Weaponized FBI and DOJ searching Mar-L -lago
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Oh, so you were talking about earthly justice? I was under the impression that in earthly justice you are innocent until proven guilty. So I hope everyone will apply that same standard to Trump.
I also thought we had a constitutional right that protects us from unwarranted searches and seizures. So I hope all will confess that the FBI was wrong in taking things (at the moment we know about the passports) that were not part of the warrant.
I also thought that with earthly law we understood the concept of the poisoned tree and that all would admit the judge who very clearly was biased and admitted they could not be a judge in a trial between Trump and Clinton should not have signed off on this warrant, hence the entire warrant is the fruit of the poisoned tree.
So hope that righteousness and justice will prevail and not this mob mentality that you display, that is not justice or righteousness to suppose someone is guilty without giving them their day in court.
Hunter's laptop is evidence that should be addressed, investigated and dealt with. Instead it was denied, lied about, buried, and hidden. There is a difference between praying for righteousness and justice to be done, for the there to be light and salt, and "hoping that God metes out His justice to Hunter". I can pray for Hunter's salvation, repentance, confession, and also pray that God would shine a light on the laptop. The same is true of Hillary's emails. I am not against a search warrant that is based on probable cause and executed according to the laws of this land on Trump. I don't think he is above the law. I was not against Mueller's investigation, but I am against stopping the investigation when it discovered that in fact the real criminals were in the FBI working to help Hillary get elected.
Keep your brownies, I don't trust anything you would cook up.
Saul of Tarsus was out there rounding up Christians to be tried and killed. In our flesh and our natural mind we would pray that God would mete out his justice on Saul. However, what God did was to save Saul and transform him into Paul. That was far more glorious and impactful. In the same way we should be praying for others.
13 Then Ananias answered, Lord, I have heard by many of this man, how much evil he hath done to thy saints at Jerusalem: 14 And here he hath authority from the chief priests to bind all that call on thy name.
This doesn't mean we ignore the evil that a person has done. I think there are many things about Trump's sins that are open for the entire world to see. Maybe Jesus was very busy after having just been crowned and had missed this, then He could say "oh, my bad, thanks for that, how about instead you go over and preach to that nice old retired school teacher". The Lord does not rebuke Ananias for pointing this out. Instead He says:
15 But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel: 16 For I will shew him how great things he must suffer for my name's sake.
Some jobs require a great deal of suffering and unless you first were the least of all saints and a very great sinner it would be hard for you to see why you need to go through all that. Perhaps the same can be said of Trump. My feeling is Jesus is Lord and He can use anyone He chooses. After all He paid the price.
13 Then Ananias answered, Lord, I have heard by many of this man, how much evil he hath done to thy saints at Jerusalem: 14 And here he hath authority from the chief priests to bind all that call on thy name.
This doesn't mean we ignore the evil that a person has done. I think there are many things about Trump's sins that are open for the entire world to see. Maybe Jesus was very busy after having just been crowned and had missed this, then He could say "oh, my bad, thanks for that, how about instead you go over and preach to that nice old retired school teacher". The Lord does not rebuke Ananias for pointing this out. Instead He says:
15 But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel: 16 For I will shew him how great things he must suffer for my name's sake.
Some jobs require a great deal of suffering and unless you first were the least of all saints and a very great sinner it would be hard for you to see why you need to go through all that. Perhaps the same can be said of Trump. My feeling is Jesus is Lord and He can use anyone He chooses. After all He paid the price.
Yes, that's what I said.
We do.
Oh, I didn't realize you were one of the FBI agents who illegally seized something outside of the warrant. If you believe it's wrong, why did you do it and why are you now complaining about it?
I'm sorry, I'm not familiar with this particular conspiracy theory.
What you call "mob mentality...that is not justice or righteousness..." God calls, in His Word, His Ministers ordained by Him to mete out His Justice. I think I'm with God on this one. Easy choice. Nobody has "supposed someone is guilty without giving them their day in court" - you just completely made that part up (probably because you know you'd have nothing to whine about if you didn't fabricate a myth to whine about).
Good luck with your theories and imagination!
Thanks for your own biased opinion, but I'm not interested. What I AM interested in is what God says and He says in His Word that you are wrong and that our government are His ministers, ordained by Him to mete out His Justice. Why would I care what conspiracy theories you believe when God's Word already tells me the absolute Truth? I'm a Christian, I believe God over men, especially over men like Trump who is a proven liar and his followers who are known for vulgarity and hate speech.
If you haven't been keeping up with the facts in the case why are you commenting, do your homework.
1. The warrant has been made public, read it.
2. The FBI has admitted they took the passports and they have returned them.
Educate yourself and stop spouting foolish, self righteous judgements.
This is a legal theory that is well established and has been ordained by God as righteous judgement. It aligns well with the Bible teaching on false witnesses
I already posted this on post #132, you stumble into this thread without reading the posts, without reading the news that is reported, and you are leaping to judgements without knowing the facts, the evidence or even the law.
You said Trump was innocent until proven guilty? I missed that post, can you give refer me to that post where you said that. Thanks.
Yes, I believe this also. God will take care of all things in His way and in His time.
Romans 12:19
“Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.”
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This whole distraction from #JohnnyRC90 took place when we were discussing what the DOJ and FBI need to do now.
1Thessalonians 5:22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.
Let's review what we know to be facts.
1. The Judge that signed the warrant should have recused themself. It is very clear that this warrant is closely aligned to the case with Trump vs Clinton that this same judge recused themself from because they had donated money to Clinton's campaign and said on Social Media they want to bring Trump down. Whether or not this warrant was evil it has the appearance.
2. The FBI agents involved in the raid should never have been allowed on this raid. They were involved in the Russiagate hoax where some rogue agents in the FBI tried to bring down Trump's campaign for president. It is absurd to think that this was simply an oversight by those in charge. Yes, Trump is not above the law, but they had to know this raid would be put under the spotlight and it was critical to not give any appearance of bias.
3. These agents took property from Trump's house that was not covered by the warrant. That is a warrantless seizure and a violation of his constitutional rights. Although this may not be criminal (to be criminal you have to prove intent, it they took this by mistake then it isn't criminal, but I highly doubt that could be the case. People don't just leave their passport in unrelated files).
Based on these three facts we know that nothing they took in this raid will be used in a criminal trial because the prosecution would be destroyed in court over these violations, and if this were a real court with an independent judge they wouldn't allow it because it is fruit of the poisoned tree.
Therefore we know that keeping the affidavit secret so as not to harm the investigation is a bogus claim. Everything about this raid is a catastrophe, the only way to fix the credibility of the investigation is to immediately go fully transparent. Trump has asked that the affidavit be made public so there is no legal basis to keep it secret at this point.
Right now all we have are bizarre questions:
What do they mean that these documents were about Trump putting our nuclear secrets at risk?
If it was so serious as to put the national security at risk why did they wait a month to conduct the raid?
If they have probable cause that justified this warrant why hasn't Trump been arrested? They said they had 12 eyewitness accounts from people in the Whitehouse, that is enough for an arrest.
Basically there are two ways the administration can deal with this. Merrick Garland and everyone else responsible for this catastrophe can resign in shame, or they can go completely transparent and justify their actions.
If they don't do these it will be a total catastrophe. Already you see Trump's polls and fund raising sky rocketing, you see a populist movement sweeping the country, and you have fueled the fire of people thinking the Deep State is trying to destroy Trump.
1Thessalonians 5:22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.
Let's review what we know to be facts.
1. The Judge that signed the warrant should have recused themself. It is very clear that this warrant is closely aligned to the case with Trump vs Clinton that this same judge recused themself from because they had donated money to Clinton's campaign and said on Social Media they want to bring Trump down. Whether or not this warrant was evil it has the appearance.
2. The FBI agents involved in the raid should never have been allowed on this raid. They were involved in the Russiagate hoax where some rogue agents in the FBI tried to bring down Trump's campaign for president. It is absurd to think that this was simply an oversight by those in charge. Yes, Trump is not above the law, but they had to know this raid would be put under the spotlight and it was critical to not give any appearance of bias.
3. These agents took property from Trump's house that was not covered by the warrant. That is a warrantless seizure and a violation of his constitutional rights. Although this may not be criminal (to be criminal you have to prove intent, it they took this by mistake then it isn't criminal, but I highly doubt that could be the case. People don't just leave their passport in unrelated files).
Based on these three facts we know that nothing they took in this raid will be used in a criminal trial because the prosecution would be destroyed in court over these violations, and if this were a real court with an independent judge they wouldn't allow it because it is fruit of the poisoned tree.
Therefore we know that keeping the affidavit secret so as not to harm the investigation is a bogus claim. Everything about this raid is a catastrophe, the only way to fix the credibility of the investigation is to immediately go fully transparent. Trump has asked that the affidavit be made public so there is no legal basis to keep it secret at this point.
Right now all we have are bizarre questions:
What do they mean that these documents were about Trump putting our nuclear secrets at risk?
If it was so serious as to put the national security at risk why did they wait a month to conduct the raid?
If they have probable cause that justified this warrant why hasn't Trump been arrested? They said they had 12 eyewitness accounts from people in the Whitehouse, that is enough for an arrest.
Basically there are two ways the administration can deal with this. Merrick Garland and everyone else responsible for this catastrophe can resign in shame, or they can go completely transparent and justify their actions.
If they don't do these it will be a total catastrophe. Already you see Trump's polls and fund raising sky rocketing, you see a populist movement sweeping the country, and you have fueled the fire of people thinking the Deep State is trying to destroy Trump.
Thanks for all your speculation and opinion. Unfortunately, there are tons of uninformed people with speculation and opinions and yours is just another one that carries no weight.
On the other hand, I have God's Word which tells me the Truth; as a Christian, I'm believing God's Word over your speculation and opinions and God's Word directly contradicts your guesswork.
Rather than find God's Word to be a "distraction" you would do well to heed It as His Holy Word and The Truth instead of listening to other, man-made sources.
OK, let me look again at what you said:
Post #174 It's good that God is meting His Justice against Trump through the authorities that He has ordained. I hope justice is fully served against Trump.
So we were to understand that when you said "God is meting His Justice against Trump" you meant that he was innocent until proven guilty?
I suppose comments like this in Post #186 I'm a Christian, I believe God over men, especially over men like Trump who is a proven liar and his followers who are known for vulgarity and hate speech.
Have many of us on this thread confused, thinking you were passing judgement.
God is indeed a God of Justice as well as mercy. We have a limited time to repent and come to Him.... then Judgement Day. This pertains to all men, even politicians.
You have only posted 8 times on this forum (fact) and six of those posts are on this thread (fact), one post is introducing yourself, and one post is a response to that introduction.
If you have been on this forum for a year why is it that this thread is the first one you wanted to comment on? You say you have been on the forum for a year and yet you introduce yourself for the first time yesterday?
Yet in every post you claim you are speaking from God's word. Really? We haven't seen one thing from God's word from you, not even your introducing testimony.
Amen! I know I jumped into the middle of I-know-not-what, but this verse comes to mind:
Romans 3:4
“God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.”
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Praise the Lord!Of course you were. Why would you understand differently? I said "meting out His Justice". The only way you would think that means something other than "innocent until proven guilty" is if you yourself believe that "His Justice" is something other than "innocent until proven guilty". Is that what you believe? If so, that's your own interpretation, and that is not my own words, as you have shown clearly in your quote of me. Why is this so hard for you to follow and to own your mistake?
This is a separate post. The first post you quoted is specifically about the FBI's raid on Trump's home. In that instance I acknowledge that the FBI is God's ordained Minister meting out His Justice against Trump.
As for Trump being a proven liar, aside from just the issue of the FBI raid (which we have to learn more what the FBI discovers and what the courts decide), he is proven to have lied on many, many, many, many occasions. January 6 insurrection is just one example where he lied openly and repeatedly. So that's not "passing judgement" - the judgement is already done and it's a proven fact, and I am just stating the fact.
You seem to like to jumble up facts with myths and mix up and twist what others say, which in my experience is typical of those who support Trump and of Trump himself. I hope you will turn to Christ by listening to God's Word instead of listening to men.
You are new to the forum, we like to get an idea of who we are talking to, in your very first post on this thread, and only your second substantive post on this forum you give this obscure and vague post, it is very reasonable that it would be hard for any to understand what you were saying.
Since I have said essentially the same thing many, many times that I am happy for justice to be done, and if Trump, or Clinton, or Obama or whoever is guilty I am all for them to be charged, tried and convicted. So why are you attacking my posts as being contrary to God's word?
In Post #176 responding to me you said "I'm sorry that you are averse to His Word on that issue,"
Why would you say that if you are saying the same thing I have said repeatedly?
These facts are not jumbled. If Trump has lied concerning January 6th that is relevant to them investigating him.
On the other hand the FBI has already been proven to have lied over FISA warrants, and about Russiagate hoax, and to have hid evidence concerning Hunter Biden's laptop which would have exonerated Trump in the first impeachment. That also is relevant to people not trusting them now.