Once saved always saved (OSAS) debunked

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Everlasting-Grace

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Dec 18, 2021
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Runningman said:
I don’t even know what you’re talking about. What about the law? you think the first and greatest commandment, to love God, is the law of Moses? That isn’t the law of Moses, that’s the law of God.

What I think will help you have a coherent Bible discussion is learning about the different kinds of laws and works. When the word law or work is used, it isn’t always referring to keeping the Law of Moses.
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I can;t take anymore of your self righteous mumbo jumbo anymore

go and water down the law. You will see one day how deeply sinful you are. I pray you see before its too late
 
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rogerg

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Runningman said:
You’re not interpreting it correctly and your premise is false. I know how to correctly interpret it though. It means that salvation is a gift, but grace and faith aren’t.
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You interpret it wrong. If salvation is a gift and it is by grace and faith, then they must be gifts too - can't be one without the others.

Runningman said:
Anyway, in Ephesians 5 it says that salvation can be lost via living according to a sinful nature. I strongly urge you to read more than just Ephesians 2 improperly divided and isolated from the grander narrative.

Ephesians 5
3But among you, as is proper among the saints, there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed. 4Nor should there be obscenity, foolish talk, or crude joking, which are out of character, but rather thanksgiving. 5For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure, or greedy person (that is, an idolater), has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
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Those saved have in principle already received their inheritance so it cannot be informing they might lose or not get it. Chapter 5 edifies the saints on how they are to live, not on how to get or keep salvation. Edification is how saints come to learn. But only
those saved follow it without trying to use it to leverage salvation- they follow it because they know it is from God and providing them guidance through Paul, and therefore, it is their desire to follow it. Those who become saved do not wake up one morning, after salvation automatically knowing everything about how to live a Christian life, that has to be taught to them.
Besides that, to you think that King David was saved? He committed many of the sins you say would preclude salvation but they were forgiven him by God.

[Eph 5:17 KJV] 17 Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord [is].
 
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gb9

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Jan 18, 2011
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Runningman said:
You’re not interpreting it correctly and your premise is false. I know how to correctly interpret it though. It means that salvation is a gift, but grace and faith aren’t.

Anyway, in Ephesians 5 it says that salvation can be lost via living according to a sinful nature. I strongly urge you to read more than just Ephesians 2 improperly divided and isolated from the grander narrative.

Ephesians 5
3But among you, as is proper among the saints, there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed. 4Nor should there be obscenity, foolish talk, or crude joking, which are out of character, but rather thanksgiving. 5For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure, or greedy person (that is, an idolater), has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
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the definition of the greek word for grace is " unmerited favor : so, there is that..
 
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Runningman

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gb9 said:
the definition of the greek word for grace is " unmerited favor : so, there is that..
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That’s an easy one to disprove and I think most people already know this, but the word for grace in Greek does not imply favor being received without. If you can prove otherwise, then provide the proof for your claim.
 
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VARob

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Dec 21, 2020
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Runningman said:
That’s an easy one to disprove and I think most people already know this, but the word for grace in Greek does not imply favor being received without. If you can prove otherwise, then provide the proof for your claim.
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What did you do to merit your salvation?
 
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Runningman

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rogerg said:
You interpret it wrong. If salvation is a gift and it is by grace and faith, then they must be gifts too - can't be one without the others.



Those saved have in principle already received their inheritance so it cannot be informing they might lose or not get it. Chapter 5 edifies the saints on how they are to live, not on how to get or keep salvation. Edification is how saints come to learn. But only
those saved follow it without trying to use it to leverage salvation- they follow it because they know it is from God and providing them guidance through Paul, and therefore, it is their desire to follow it. Those who become saved do not wake up one morning, after salvation automatically knowing everything about how to live a Christian life, that has to be taught to them.
Besides that, to you think that King David was saved? He committed many of the sins you say would preclude salvation but they were forgiven him by God.

[Eph 5:17 KJV] 17 Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord [is].
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No they haven’t receive their inheritance yet. One can have eternal life, beginning now, provided they don’t die again spiritually, but immortality isn’t actually received until after the resurrection in the age to come. That’s because salvation can be lost.
 
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Runningman

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VARob said:
What did you do to merit your salvation?
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If grace is unmerited then not even faith would be required. People say things like “grace is unmerited favor” which just another cog in the OSAS machine that makes it all work.

Since grace is based on merit, it accessed through faith like Romans 5 says. Grace just means favor.
 
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Everlasting-Grace

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Runningman said:
If grace is unmerited then not even faith would be required. People say things like “grace is unmerited favor” which just another cog in the OSAS machine that makes it all work.

Since grace is based on merit, it accessed through faith like Romans 5 says. Grace just means favor.
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Faith is not required.

you neither understand grace or faith..

you need to find another church.
 
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gb9

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Runningman said:
That’s an easy one to disprove and I think most people already know this, but the word for grace in Greek does not imply favor being received without. If you can prove otherwise, then provide the proof for your claim.
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ah, so just ignore word meanings and just make up your own.

yep, that is a good idea....
 
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Runningman

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gb9 said:
ah, so just ignore word meanings and just make up your own.

yep, that is a good idea....
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That’s what you’re doing though. I’ve already looked it up many times and studied it. It doesn’t mean unmerited favor.

I gave you a chance to not embarrass yourself, but you’re doubling down on false information.
 
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Everlasting-Grace

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Runningman said:
That’s what you’re doing though. I’ve already looked it up many times and studied it. It doesn’t mean unmerited grace.

I gave you a chance to not embarrass yourself, but you’re doubling down on false information.
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You have not studied

Paul said we can not boast of grace. So its not something we can earn.

he also said if it is of grace it is NOT of works, otherwise grace is no longer grace.

so no matter how you spin it. Works cancels grace/
 
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Everlasting-Grace

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VARob said:
It most certainly is.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

No faith in Christ, no salvation.
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Lol.. Faith is the means by which we RECIEVE grace.

but it is grace that we are saved.

Faith is not a work. He is saying faith is a work. That is wrong. Hence in his defenition of faith, it is not required.
 
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VARob

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Runningman said:
If grace is unmerited then not even faith would be required. People say things like “grace is unmerited favor” which just another cog in the OSAS machine that makes it all work.
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God through Christ made salvation available by faith. Do you think having faith in Christ somehow EARNS God's grace?
 
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