild rainforest and jungles need to be preserved...actually they need to be tamed. They produce a huge carbon dioxide footprint. More than cities.
Just saying.
Give it up man. The task you have set yourself in this thread is kind of like trying to teach a cat to sing. It won't do any good and it annoys the cat. Just let the cat go and be a cat. Or in this case, just let lanolin be lanolin and believe whatever she wants to believe.
That's a given...
However if someone else comes along and wants to actually understand why all the fussing over them....they will understand the issue.
Personally I think that the technology advances that have come from the cars is wonderful. New, more powerful electric motors and batteries both are good.
And an understanding of the real issues in play instead of the political positions doesn't hurt either.
Politicians lie...and for whatever reason people seem to repeat them.
China got brought up because you said something about "acid, smoggy air", remember? China has visible smoggy air v the rest of the world where the air quality isn't as noticeably bad.
So it keeps getting mentioned because you initially brought it up.
Yes. We have VHS and a VHS player.
Still have cassettes tapes, too.
I have a large family. For us, owning our own vehicle is more efficient than cramming us all on public transport when we want to visit family or friends or just to buy groceries...need that trunk space to get the food home. No way I could manage to carry 20+ bags of food on public transport.
Might work great for single folks or couples without kids, though.
So is the present - and, a good bit of the past - stupid has been around for a long time already...
my cousin says shes going to get a hybrid - her company is supplying the cars and they all have to be evs in the next 3 years
but she says since her work takes her to different territories the hybrid is so so she doesnt get stuck in case theres no charging stations its not just this city
if she gets solar panels in her home she can charge it using that, so electricity wont come off the grid for that
and solar can also be used to hot water
so, in that sense its clean energy, or cleaner
though most people are worried at how long the evs will last. Current technology isnt that stable to justify the cost, however if your company/work pays for your car and mileage you dont need to worry about that side of it.
but she says since her work takes her to different territories the hybrid is so so she doesnt get stuck in case theres no charging stations its not just this city
if she gets solar panels in her home she can charge it using that, so electricity wont come off the grid for that
and solar can also be used to hot water
so, in that sense its clean energy, or cleaner
though most people are worried at how long the evs will last. Current technology isnt that stable to justify the cost, however if your company/work pays for your car and mileage you dont need to worry about that side of it.
dont know how the phase out is going to happen or what will happen to all the old cars though
I guess ppl will stop making them as evs become cheaper
when i see new housing going up though, it doesnt seem like solar panels are included
though its now regulation to have heat pumps. And am not sure how efficient those are
I do know a/c is incredibly noisy
?! Though I thought well what about insulation.
however, open fires are banned because of the smog situation, so you will hardly have a home with a chimney anymore
whether that is good or bad not sure, though its better for the fate of the poor child chimney sweepers
I guess ppl will stop making them as evs become cheaper
when i see new housing going up though, it doesnt seem like solar panels are included
though its now regulation to have heat pumps. And am not sure how efficient those are
I do know a/c is incredibly noisy
?! Though I thought well what about insulation.
however, open fires are banned because of the smog situation, so you will hardly have a home with a chimney anymore
whether that is good or bad not sure, though its better for the fate of the poor child chimney sweepers
You need to understand the part that you are not understanding...
In the U.S.A. - with only a few exceptions for certain scenarios - owning a car is considered to be a necessity. And, in this context, I am referring only to its use for personal transportation. (Not including trucks needed for the farm, etc. additional uses.)
In the U.S.A. - believe it or not - owning a car is considered to be (in a way) a "rite of passage" (not kidding).
With the few exceptions mentioned above - if you live here and do not own a car - you are in a real predicament.
You can hardly expect to be able to get a good job - one that will provide a sufficient income to support a family - unless you own a good car that will get you to work every day.
Rare is the case that public transportation is built or designed to go to these places - unless it is in a very large city. It basically does not exist anywhere else.
Anywhere other than in the larger more dense cities - including the smaller cities and towns - it can be (and usually is) miles to work, to church, to the grocery store, anywhere you might want to go.
It is generally considered to be a practical necessity to have a car, truck, motorcycle, etc. - something that will get you where you need to go.
Another thing...
We consider it reasonable for anyone to not have to wait for public transportation to show up - if at all possible - to get where they want to go. If you have a car, you are pretty-much at liberty to go anywhere you need to go the moment you want to to go there.
It is considered "unfortunate" (and, in some cases, dangerous) to have to travel via public transportation. You are considered to be "poor" and/or at some severe disadvantage if you do not have a car.
I had a job once where I had to take the bus to work and back home. And, not just a single bus - but three - to make the trip. And, having about 10 minutes wait time between bus #1 and bus #2 - and, 30 minutes wait time between bus #2 and bus #3. It took ~2 hours to make the trip one-way. I could have driven it in 10-15 minutes.
Having a car is so entirely woven into our society that - if you do not have a car - it "robs" you of certain basic parts of our society (that many take for granted).