Is the earth really 6000 years old?

[Webers.Home]

.
There are two primary kinds of Days in the first chapter of Genesis. One is a
creation day and the other is a natural day. It's very important to keep those
two kinds of days distinct and separate in our thinking because they are as
unalike as sand and gravel.

Creation days are a bit problematic because there were no sunrises or
sunsets to be seen on Earth till the fourth day. And-- when you think about
it --a strict chronology of evening and morning defines neither a natural day
nor a calendar day, rather, it defines overnight; viz: darkness (Lev 24:2-4).
In order to obtain a full 24-hour day, we'd have to define creation's Days as
a day and a night rather than an evening and a morning.

In other words: the evenings and mornings relative to creation days aren't
solar events. The terms are merely index flags indicating the beginnings and
ends of unspecified periods.

Well; the first chapter defines Day as a time of light rather than a 24-hour
amalgam of light and dark; plus there was no Sun to cause physical
evenings and mornings till creation's fourth Day so we have to come at this
issue from another angle apart from physical properties.

According to Gen 1:24-31, God created humans and all terra critters on the
sixth Day; which has to include prehistoric creatures because on no other
Day did God create beasts but the sixth.

However; the sciences of geology and paleontology, in combination with
radiometric dating, strongly suggest that dinosaurs preceded humans by
several million years. So then, in my estimation, the Days of creation should
be taken to represent eras rather than 24-hour events. That's not an
unreasonable estimation; for example:

"These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were
created, in the day that the Lord God made earth and heaven." (Gen 2:4)

The Hebrew word for "day" in that verse is yowm (yome) which is the very
same word for each of the six Days of God's creation labors. Since yowm in
Gen 2:4 refers to a period of time obviously much longer than a 24-hour
calendar day; it defends the suggestion that each of the six Days of creation
were longer than 24 hours apiece too. In other words: yowm is ambiguous
and not all that easy to interpret sometimes.

Anyway; this "day" thing has been a stone in the shoe for just about
everybody who takes Genesis seriously. It's typically assumed that the Days
of creation consisted of twenty-four hours apiece; so Bible students end up
stumped when trying to figure out how to cope with the 4.5 billion-year age
of the earth, and factor in the various eras, e.g. Triassic, Jurassic, Mesozoic,
Cenozoic, Cretaceous, etc, plus the ice ages and the mass extinction events.

NOTE: Galileo believed that science and religion are allies rather than
enemies-- two different languages telling the same story. He believed that
science and religion complement each other: science answers questions that
religion doesn't bother to answer, and religion answers questions that
science cannot answer.

For example: theoretical physicist Stephen Hawking understood pretty well
how the cosmos works; but could never scientifically explain why it should
exist at all. Well; in my estimation, the only possible answer to the "why" is
found in intelligent design; which is a religious explanation rather than
scientific. Religion's "why" is satisfactory for most folks. No doubt most
scientists would prefer something a bit more empirical.
_

 

[Truthnightmare]

.
There are two primary kinds of Days in the first chapter of Genesis. One is a
creation day and the other is a natural day. It's very important to keep those
two kinds of days distinct and separate in our thinking because they are as
unalike as sand and gravel.

Creation days are a bit problematic because there were no sunrises or
sunsets to be seen on Earth till the fourth day. And-- when you think about
it --a strict chronology of evening and morning defines neither a natural day
nor a calendar day, rather, it defines overnight; viz: darkness (Lev 24:2-4).
In order to obtain a full 24-hour day, we'd have to define creation's Days as
a day and a night rather than an evening and a morning.

In other words: the evenings and mornings relative to creation days aren't
solar events. The terms are merely index flags indicating the beginnings and
ends of unspecified periods.

Well; the first chapter defines Day as a time of light rather than a 24-hour
amalgam of light and dark; plus there was no Sun to cause physical
evenings and mornings till creation's fourth Day so we have to come at this
issue from another angle apart from physical properties.

According to Gen 1:24-31, God created humans and all terra critters on the
sixth Day; which has to include prehistoric creatures because on no other
Day did God create beasts but the sixth.

However; the sciences of geology and paleontology, in combination with
radiometric dating, strongly suggest that dinosaurs preceded humans by
several million years. So then, in my estimation, the Days of creation should
be taken to represent eras rather than 24-hour events. That's not an
unreasonable estimation; for example:

"These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were
created, in the day that the Lord God made earth and heaven." (Gen 2:4)

The Hebrew word for "day" in that verse is yowm (yome) which is the very
same word for each of the six Days of God's creation labors. Since yowm in
Gen 2:4 refers to a period of time obviously much longer than a 24-hour
calendar day; it defends the suggestion that each of the six Days of creation
were longer than 24 hours apiece too. In other words: yowm is ambiguous
and not all that easy to interpret sometimes.

Anyway; this "day" thing has been a stone in the shoe for just about
everybody who takes Genesis seriously. It's typically assumed that the Days
of creation consisted of twenty-four hours apiece; so Bible students end up
stumped when trying to figure out how to cope with the 4.5 billion-year age
of the earth, and factor in the various eras, e.g. Triassic, Jurassic, Mesozoic,
Cenozoic, Cretaceous, etc, plus the ice ages and the mass extinction events.

NOTE: Galileo believed that science and religion are allies rather than
enemies-- two different languages telling the same story. He believed that
science and religion complement each other: science answers questions that
religion doesn't bother to answer, and religion answers questions that
science cannot answer.

For example: theoretical physicist Stephen Hawking understood pretty well
how the cosmos works; but could never scientifically explain why it should
exist at all. Well; in my estimation, the only possible answer to the "why" is
found in intelligent design; which is a religious explanation rather than
scientific. Religion's "why" is satisfactory for most folks. No doubt most
scientists would prefer something a bit more empirical.
_

Cool post!
And I’m no Stephen Hawkins, but Mr. Hawkins didn’t believe in a God.

Psalms 14:1
The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.
- So at this point we must be very careful of what he says, not knowing if he is looking for an answer, or he is just a fool trying to disprove God.

But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are.

I think God gets a kick out of making those that don’t believe in Him look foolish.

Anyhow, I follow this pattern.
The Father the Son and the Holy Spirt- a Trinity

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
Beginning = Time
Heavens = Space
Earth = Matter
Now we have a trinity of trinity’s.

Moreover;
Time = past present future
Space = length width height
Matter = solid liquid gas

Yet another trinity within…

All these must come to together at the
same instance. If you have matter with no space, where would you put it, if you have space and matter without time, when would you put it? Etc.

If the earth being matter is 6,000 years old, then we would have to believe time is 6,000 years old, and space is 6,000 years old.

 

[Dino246]

There are two primary kinds of Days in the first chapter of Genesis. One is a creation day and the other is a natural day. It's very important to keep those two kinds of days distinct and separate in our thinking because they are as unalike as sand and gravel.

You make assertions with no evidence... because there is no evidence.

Creation days are a bit problematic because there were no sunrises or
sunsets to be seen on Earth till the fourth day.

"Sun" set and "sun" rise, no, but there was light, and that's all that is needed for there to be evening and morning. So again, you have no case.

And-- when you think about it --a strict chronology of evening and morning defines neither a natural day nor a calendar day, rather, it defines overnight;

Only if you impose a modern understanding of the terms, and fail to exegete the original terms correctly.

In other words: the evenings and mornings relative to creation days aren't solar events. The terms are merely index flags indicating the beginnings and ends of unspecified periods.

Unwarranted assumption.

However; the sciences of geology and paleontology, in combination with radiometric dating, strongly suggest that dinosaurs preceded humans by several million years.

You've apparently adopted the very biased view of radiometric dating that ignores the massive assumptions inherent in the claims of 'millions of years'.

God tells us in Exodus 20:11 that He made the heavens and the earth, and all that is in them, in six days. There is no room for 'millions of years' in there... anywhere.

 

[Webers.Home]

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● Gen 1:9 . . And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered
together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.

At this point, the Earth's surface likely resembled the texture of a billiard ball
so it would remain entirely flooded were it not reshaped.

"He set the earth on its foundations, so that it should never be moved. You
covered it with the deep as with a garment; the waters stood above the
mountains. At your rebuke they fled; at the sound of your thunder they took
to flight. The mountains rose, the valleys sank down to the place that you
appointed for them. You set a boundary that they may not pass, so that they
might not again cover the earth." (Ps 104:5-9)

That passage is stunning; and clearly way ahead of its time. Mountains
rising, and valleys sinking speaks of magma pressure and tectonic plate
subduction-- powerful forces of nature that keep the Earth's surface in a
perpetual state of alteration.

Now, it's right about there that young-earth theorists have a problem
because it's obvious from physical evidence that much of the Earth's higher
elevations were inundated for a very long time before they were pushed up
to where they are now.

Take for example Mount Everest. Today its tippy top is something like
29,029 feet above sea level. The discovery of fossilized sea lilies near its
summit proves that the Himalayan land mass has not always been
mountainous; but at one time was the floor of an ancient sea bed. This is
confirmed by the "yellow band" below Everest's summit consisting of
limestone: a type of rock made from calcite sediments containing the
skeletal remains of countless trillions of organisms who lived, not on dry
land, rather, underwater in an ocean.

NOTE: Noah's flood lasted scarcely one year from start to finish; which isn't
anywhere near enough time for the yellow band's limestone deposit to
accumulate.
_

 

[Truthnightmare]

.
● Gen 1:9 . . And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered
together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.

At this point, the Earth's surface likely resembled the texture of a billiard ball
so it would remain entirely flooded were it not reshaped.

"He set the earth on its foundations, so that it should never be moved. You
covered it with the deep as with a garment; the waters stood above the
mountains. At your rebuke they fled; at the sound of your thunder they took
to flight. The mountains rose, the valleys sank down to the place that you
appointed for them. You set a boundary that they may not pass, so that they
might not again cover the earth." (Ps 104:5-9)

That passage is stunning; and clearly way ahead of its time. Mountains
rising, and valleys sinking speaks of magma pressure and tectonic plate
subduction-- powerful forces of nature that keep the Earth's surface in a
perpetual state of alteration.

Now, it's right about there that young-earth theorists have a problem
because it's obvious from physical evidence that much of the Earth's higher
elevations were inundated for a very long time before they were pushed up
to where they are now.

Take for example Mount Everest. Today its tippy top is something like
29,029 feet above sea level. The discovery of fossilized sea lilies near its
summit proves that the Himalayan land mass has not always been
mountainous; but at one time was the floor of an ancient sea bed. This is
confirmed by the "yellow band" below Everest's summit consisting of
limestone: a type of rock made from calcite sediments containing the
skeletal remains of countless trillions of organisms who lived, not on dry
land, rather, underwater in an ocean.

NOTE: Noah's flood lasted scarcely one year from start to finish; which isn't
anywhere near enough time for the yellow band's limestone deposit to
accumulate.
_

I believe Jeremiah 4 points at many things you have mentioned.

 

[Dino246]

... This is confirmed by the "yellow band" below Everest's summit consisting of limestone: a type of rock made from calcite sediments containing the skeletal remains of countless trillions of organisms who lived, not on dry land, rather, underwater in an ocean.

NOTE: Noah's flood lasted scarcely one year from start to finish; which isn't anywhere near enough time for the yellow band's limestone deposit to accumulate.

It doesn't need to be. There were about 1500 years between the creation and the flood. The pre-flood sea bed could be what is now at the top of Everest.

 

[Webers.Home]

.
● Gen 1:16-17 . . God made . . . the stars. And God set them in the expanse
of the sky to shine upon the Earth

Early-on in biblical history, "stars" no doubt indicated all luminous objects in
the heavens, seeing as how it would be a very long time before humanity
began categorizing some of them as planets.

I think it's important to emphasize that in the beginning God "set" the stars
in the sky just as he set the Sun and the Moon in the sky, i.e. celestial
objects didn't arrange themselves all by themselves sans any intelligent
supervision whatsoever; no, they were placed; and not only were they set in
place, but also set in motion-- nothing in the entire cosmos is standing still,
though many things appear to be.

Anyway; the only stars whose shine is of any practical use as illumination
are those of our home galaxy: the Milky Way; which is estimated 100,000 to
180,000 light years in diameter. Obviously then; if left entirely up to nature,
light from stars nearest our location in the galaxy would begin dousing the
earth with illumination long before those at the far side.

For example, light from Alpha Centauri takes only about 4½ years to reach
Earth while light from Alpha Orionis (a.k.a. Betelgeuse) takes about 640.
There are quite a few stars whose illumination reaches Earth in less than 50
years. But whether 4½ years, 50 years, 640 years, or 180,000 years; the
time involved is insignificant if we but allow that the days of creation were
eras rather than 24-hour events.

BTW: God has actually counted all the stars above, and given them names
too (Ps 147:4)
_

 

[Dino246]

For example, light from Alpha Centauri takes only about 4½ years to reach Earth while light from Alpha Orionis (a.k.a. Betelgeuse) takes about 640.
There are quite a few stars whose illumination reaches Earth in less than 50
years. But whether 4½ years, 50 years, 640 years, or 180,000 years; the time involved is insignificant if we but allow that the days of creation were eras rather than 24-hour events.

The apparent speed of light is believed to be constant, but it is still subject to God. He says the stars were created on the fourth day, and He says everything was created in six days.

I’m quite confident that if God created in six “eras”, several passages of Scripture would be different.

Maybe you should take Scripture at face value instead of taking science at face value and force-fitting Scripture to it.

 

[Webers.Home]

.
● Gen 1:11a . . Then God said: Let the land produce vegetation

The Earth's land masses at that point were likely solid rock; which would
require some changes to their characteristics in order to sustain a wide variety
of flora.

Soil formation is a very slow process, sometimes taking as long as a
millennium to make just one inch; which at first in the Earth's early history
would consist of little more than powders produced by eroding rock. In order
for soil to become really productive, it needs organic material mixed with it.
So it's my guess that the very first vegetation that God created were species
that thrive on stone, and little by little their remains helped amend rock dust
to increase its fertility.

Some of the lyrics of one of AC/DC's songs says: "It's a long way to the top
if you wanna rock 'n roll." Well, it was an even longer ways to the soil from
which the Earth's critters were eventually brought into existence.

There are folks who sincerely believe the Earth was created in an aged
condition. But you know; its creator is an eternal being, viz: I seriously
doubt God has ever been pressured to get things done quickly due to time
constraints. (cf. 2Pet 3:8)

* It's sometimes assumed that our cosmos was the only project that God
had going at the time. But I kind of suspect that an energetic genius of His
caliber has kept Himself busy with lots of projects throughout eternity--
quite possibly many of them at the same time as ours about which we are
totally unaware. In other words: it isn't unreasonable to posit that while
waiting for nature to take the courses God designed for it to take in our
cosmos, He was off somewhere supervising other things requiring His
attention and picked up where He left off with our world when the time was
ripe. Which suggests another possibility,

It's commonly assumed that the days of creation were consecutive with no
time elapsed between the end of a previous day and the beginning of a next.
Well; I'm not so sure about that.

Take for example the Bible's genealogies. Some have very large gaps in
them-- omitting insignificant male siblings and typically all the girls. In one
instance (1Chron 1:1) the record skips Abel and jumps directly to Seth.

Taking advantage of this rather strange Bible practice; critics are quick to
point out gaps in Christ's genealogy with the intent of invalidating the entire
New Testament. But gaps are to be expected or otherwise the lists would be
cumbersome and require a book all their own.

For example; a sizeable quantity of time passed between Noah's ark and the
arrival of Abraham. We're talking about a lot of generations there, and
naming them all to a man would be impractical.
_

 

[Dino246]

.
● Gen 1:11a . . Then God said: Let the land produce vegetation

The Earth's land masses at that point were likely solid rock; which would
require some changes to their characteristics in order to sustain a wide variety
of flora.

Soil formation is a very slow process, sometimes taking as long as a
millennium to make just one inch; which at first in the Earth's early history
would consist of little more than powders produced by eroding rock. In order
for soil to become really productive, it needs organic material mixed with it.
So it's my guess that the very first vegetation that God created were species
that thrive on stone, and little by little their remains helped amend rock dust
to increase its fertility.

Some of the lyrics of one of AC/DC's songs says: "It's a long way to the top
if you wanna rock 'n roll." Well, it was an even longer ways to the soil from
which the Earth's critters were eventually brought into existence.

There are folks who sincerely believe the Earth was created in an aged
condition. But you know; its creator is an eternal being, viz: I seriously
doubt God has ever been pressured to get things done quickly due to time
constraints. (cf. 2Pet 3:8)

* It's sometimes assumed that our cosmos was the only project that God
had going at the time. But I kind of suspect that an energetic genius of His
caliber has kept Himself busy with lots of projects throughout eternity--
quite possibly many of them at the same time as ours about which we are
totally unaware. In other words: it isn't unreasonable to posit that while
waiting for nature to take the courses God designed for it to take in our
cosmos, He was off somewhere supervising other things requiring His
attention and picked up where He left off with our world when the time was
ripe. Which suggests another possibility,

It's commonly assumed that the days of creation were consecutive with no
time elapsed between the end of a previous day and the beginning of a next.
Well; I'm not so sure about that.

Take for example the Bible's genealogies. Some have very large gaps in
them-- omitting insignificant male siblings and typically all the girls. In one
instance (1Chron 1:1) the record skips Abel and jumps directly to Seth.

Taking advantage of this rather strange Bible practice; critics are quick to
point out gaps in Christ's genealogy with the intent of invalidating the entire
New Testament. But gaps are to be expected or otherwise the lists would be
cumbersome and require a book all their own.

For example; a sizeable quantity of time passed between Noah's ark and the
arrival of Abraham. We're talking about a lot of generations there, and
naming them all to a man would be impractical.
_

One unwarranted assumption after another.

 

[oyster67]

If the earth is 6,000 years old, wouldn’t that by default make time 6,000 years old.

Pretty close, as long as we understand that God transcends time.

The bible never said the earth was 6000 years old.

The Bible is an accurate record of the generations of man. Much more accurate than men's dating techniques.

(probably shouldn't have used the D-word around @JohnB )

 

[Blade]

If we live in a holographic universe (as I think we do), how do you measure time and distance in a hologram? Is everything just an illusion? The bible seems to say we are not living in the real world. What do you think?

I know the way they "date" things is never fact. It can be 6000 or man is 6000 and the world and the universe is much much older. My dad haha not a believer at the time had this rock pig skull solid rock. They say it was millions of years old. So my dad would show the neighbors behind us (they were SDA) to just get them going haha

I remember this preacher just talking said the universe is not finished for God focused on the earth. What do I know lol.

 

[Webers.Home]

.
● Gen 6:14 . . Make for yourself an ark of gopher wood; you shall make the
ark with rooms, and shall cover it inside and out with pitch.

The Hebrew word translated "pitch" in his case basically pertains to bitumen;
a naturally-occurring kind of asphalt formed from the remains of ancient,
microscopic algae (diatoms) and other once-living things.

In order for bitumen to be available in Noah's day, the organisms from
whence it was formed had to have existed on the Earth several thousands of
years before him. In point of fact, I read somewhere that the biomass that
gave us fossil fuels existed even before the dinosaurs. That's really going
back a ways. However, it does fit the narrative because vegetation was created
prior to the creation of animals on land.
_

 

[Dino246]

.
● Gen 6:14 . . Make for yourself an ark of gopher wood; you shall make the
ark with rooms, and shall cover it inside and out with pitch.

The Hebrew word translated "pitch" in his case basically pertains to bitumen;
a naturally-occurring kind of asphalt formed from the remains of ancient,
microscopic algae (diatoms) and other once-living things.

In order for bitumen to be available in Noah's day, the organisms from
whence it was formed had to have existed on the Earth several thousands of
years before him. In point of fact, I read somewhere that the biomass that
gave us fossil fuels existed even before the dinosaurs. That's really going
back a ways. However, it does fit the narrative because vegetation was created
prior to the creation of animals on land.
_

Again, this is an assumption. It is perfectly possible that the ‘pitch’ used was simply tree sap prepared for the purpose, possibly by boiling.

 

[Truthnightmare]

Pretty close, as long as we understand that God transcends time.


The Bible is an accurate record of the generations of man. Much more accurate than men's dating techniques.

(probably shouldn't have used the D-word around @JohnB )

In the beginning God created the heavens and earth. No time given.

 

[Bob-Carabbio]

If we live in a holographic universe (as I think we do), how do you measure time and distance in a hologram? Is everything just an illusion? The bible seems to say we are not living in the real world. What do you think?

I'm a "Gap theoryist" (OEC), so I have NO IDEA who old the earth is, or how many creations have already taken place on it. WHat is pretty certain is that THIS Creation is about 6000 years old (give or take).

The MORE REAL WORLD, of course, is the SPIRITUAL WORLD, which we'll experience when physical life ends.

 

[Truthnightmare]

I'm a "Gap theoryist" (OEC), so I have NO IDEA who old the earth is, or how many creations have already taken place on it. WHat is pretty certain is that THIS Creation is about 6000 years old (give or take).

The MORE REAL WORLD, of course, is the SPIRITUAL WORLD, which we'll experience when physical life ends.

Greetings,
The creation of what is 6,000 years?

 

[ewq1938]

I'm a "Gap theoryist" (OEC), so I have NO IDEA who old the earth is, or how many creations have already taken place on it. WHat is pretty certain is that THIS Creation is about 6000 years old (give or take).

Some claim it's been 6000 years since Adam, I am not saying I agree with that. If the Earth was created on the first day in Gen 1, then that would add several more days usually counted as a thousand years for each day, so it would be more than just 6000 years. Again, not saying I agree. I believe in an Old Earth with a new earth age starting on the first day.

 

[Bob-Carabbio]

Greetings,
The creation of what is 6,000 years?

The "Adamic creation" which kicked off the creation that we all live in now.

 

[Truthnightmare]

The "Adamic creation" which kicked off the creation that we all live in now.

I don’t believe Adam kicked off the creation, but thats not in the here and now…

I see a very old earth millions of years old, or at least that’s what I’m getting from scripture.