Salvation is for the Whole World

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Underwhosewings

Underwhosewings

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1 Samuel 16:13-14 KJV
Then Samuel took the horn of oil, and anointed him in the midst of his brethren: and the Spirit of the Lord came upon David from that day forward. So Samuel rose up, and went to Ramah.
[14] But the Spirit of the Lord departed from Saul, and an evil spirit from the Lord troubled him.

Walk very close to God
Ephesians 4:30 KJV
And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
 
Magenta

Magenta

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glf said:
Hey Forest...
Jesus tells us in Jn 16: 7 KJV "Nevertheless I tell you the truth; it is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you."
It's just not possible for a person to have been born again or born of the Spirit while Jesus was still here. And to take that idea one step farther, I'll add that the new covenant was not as yet inaugurated because Jesus was still alive and a testament is not in effect while its testator lives. For myself, I suspect that the new covenant didn't become active until Jesus presented his blood to the Father in the true temple in New Jerusalem which the Lord himself pitched.

I used New Jerusalem rather than heaven because scripture tells us that New Jerusalem is the mother of us all. : )
Click to expand...
John 20:18 Mary Magdalene went and announced to the disciples,
“I have seen the Lord!” And she told them what He had said to her.

19 It was the first day of the week, and that very evening, while the disciples were together
with the doors locked for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them. “Peace be with
you!” He said to them. 20 After He had said this, He showed them His hands and His side.

The disciples rejoiced when they saw the Lord.

21 Again Jesus said to them, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent Me, so also I am sending
you.” 22 When He had said this, He breathed on them and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit."
 
G

glf

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ForestGreenCook said:
It is my belief, that the scriptures teach that the old testament saints are born again in the same manner as the new testament saints are, with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. One of the verses that reinforces that is Isaiah 63:11 - Then he remembered the days of old, Mosos, and his people, saying, where is he that brought them up out of the sea, with the shepherd of his flock? Where is he that PUT HIS HOLY SPIRIT WITHIN HIM?

God is a 3 in 1 God. The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, each having a different function. My belief, according to the scriptures, is that the Holy Spirit, also, has different functions. He indwells us as a part of being born again, He reveals the truths of the scriptures to those who have been born again, and He is a comforter to the born again.
Click to expand...
Interesting point, but as I study this passage, I noticed that there's a lot of he, his and him that makes it a bit unclear who is being talked about by the Lord. In the timeframe that this verse is referencing, just after Israel crossed over the red sea, which could usually be called the deep, and just after they stopped eating manna, In Judges 5: 13-15 Joshua saw someone standing with a sword, so he went to him and asked, "are you with us or for our adversaries?" Joshua was told, "Nay; but as captain of the host of the Lord, am I now come," and Joshua worshiped him. This would have been Jesus, just like he had appeared to Shadrach, Meshack, Abednego and Jesus had the Spirit without measure.
 
G

glf

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So, I suspect that Jesus is the shepherd of the flock in Is 63: 11.
 
G

glf

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So I suspect that Jesus is the shepard of the flock in Is 63: 11.
Magenta said:
John 20:18 Mary Magdalene went and announced to the disciples,
“I have seen the Lord!” And she told them what He had said to her.

19 It was the first day of the week, and that very evening, while the disciples were together
with the doors locked for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them. “Peace be with
you!” He said to them. 20 After He had said this, He showed them His hands and His side.

The disciples rejoiced when they saw the Lord.

21 Again Jesus said to them, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent Me, so also I am sending
you.” 22 When He had said this, He breathed on them and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit."
Click to expand...
Acts 1: 4 KJV "And being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which saith he, ye have heard of me." And they received the promised Holy Spirit on the day of Pentecost.
 
Magenta

Magenta

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glf said:
Acts 1: 4 KJV "And being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for
the promise of the Father, which saith he, ye have heard of me." And they received the promised Holy Spirit on the day of Pentecost.
Click to expand...
Are you disputing that the disciples received the Holy Spirit following Jesus' resurrection as stated in John 20:21?
 
G

glf

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Magenta said:
Are you disputing that the disciples received the Holy Spirit following Jesus' resurrection as stated in John 20:21?
Click to expand...
Magenta said:
Are you disputing that the disciples received the Holy Spirit following Jesus' resurrection as stated in John 20:21?
Click to expand...
Hey Magenta...
Awesome artwork! : )
I suspect that the Lord Jesus was preparing the way, when he breathed on them and told them to receive the Holy Spirit in Jn 20. Because:

Acts 2: 1-4 KJV "And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, and they were gathered in one place. And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, where they were all sitting. And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of flames of fire, and it sat upon each of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit, and began to speak with other tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance.

Acts 2: 17 KJV "And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out my Spirit upon all flesh: and you sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams."

Acts 2: 32, 33 KJV "This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we are all witnesses. Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear."
 
Magenta

Magenta

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glf said:
Hey Magenta...
Awesome artwork! : )
I suspect that the Lord Jesus was preparing the way, when he breathed on them and told them to receive the Holy Spirit in Jn 20. Because:

Acts 2: 1-4 KJV "And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, and they were gathered in one place. And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, where they were all sitting. And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of flames of fire, and it sat upon each of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit, and began to speak with other tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance.

Acts 2: 17 KJV "And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out my Spirit upon all flesh: and you sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams."

Acts 2: 32, 33 KJV "This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we are all witnesses. Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear."
Click to expand...
Thank you! .:). Perhaps the main difference is in Acts, Jesus says they will be baptized with the Holy Spirit. .:unsure::)
 
G

glf

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Hey Magenta...
I have another scripture regarding Jn 20.

In Act 1: 8, 9 KJV "But ye shall receive power after than the Holy Spirit is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me in both Jerusalem and all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth. And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight."
 
F

ForestGreenCook

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glf said:
Interesting point, but as I study this passage, I noticed that there's a lot of he, his and him that makes it a bit unclear who is being talked about by the Lord. In the timeframe that this verse is referencing, just after Israel crossed over the red sea, which could usually be called the deep, and just after they stopped eating manna, In Judges 5: 13-15 Joshua saw someone standing with a sword, so he went to him and asked, "are you with us or for our adversaries?" Joshua was told, "Nay; but as captain of the host of the Lord, am I now come," and Joshua worshiped him. This would have been Jesus, just like he had appeared to Shadrach, Meshack, Abednego and Jesus had the Spirit without measure.
Click to expand...

Yes, in many places in the old testament Jesus is functioning Among God's people.

Do you refute the fact that Moses was born again?
 
G

glf

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Underwhosewings said:
Book, Chapter and verse
Please
Click to expand...
Can you show me in the scripture where we're told that Moses was born again?

Acts 2: 32, 33 KJV "Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear."
So we see that the promised Holy Spirit was not sent until Jesus died, resurrected, ascended, and then exalted. In another place; Jesus says that if he remains on the earth, the Holy Spirit would not be sent, so it's more expedient for us that he goes. Based upon the above, if any OT believer was born of the Spirit or indwelt by the Spirit; the Spirit would have had to leave them when Jesus was born a babe in order to be sent after he left and was exalted. But in another place we're told, that the gifts and callings of God are given without repentance.
Another way to look at your question: In water baptism, we are buried with the Lord Jesus in death. Scripture tells us that we are under the law so long as we live, but once we die we're no longer under the law. Then in water baptism, we're raised in newness of life to follow the Spirit. When we were born again, we were by one Spirit baptized into one, the body of Christ, which came into being during Pentecost.
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

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glf said:
Can you show me in the scripture where we're told that Moses was born again?

Acts 2: 32, 33 KJV "Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear."
So we see that the promised Holy Spirit was not sent until Jesus died, resurrected, ascended, and then exalted. In another place; Jesus says that if he remains on the earth, the Holy Spirit would not be sent, so it's more expedient for us that he goes. Based upon the above, if any OT believer was born of the Spirit or indwelt by the Spirit; the Spirit would have had to leave them when Jesus was born a babe in order to be sent after he left and was exalted. But in another place we're told, that the gifts and callings of God are given without repentance.
Another way to look at your question: In water baptism, we are buried with the Lord Jesus in death. Scripture tells us that we are under the law so long as we live, but once we die we're no longer under the law. Then in water baptism, we're raised in newness of life to follow the Spirit. When we were born again, we were by one Spirit baptized into one, the body of Christ, which came into being during Pentecost.
Click to expand...
The promise of the Spirit isn't the same as the Spirit. The Holy Spirit was present at creation.
The promise of the Spirit is the promise of the outpouring of the Spirit promised in Joel 2:28. The difference is in degree, not absence then presence. In the OT as compared to Pentecost and since is that of the difference between sprinkling and pouring. Now there wouldn't be a relative few receiving from God, all the people of God will now...young, old, women,men. No longer would the priestly ministry be necessary...we have all become priests.
 
Underwhosewings

Underwhosewings

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glf said:
Can you show me in the scripture where we're told that Moses was born again?

Acts 2: 32, 33 KJV "Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear."
So we see that the promised Holy Spirit was not sent until Jesus died, resurrected, ascended, and then exalted. In another place; Jesus says that if he remains on the earth, the Holy Spirit would not be sent, so it's more expedient for us that he goes. Based upon the above, if any OT believer was born of the Spirit or indwelt by the Spirit; the Spirit would have had to leave them when Jesus was born a babe in order to be sent after he left and was exalted. But in another place we're told, that the gifts and callings of God are given without repentance.
Another way to look at your question: In water baptism, we are buried with the Lord Jesus in death. Scripture tells us that we are under the law so long as we live, but once we die we're no longer under the law. Then in water baptism, we're raised in newness of life to follow the Spirit. When we were born again, we were by one Spirit baptized into one, the body of Christ, which came into being during Pentecost.
Click to expand...
Yes. Me too.
I was asking FGC where in the Bible is that?
I have not seen “born again” in the Old Testament.
 
G

glf

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Cameron143 said:
The promise of the Spirit isn't the same as the Spirit. The Holy Spirit was present at creation.
The promise of the Spirit is the promise of the outpouring of the Spirit promised in Joel 2:28. The difference is in degree, not absence then presence. In the OT as compared to Pentecost and since is that of the difference between sprinkling and pouring. Now there wouldn't be a relative few receiving from God, all the people of God will now...young, old, women,men. No longer would the priestly ministry be necessary...we have all become priests.
Click to expand...
Well, of course, the Holy Spirit was not created, but abides from everlasting to everlasting, one with the Father and Jesus. In the OT, the Holy Spirit came onto the chosen, like an anointing; whereas in the NT we who have the Spirit have the anointing, only our anointing grows through obedience to the Spirit in those who walk after the Spirit. Yes, the New Covenant makes all of the faithful to be eternal kings and priests of the Host High, with both the ministry and the word of reconciliation. To say that the priestly ministry is no longer necessary, seems to me as being real close to telling the Lord that he's wasting his time. And while we are no longer partakers of the of gifts laid upon the alter as the priests under the order of Aaron, but we do have spiritual offerings to offer, such as "presenting our bodies as living sacrifices unto the Lord, holy and acceptable which is our reasonable service." Intercessors on behalf of the helpless and the needy. We are to be the sweet-smelling savor of Jesus both to the world and to the Lord. We are to offer up the sacrifice of praise unto God continually, that is the fruit of our lips giving thanks unto his name.
One thought, we'll have the scriptures with us throughout eternity and the standard of holiness and righteousness would be like the Lord infinite, and thankfully, we'll have plenty of time to learn.
Jn 17:3 KJV "And this is eternal life, that we may know him, the only true God and his Son Jesus Christ whom he has sent."
 
Underwhosewings

Underwhosewings

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Romans 10:16-21 KJV
But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
[17] So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
[18] But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.
[19] But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by them that are no people, and by a foolish nation I will anger you.
[20] But Esaias is very bold, and saith, I was found of them that sought me not; I was made manifest unto them that asked not after me.
[21] But to Israel he saith, All day long I have stretched forth my hands unto a disobedient and gainsaying people.
 
Underwhosewings

Underwhosewings

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Oh that this could be said of us!

Acts 5:28 KJV
Saying, Did not we straitly command you that ye should not teach in this name? and, behold, ye have filled Jerusalem with your doctrine, and intend to bring this man's blood upon us.
 
F

ForestGreenCook

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glf said:
Well, of course, the Holy Spirit was not created, but abides from everlasting to everlasting, one with the Father and Jesus. In the OT, the Holy Spirit came onto the chosen, like an anointing; whereas in the NT we who have the Spirit have the anointing, only our anointing grows through obedience to the Spirit in those who walk after the Spirit. Yes, the New Covenant makes all of the faithful to be eternal kings and priests of the Host High, with both the ministry and the word of reconciliation. To say that the priestly ministry is no longer necessary, seems to me as being real close to telling the Lord that he's wasting his time. And while we are no longer partakers of the of gifts laid upon the alter as the priests under the order of Aaron, but we do have spiritual offerings to offer, such as "presenting our bodies as living sacrifices unto the Lord, holy and acceptable which is our reasonable service." Intercessors on behalf of the helpless and the needy. We are to be the sweet-smelling savor of Jesus both to the world and to the Lord. We are to offer up the sacrifice of praise unto God continually, that is the fruit of our lips giving thanks unto his name.
One thought, we'll have the scriptures with us throughout eternity and the standard of holiness and righteousness would be like the Lord infinite, and thankfully, we'll have plenty of time to learn.
Jn 17:3 KJV "And this is eternal life, that we may know him, the only true God and his Son Jesus Christ whom he has sent."
Click to expand...

The inspired scriptures are for the purpose of instructing God's born again children how he wants them to live their lives, as they sojourn here on earth. There will be no purpose for them to be in heaven. There will be singing in heaven, but there will not be any preaching, or praying.
 
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