Speaking in Tongues

[Cameron143]

Paul says clearly that tongues will pass away as will knowledge ... we still have knowledge do we not?

Sometimes it's debatable whether there is much knowledge but the reason that love remains is because it never fails while tongues and knowledge will no longer be necessary when we see face to face. But I agree that there is no reason to associate the cessation of tongues to the end of the Apostolic age since the Bible makes no such assertion.

 

[Evmur]

Are there actual people who desire the gift of tongues, a language that they can't even understand and makes them look like freaks to the world? Who would want that? I have never desired tongues . . . it hasn't even crossed my mind.

Understanding the actual Gospel of Jesus Christ is infinitely more important than uttering sounds ya can't even understand.

Let's be perfectly frank an awful lot of Christians do not actually want to be full of the Holy Spirit. just a dab will do for them.

To simply testify publicly about Jesus will make you a freak.

Did you ever desire rivers of living water flowing out of your belly? perhaps it goes hand in hands with tongues.

Thing about the Holy Spirit is you've got to go with what He is doing at a certain time, you've got to keep up. Folks hankering for something He did in the 17th or 18th century are going to be disappointed.

 

[Evmur]

Sometimes it's debatable whether there is much knowledge but the reason that love remains is because it never fails while tongues and knowledge will no longer be necessary when we see face to face. But I agree that there is no reason to associate the cessation of tongues to the end of the Apostolic age since the Bible makes no such assertion.

There is no reason for folk to set love in opposition to tongues [I know you did not do that] but people do. Paul loved, he also spake in other tongues.

And Paul as apostle never spake as a child.

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

if you sniff at God He will likely sniff at you.

you can't get away with quoting half scriptures for it clearly says when the perfect is come these things will pass away.

Oh, I'm sorry. Are you saying that I am trying to "get away" with quoting half scriptures?

 

[ResidentAlien]

Thing about the Holy Spirit is you've got to go with what He is doing at a certain time, you've got to keep up. Folks hankering for something He did in the 17th or 18th century are going to be disappointed.

Not true. "Desire without knowledge is not good, and whoever makes haste with his feet misses his way." Proverbs 19:2 The doctrine you're teaching is on how to be manipulated and conned by clever hucksters. They don't want you to stop and think.

 

[Bob-Carabbio]

When Paul speaks of speaking though I speak tongues of angels.. it is hyperbole.. exaggeration to make a point.

Agreed.

 

[Bob-Carabbio]

i've only participated in 4 or 5 of these Threads about Speaking in Tongues. and each one i say the same thing, which this Pastor Max has now said, ask God for the Gift and be sincere about it and He will give it to you.

In my case he did - about a month after I was prayed over, asking for the "Baptism in the Holy Spirit" (to use AG Vernacular).

 

[2ndTimothyGroup]

In my case he did - about a month after I was prayed over, asking for the "Baptism in the Holy Spirit" (to use AG Vernacular).

Are you able to tell us how this gift has improved the quality of your relationship with God? How as Tongues improved your life?

Thanks!

 

[Evmur]

Not true. "Desire without knowledge is not good, and whoever makes haste with his feet misses his way." Proverbs 19:2 The doctrine you're teaching is on how to be manipulated and conned by clever hucksters. They don't want you to stop and think.

We are believing and acting with knowledge of scripture which bids us to earnestly desire the gifts

... after more than 45 years I can testify to you I have not missed the way.

 

[Evmur]

Oh, I'm sorry. Are you saying that I am trying to "get away" with quoting half scriptures?

I feel sure you would not knowingly mislead anyone bro. But if you say knowledge and gifts will pass away you have to show when the scripture says this passing away happens. When that which is perfect has come.

 

[Bob-Carabbio]

Are you able to tell us how this gift has improved the quality of your relationship with God? How as Tongues improved your life?

Thanks!

I don't know that "Tongues" in and of themselves has had much of an impact on my life. It's kind of intellectually ridiculous to babble in a tongue that's meaningless to you - BUT - The Bible says that when I speak in tongues I'm "Edifying myself", so I take it on faith that the Bible doesn't LIE.

Self edification, of course, is a GOOD thing, since it inevitably leads to ministry to others. And speaking stuff that the Holy Spirit sources is good practice of other aspects of spoken giftings - like teaching, interpretation, prophesy.

The PRIMARY PRACTICAL aspect of being "Filled with the Holy Spirit" (AG/Pentecostal vernacular - Biblically: "Endued with POWER from on high" according to Jesus) with "tongues" being a feature of that, was that suddenly I was able to teach small group Bible studies, and adult Sunday School classes with Biblical content, that would simple "flow in" before the classes, and I could go on with materials given by the Holy Spirit every week for YEARS. BEFORE that would have been simply IMPOSSIBLE to do.

I've NEVER spoken in tongues in a public setting, however I have on many occasions been burdened to INTERPRET tongues in meetings, and occasionally to speak prophetically (same gifting, different "language").

 

[ResidentAlien]

We are believing and acting with knowledge of scripture which bids us to earnestly desire the gifts

... after more than 45 years I can testify to you I have not missed the way.

If you say so.

 

[Evmur]

Not true. "Desire without knowledge is not good, and whoever makes haste with his feet misses his way." Proverbs 19:2 The doctrine you're teaching is on how to be manipulated and conned by clever hucksters. They don't want you to stop and think.

If "they" were hucksters through whose ministry I was saved then I would never have received the baptism with the Holy Ghost, if they were hucksters I would not have been saved.

I never learned about the baptism with the Holy Ghost through them, that just happened when I was saved.

Many, many thousands testify to being saved through their ministry, a great many healed.

.... what have you to show?

 

[NBTT]

Scripture confirms God uses tongues for different purposes.
1. All who receive God's gift of the Holy Ghost speak in tongues. (Acts 2:3-4, 10:44, 19:6) Notice all are mentioned, no one was excluded from having the experience.
2. Whereas not all operate in the spiritual gift of tongues which is then interpreted by the Holy Ghost through a person operating in that gift for edification of the church.

Thanks for this reply. I am only seeking truth and don't want to have any opinion other than God's truth. Pagans historically and biblically did glossolalia before Christians so in itself glossolalia isn't proof of the Holy Spirit. We are commanded to verify spirits. We are also told to judge by the fruits. Although a relatively small sample, the modern tongue speakers we know have a holier than thou (puffed up) attitude.

My wife and I since we believed, hate sin that creeps into our lives. We love all of God's Word. We love fellow members of the body of Christ (our prayer life needs improving, should pray always, and struggle to love our persecutors so still sinners...). Are you saying we don't have the Holy Spirit because we don't perform glossolalia? Are you saying modern tongue speakers we know who display pride and jealousy and little love are filled with the Holy Spirit?

We have acquaintances in Qigong who display most of the behaviors of the modern tongue speakers. See chart. We pray daily for physical and spiritual protection knowing the lion roaming around seeking who he can devour. We also thank God for all His continued blessings through Jesus Christ.

 

[ResidentAlien]

If "they" were hucksters through whose ministry I was saved then I would never have received the baptism with the Holy Ghost, if they were hucksters I would not have been saved.

I never learned about the baptism with the Holy Ghost through them, that just happened when I was saved.

Many, many thousands testify to being saved through their ministry, a great many healed.

.... what have you to show?

I had a sore toe healed once.

 

[Magenta]

So John MacArthur condemns speaking in tongues and we're supposed to be impressed?
How many books has he had published? (I won’t list them…)

Disclaimer: I have never heard of Max Lucado. Just pointing out your interesting logic.

I got to 100 in my count and was not anywhere near halfway down the page

https://www.paperbackswap.com/John-Macarthur/author/

 

[Pilgrimshope]

It stands to reason that the gift of tongues has a compliment in the gift of interpretation of tongues

we’re actually informed a lot about it a lot of details we can learn from like this example

“For if the trumpet give an uncertain sound, who shall prepare himself to the battle? So likewise ye, except ye utter by the tongue words easy to be understood, how shall it be known what is spoken? for ye shall speak into the air.

There are, it may be, so many kinds of voices in the world, and none of them is without signification. Therefore if I know not the meaning of the voice, I shall be unto him that speaketh a barbarian, and he that speaketh shall be a barbarian unto me. Even so ye, forasmuch as ye are zealous of spiritual gifts, seek that ye may excel to the edifying of the church. Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret. For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

Else when thou shalt bless with the spirit, how shall he that occupieth the room of the unlearned say Amen at thy giving of thanks, seeing he understandeth not what thou sayest?

For thou verily givest thanks well, but the other is not edified. I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all: yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭14:8-19‬ ‭KJV‬‬

if we’re saying remarkable things and no one understands what we are saying what benefit is it to anyone ? Interpretation is the gift that needs to compliment tongues in order for there to be any benefit at all even the prayer wouldn’t understand or benefit from a prayer without known words it truly would be babelling Incoherantly not even knowing what was being said

 

[VARob]

Are there actual people who desire the gift of tongues, a language that they can't even understand and makes them look like freaks to the world? Who would want that?

God? 1 Cor 14:5 I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

Paul? 1 Cor 14:18 I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:

(unless you don't think Paul wrote by divine inspiration..)

I have never desired tongues . . . it hasn't even crossed my mind.

Paul desired it. Also, he also said (by revelation) that he wanted all Christians to speak in tongues. He also said we're supposed to be imitators of him.

Understanding the actual Gospel of Jesus Christ is infinitely more important than uttering sounds ya can't even understand.

Yes, understanding the gospel and getting saved is THE most important thing. But don't throw away everything else.

 

[VARob]

if we’re saying remarkable things and no one understands what we are saying what benefit is it to anyone ? Interpretation is the gift that needs to compliment tongues in order for there to be any benefit at all even the prayer wouldn’t understand or benefit from a prayer without known words it truly would be babelling Incoherantly not even knowing what was being said

Yes. In the church, if a person speaks in tongues, he should interpret so that the church is edified.

1 Cor 14:5 I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

1 Cor 14:13 Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret.

But in a person's private prayer life:

1 Cor 14:2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

1 Cor 14:4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.

1 Cor 14:17 For thou verily givest thanks well, but the other is not edified.

 

[DavidTree]

Speaking in tongues a heavenly language?

Acts 2 its earthly, known languages. Not known previously by the speaker.. but known by the hearers.

When Paul speaks of speaking though I speak tongues of angels.. it is hyperbole.. exaggeration to make a point.

You should joyfully remove yourself from speaking against the scripture by making a false claim against it.

This is not hyperbole as you falsely claim:
"Earnestly pursue love and eagerly desire spiritual gifts, especially the gift of prophecy. For he who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men, but to God. Indeed, no one understands him; he utters mysteries in the Spirit. But he who prophesies speaks to men for their edification, encouragement, and comfort. The one who speaks in a tongue edifies himself, but the one who prophesies edifies the church."

Turn away from the temptation and deception of a carnal mind whereby you elevate your reasoning above the very words of the Holy Spirit.

In case you may have forgotten this = the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Truth

Peace