3rd Testament
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A
If you don't have any verses, how do I know it's there? How do I know you aren't just pulling this out of a hat? I know of no verse that promotes Genocide.
L
Again, God was not getting rid of nations because He wanted Israel to be the only nation on the planet. If He wanted that then He couldve just destroyed the lot in one go. But it wasnt about favouritism, it was about judging the nations for their evil. When a nation was so evil that it basically couldnt be saved, God used His people to destroy them, and in so doing, warn the other nations of two things. 1. There were no other Gods apart from Him and 2. He is a God to be feared. He demands fairness, justice, righteousness and kindness of all His creation and when we go against that, do things our own way to the point of barbaric behaviour and selfish evil, then look out.
J
Yeah in Dueteronomy and in Samuel and Joshua I think 15:2-3 and 6:21 and 10:40.
NIV said:
Deuteronomy 6:21
21 tell him: “We were slaves of Pharaoh in Egypt, but the LORD brought us out of Egypt with a mighty hand.
21 tell him: “We were slaves of Pharaoh in Egypt, but the LORD brought us out of Egypt with a mighty hand.
New International Version said:
Deuteronomy 15:2-3
2 This is how it is to be done: Every creditor shall cancel any loan they have made to a fellow Israelite. They shall not require payment from anyone among their own people, because the LORD’s time for canceling debts has been proclaimed. 3 You may require payment from a foreigner, but you must cancel any debt your fellow Israelite owes you.
2 This is how it is to be done: Every creditor shall cancel any loan they have made to a fellow Israelite. They shall not require payment from anyone among their own people, because the LORD’s time for canceling debts has been proclaimed. 3 You may require payment from a foreigner, but you must cancel any debt your fellow Israelite owes you.
NIV said:
1 Samuel 6:21
21 Then they sent messengers to the people of Kiriath Jearim, saying, “The Philistines have returned the ark of the LORD. Come down and take it up to your town.”
21 Then they sent messengers to the people of Kiriath Jearim, saying, “The Philistines have returned the ark of the LORD. Come down and take it up to your town.”
NIV said:
1 Samuel 15:2-3
2 This is what the LORD Almighty says: ‘I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt. 3 Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy[a] all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”
2 This is what the LORD Almighty says: ‘I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt. 3 Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy[a] all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”
No genocide here, but... check this..
RationalChristianity.net said:
The revenge was in fact punishment from God on an unrepentant nation. As noted above, they were given ample time to change their ways. While it was the descendents of the original attackers who were punished, they led the same evil lifestyle that their ancestors had (and possibly one that was worse - in dealing with evil nations in the OT, God often withheld punishment until their wickedness reached a particularly high level). Furthermore, it was God who was avenging the Israelites, not the Israelites themselves. God, who has perfect knowledge, wisdom and justice, has the authority to avenge; humans, including the Israelites, do not have this authority.
The Destruction of the Amalekites <--- click for more
The Destruction of the Amalekites <--- click for more
NIV said:
2 Samuel 6:21
21 David said to Michal, “It was before the LORD, who chose me rather than your father or anyone from his house when he appointed me ruler over the LORD’s people Israel—I will celebrate before the LORD.
21 David said to Michal, “It was before the LORD, who chose me rather than your father or anyone from his house when he appointed me ruler over the LORD’s people Israel—I will celebrate before the LORD.
NIV said:
2 Samuel 15:2-3
2 He would get up early and stand by the side of the road leading to the city gate. Whenever anyone came with a complaint to be placed before the king for a decision, Absalom would call out to him, “What town are you from?” He would answer, “Your servant is from one of the tribes of Israel.” 3 Then Absalom would say to him, “Look, your claims are valid and proper, but there is no representative of the king to hear you.”
2 He would get up early and stand by the side of the road leading to the city gate. Whenever anyone came with a complaint to be placed before the king for a decision, Absalom would call out to him, “What town are you from?” He would answer, “Your servant is from one of the tribes of Israel.” 3 Then Absalom would say to him, “Look, your claims are valid and proper, but there is no representative of the king to hear you.”
NIV said:
Joshua 10:40
40 So Joshua subdued the whole region, including the hill country, the Negev, the western foothills and the mountain slopes, together with all their kings. He left no survivors. He totally destroyed all who breathed, just as the LORD, the God of Israel, had commanded.
40 So Joshua subdued the whole region, including the hill country, the Negev, the western foothills and the mountain slopes, together with all their kings. He left no survivors. He totally destroyed all who breathed, just as the LORD, the God of Israel, had commanded.
NIV said:
]
Joshua 6:21
21 They devoted the city to the LORD and destroyed with the sword every living thing in it—men and women, young and old, cattle, sheep and donkeys.
Joshua 6:21
21 They devoted the city to the LORD and destroyed with the sword every living thing in it—men and women, young and old, cattle, sheep and donkeys.
NIV said:
Joshua 15:2-3
2 Their southern boundary started from the bay at the southern end of the Dead Sea, 3 crossed south of Scorpion Pass, continued on to Zin and went over to the south of Kadesh Barnea. Then it ran past Hezron up to Addar and curved around to Karka.
2 Their southern boundary started from the bay at the southern end of the Dead Sea, 3 crossed south of Scorpion Pass, continued on to Zin and went over to the south of Kadesh Barnea. Then it ran past Hezron up to Addar and curved around to Karka.
Maybe we have a misunderestanding of genocide...
Psymon, would you agree, that genocide is defined as the killing of human beings for the sole reason that they are another Skin Color or Ethnic group? Thus putting the "Geno" in Genocide.
Also, I don't recall any verse where God says, "Go kill the Amalekites because they're Amalekites." From my memory, it was always based on the nations immoralities.
J
If you want to be technical then yeah I suppose so but the laws within war are different.
By your definition, the allied war effort against the Nazis was immoral and should not have taken place.
Also, these "different" laws within war, are completely human constructs and have no forebearance on reality of the moralness of an action, such as war.
L
Or this one: 3 You shall not intermarry with them, giving your daughters to their sons or taking their daughters for your sons, 4for they would turn away your sons from following me, to serve other gods. Then the anger of the LORD would be kindled against you, and he would destroy you quickly. 5But thus shall you deal with them: you shall break down their altars and dash in pieces their pillars and chop down their Asherim and burn their carved images with fire.
Because there God doesnt necessarily mean mass killing, and even if He did, Hes warning them. He doesnt want them serving fake/false gods because Hes the only true God, and if they obey Him and destroy all the altars and worship only Him then He will bless them abundantly. As for the other nations, they again, were destroyed for their evil.
Because there God doesnt necessarily mean mass killing, and even if He did, Hes warning them. He doesnt want them serving fake/false gods because Hes the only true God, and if they obey Him and destroy all the altars and worship only Him then He will bless them abundantly. As for the other nations, they again, were destroyed for their evil.
J
Of course war undertakes different rules, I'm not saying that the effort against Nazi's was Immoral I'm saying if you want to be pedantic about it it's a similar thing but life isn't black and white.
Every case that God orders the israelites to carry out God's justice, he gives reasons. I have not found anything where he indicates the reason is their nationality or ethnic group. It has from my understanding always been based on their actions. For example, I don't recall who, I think maybe the Amalekites, they were sacrificing children to idols. However, in many western countries we do that now anyway so I don't expect you to see that as immoral.