Why Moses and Elijah were at the transfiguration.

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F2F

Member
Dec 12, 2022
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How does Moses & Elijah relate to 2 witness (peoples) who die and are raised and who dramatize the long struggle against political and religious tyranny that has gone on through-out the ages?

Why don't you speak to Revelation 11 rather than inferring notions that don't exist?

F2F
 

F2F

Member
Dec 12, 2022
170
7
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Where in Matthew 17, Mark 9 or Luke 9 does the text say they were encouraging the Son of God?
Lets put to you as plainly as I possible can.
If you have Moses and Elijah speaking to the Lord Jesus Christ crucifixion i.e his decease, departure, exodus what do you think they were doing if not encouraging him?
You need something literally spelled out for you? Discerning the Spirit Word doesn't work that way... Proverbs 25:2; Deut 29:29
Hope that helps
F2F
 
Feb 21, 2016
848
196
43
How does Moses & Elijah relate to 2 witness (peoples) who die and are raised and who dramatize the long struggle against political and religious tyranny that has gone on through-out the ages?

Why don't you speak to Revelation 11 rather than inferring notions that don't exist?

F2F
I've connected these things for you.Elijah and Moses were a remnant and God uses them to be in the image of his Two Witnesses,the water and the blood.

How many times in the Bible do verses appear like this one?

Genesis 45:7-8
And God sent me before you to preserve you a posterity in the earth, and to save your lives by a great deliverance.

So now it was not you that sent me hither, but God: and he hath made me a father to Pharaoh, and lord of all his house, and a ruler throughout all the land of Egypt.


It's the 144,000 who are The Two Witnesses because they will have the testimony of the Two Witnesses in them.They will be transfigured and afterwards will be killed and raised up just like Jesus was.

If you don't believe me who I say who the Two Witnesses are ,think about this.The earth was cursed at the fall of Adam and Eve.It was washed with the water at the flood.And it will be washed with the blood at the fall of Mystery Babylon.
Afterwards there will be a new heaven,and a new earth.

Even the earth needs healing.It will get it's healing from the water and the blood.Just like us.And will be made new.Just like us.
 

F2F

Member
Dec 12, 2022
170
7
18
I've connected these things for you.Elijah and Moses were a remnant and God uses them to be in the image of his Two Witnesses,the water and the blood.

How many times in the Bible do verses appear like this one?

Genesis 45:7-8
And God sent me before you to preserve you a posterity in the earth, and to save your lives by a great deliverance.

So now it was not you that sent me hither, but God: and he hath made me a father to Pharaoh, and lord of all his house, and a ruler throughout all the land of Egypt.

It's the 144,000 who are The Two Witnesses because they will have the testimony of the Two Witnesses in them.They will be transfigured and afterwards will be killed and raised up just like Jesus was.

If you don't believe me who I say who the Two Witnesses are ,think about this.The earth was cursed at the fall of Adam and Eve.It was washed with the water at the flood.And it will be washed with the blood at the fall of Mystery Babylon.
Afterwards there will be a new heaven,and a new earth.

Even the earth needs healing.It will get it's healing from the water and the blood.Just like us.And will be made new.Just like us.
Let me ask you a question, as I think you are all over the place on this topic.

Literal or figurative?

Two Olive Trees
Two Candle Sticks (lampstands is the proper meaning!)
Two witnesses

I'm just looking to see if you can approach the text with the right mindset for now.

F2F
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,843
13,558
113
So you believe the Lord sinned?
Odd thing to say.
if i quote "whatever is not of faith is not sin" and you take it to mean that the Lord sinned, you are the one who thinks that Christ lacked faith and challenging whether Romans 14:23 is true or not.

not me.
 

F2F

Member
Dec 12, 2022
170
7
18
if i quote "whatever is not of faith is not sin" and you take it to mean that the Lord sinned, you are the one who thinks that Christ lacked faith and challenging whether Romans 14:23 is true or not.

not me.
You assumed doubt = sin...you are wrong! You wont admit though...am I right?
So you fail to see the Lords struggles...you fail to interpret them then you misquote Romans 14:23 and fail to provide a correct understanding of your own reference.

Hmmm...let God be the judge!

F2F
 

F2F

Member
Dec 12, 2022
170
7
18
Confirmation bias stops you from looking into the author of your salvation's sufferings and trails. If you did, your foundations would wash away like sea beating upon sand.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
60,171
29,475
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Lets put to you as plainly as I possible can.
If you have Moses and Elijah speaking to the Lord Jesus Christ crucifixion i.e his decease, departure, exodus what do you think they were doing if not encouraging him?
You need something literally spelled out for you? Discerning the Spirit Word doesn't work that way... Proverbs 25:2; Deut 29:29
Hope that helps
F2F
Perhaps Jesus was encouraging them, letting them know what they had long ago anticipated was now imminent.

Though it was a vision.
 
Feb 21, 2016
848
196
43
Let me ask you a question, as I think you are all over the place on this topic.

Literal or figurative?

Two Olive Trees
Two Candle Sticks (lampstands is the proper meaning!)
Two witnesses

I'm just looking to see if you can approach the text with the right mindset for now.

F2F

Isaiah 13:2-4
Lift ye up a banner upon the high mountain, exalt the voice unto them, shake the hand, that they may go into the gates of the nobles.

I have commanded my sanctified ones, I have also called my mighty ones for mine anger, even them that rejoice in my highness.

The noise of a multitude in the mountains, like as of a great people; a tumultuous noise of the kingdoms of nations gathered together: the Lord of hosts mustereth the host of the battle

Revelation 14:1
And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

In Isaiah 13 his sanctified ones are His Two Witnesses, and his mighty ones are his remnant.


Isaiah 25:6-8
And in this mountain shall the Lord of hosts make unto all people a feast of fat things, a feast of wines on the lees, of fat things full of marrow, of wines on the lees well refined.

And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations.

He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord God will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the Lord hath spoken it.

Isaiah 43:7-10
everyone who is called by my name,
whom I created for my glory,
whom I formed and made.”
Lead out those who have eyes but are blind,
who have ears but are deaf.

All the nations gather together
and the peoples assemble.
Which of their gods foretold this
and proclaimed to us the former things?
Let them bring in their witnesses to prove they were right,
so that others may hear and say, “It is true.”
“You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord,

“and my servant whom I have chosen,
so that you may know and believe me
and understand that I am he.

Before me no god was formed,
nor will there be one after me.


The Lord is saying let "them" bring in their "witnesses" to prove they were right.
Their "witnesses" being The Two Witnesses of Revelation and "them" being the ones who stand on mount Zion with the Lamb.

In Zechariah 4,is Zerubbabel literally coming to finish it?or was the Lord speaking of his remnant?
Look what happens to Joshua in the chapter before Zechariah 4.

Zechariah 3

And he shewed me Joshua the high priest standing before the angel of the Lord, and Satan standing at his right hand to resist him.

And the Lord said unto Satan, The Lord rebuke thee, O Satan; even the Lord that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee: is not this a brand plucked out of the fire?

Now Joshua was clothed with filthy garments, and stood before the angel.

And he answered and spake unto those that stood before him, saying, Take away the filthy garments from him. And unto him he said, Behold, I have caused thine iniquity to pass from thee, and I will clothe thee with change of raiment.

And I said, Let them set a fair mitre upon his head. So they set a fair mitre upon his head, and clothed him with garments. And the angel of the Lord stood by.

And the angel of the Lord protested unto Joshua, saying,

Thus saith the Lord of hosts; If thou wilt walk in my ways, and if thou wilt keep my charge, then thou shalt also judge my house, and shalt also keep my courts, and I will give thee places to walk among these that stand by.(his two anointed ones who are standing by the Lord of the whole earth)

Hear now, O Joshua the high priest, thou, and thy fellows that sit before thee: for they are men wondered at: for, behold, I will bring forth my servant the Branch.

For behold the stone that I have laid before Joshua; upon one stone shall be seven eyes: behold, I will engrave the graving thereof, saith the Lord of hosts, and I will remove the iniquity of that land in one day.

In that day, saith the Lord of hosts, shall ye call every man his neighbour under the vine and under the fig tree.
 
Feb 21, 2016
848
196
43
Isaiah 13:2-4
Lift ye up a banner upon the high mountain, exalt the voice unto them, shake the hand, that they may go into the gates of the nobles.

I have commanded my sanctified ones, I have also called my mighty ones for mine anger, even them that rejoice in my highness.

The noise of a multitude in the mountains, like as of a great people; a tumultuous noise of the kingdoms of nations gathered together: the Lord of hosts mustereth the host of the battle

Revelation 14:1
And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

In Isaiah 13 his sanctified ones are His Two Witnesses, and his mighty ones are his remnant.


Isaiah 25:6-8
And in this mountain shall the Lord of hosts make unto all people a feast of fat things, a feast of wines on the lees, of fat things full of marrow, of wines on the lees well refined.

And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations.

He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord God will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the Lord hath spoken it.

Isaiah 43:7-10
everyone who is called by my name,
whom I created for my glory,
whom I formed and made.”
Lead out those who have eyes but are blind,
who have ears but are deaf.

All the nations gather together
and the peoples assemble.
Which of their gods foretold this
and proclaimed to us the former things?
Let them bring in their witnesses to prove they were right,
so that others may hear and say, “It is true.”
“You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord,

“and my servant whom I have chosen,
so that you may know and believe me
and understand that I am he.

Before me no god was formed,
nor will there be one after me.


The Lord is saying let "them" bring in their "witnesses" to prove they were right.
Their "witnesses" being The Two Witnesses of Revelation and "them" being the ones who stand on mount Zion with the Lamb.

In Zechariah 4,is Zerubbabel literally coming to finish it?or was the Lord speaking of his remnant?
Look what happens to Joshua in the chapter before Zechariah 4.

Zechariah 3
And he shewed me Joshua the high priest standing before the angel of the Lord, and Satan standing at his right hand to resist him.

And the Lord said unto Satan, The Lord rebuke thee, O Satan; even the Lord that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee: is not this a brand plucked out of the fire?

Now Joshua was clothed with filthy garments, and stood before the angel.

And he answered and spake unto those that stood before him, saying, Take away the filthy garments from him. And unto him he said, Behold, I have caused thine iniquity to pass from thee, and I will clothe thee with change of raiment.

And I said, Let them set a fair mitre upon his head. So they set a fair mitre upon his head, and clothed him with garments. And the angel of the Lord stood by.

And the angel of the Lord protested unto Joshua, saying,

Thus saith the Lord of hosts; If thou wilt walk in my ways, and if thou wilt keep my charge, then thou shalt also judge my house, and shalt also keep my courts, and I will give thee places to walk among these that stand by.(his two anointed ones who are standing by the Lord of the whole earth)

Hear now, O Joshua the high priest, thou, and thy fellows that sit before thee: for they are men wondered at: for, behold, I will bring forth my servant the Branch.

For behold the stone that I have laid before Joshua; upon one stone shall be seven eyes: behold, I will engrave the graving thereof, saith the Lord of hosts, and I will remove the iniquity of that land in one day.

In that day, saith the Lord of hosts, shall ye call every man his neighbour under the vine and under the fig tree.
In Isaiah 13:2-4,his sanctified ones are his Two Witnesses and the mighty ones are his remnant.
 
Feb 21, 2016
848
196
43
This could be why satan wanted the body of Moses in the OT because he knew God would use him in the image of the blood later on.
He doesn't want any of us to repent and receive the Holy Spirit, and the Kingdom of God.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,843
13,558
113
You assumed doubt = sin...you are wrong! You wont admit though...am I right?
So you fail to see the Lords struggles...you fail to interpret them then you misquote Romans 14:23 and fail to provide a correct understanding of your own reference.

Hmmm...let God be the judge!

F2F
Does not all scripture testify of Him?

Proverbs 22:12
The eyes of the LORD preserve knowledge, but He overthrows the words of the faithless.

Is our Savior the one whose words are overthrown?
How then do you have any confidence in Him?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,843
13,558
113
This could be why satan wanted the body of Moses in the OT because he knew God would use him in the image of the blood later on.
He doesn't want any of us to repent and receive the Holy Spirit, and the Kingdom of God.
The body of Moses had special qualities, see Deuteronomy 34:7
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,843
13,558
113
I'm about to go to bed.can you explain what you mean by this?
At 120 years old his eyes and muscles and lungs had not degraded. His body, apparently, God spared from decay. And God hid his body, burying it Himself.
So why does Satan want such a body. Why that one?
Same reason, I imagine, that the people of Sodom were desperate to get the bodies of the angels, and the men of Gibeah were desperate to get the body of 'a certain Levite'

What were they doing with the bodies? How did they become so rich and have so much idle time when they were killing every stranger that came to town? They weren't forcing everyone into slave labor. They somehow became very powerful - the men of Gibeah could split a hair with a rock.
And the men of Sodom, all of them, young and old, were willing to risk a war with Abraham to get their hands on the body of an angel.
Abraham had the most powerful army in the region. He had rescued all the people of Sodom after they were defeated in battle.

Think about it.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,843
13,558
113
your foundations would wash away like sea beating upon sand.
By which foundation you mean the belief in His diety?
Peter is not the Rock upon which the church of God, bought with His own blood, is built.
The belief Peter expressed is: that Jesus Christ is omniscient God manifest in the flesh. Messiah. Son of God.

There are two different words in Matthew 16:18 that are translated to our pagan language as 'rock' - one means a pebble, that's Simon's name. The other means a large boulder, and that's what Christ said He is building His church on.

I thought this was well known among protestants...?
 

Blade

Well-known member
Nov 19, 2019
1,779
624
113
:) anyone else see this cliff? Well Ok I'm going to jump off here haha. I heard something and since its not written I do not put faith in it yet it was interesting. To make it short if we break down all God said He would show Moses (Himself) and since God is out side of time.. What Moses saw in his day was Christ on that MTN. There was so much more which I will not dive into.

We doubt it from the start but it makes you think. Well where is God? He is right now in the past and with us and in the future. He is out side time.. I am done letting lost already haha
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,843
13,558
113
To make it short if we break down all God said He would show Moses (Himself) and since God is out side of time.. What Moses saw in his day was Christ on that MTN.
Oooh!!