Prenuptial agreement?

[JohnDB]

We've had lots of discussions about prenups here over the years.

But I also think that some of the reasons behind prenups has somewhat changed, or at least there is a lot more to know about them than just what most people think.

I know most Christians think of prenups as an easy way to get out of a marriage, with visions of taking the money and running off with a younger or richer significant other on exotic vacations and living in a fancy McMansion.

But I'm at an age where pretty much everyone in my peer group is marrying into a blended family with an absolute myriad of things to consider.

For example, I've read about prenups in which, a widowed woman has an adult son who needs lifetime care, and part of the prenup includes a clause in which part of her funds are to remain set and used solely for her son's needs, no matter what happened.

I understand that it's God's perfect plan for marriages to stay together, but in a broken world, nothing is black and white. Saying, "Well if people just follow God's rules for marriage" is like saying we don't have any need for prisons or police because we can somehow just tell people to listen to God and everything will be alright. Even the best of Christians have fallen.

All I can work from is my own observations and I've seen Christian marriages break up for so many reasons people never anticipated when they first got married: affairs -- including online and even sites like the one we're all reading; one person getting sick (cancer, Alzheimer's, etc.) and the other person left because they were still healthy and didn't want to be a caretaker; a couple who got married, found out she was infertile after the marriage, and so the husband left for another woman because he wanted his own family; couples who have lost children due to miscarriage, accidents, or sickness, saw that loss every time they looked at their spouse, and wanted a "fresh start, without the reminders" -- with someone else.

I'm not saying any of these reasons are Biblical grounds for divorce -- I'm just saying, they happen.

And I think whether or not someone decides to get a prenup is really up to the couple, their pastor, potentially a lawyer, and God, very much depending on their own unique situation.

People lie...people use the same words but the meanings behind those words have a vastly different meaning depending upon who is saying them.

To some love is an emotion or feeling but to others it's a choice. Which is right?

Well a prenuptial agreement can spell out that. Especially if there's a "the person who files for divorce automatically loses" clause in the prenuptial agreement.

Prenuptial agreements can include ANYTHING from Superbowl Sunday to attendance at flute recitals.

It can be as big as an encyclopedia set or as simple as a single page document.

But the important thing is that it protects people...which is also what the whole Torah Law was all about to begin with. (Besides loving God) It can't protect your feelings...it never could mend a broken heart either. But it's insurance against a broken heart. It's insurance against injury on top of insult.

But...always reject the first offer....make them redo/edit it at least twice.

 

[Tall_Timbers]

If you're young and feel you need a pre-nup, maybe you should remain single or look for someone with whom you wouldn't feel like you need a pre-nup. Marriage today is definitely a big gamble since divorce has been made so easy. If you're on the other side of life and have already raised a family, and say your first spouse has passed on, and you want to give your assets to your children, then a pre-nup seems like a good idea and the person you're marrying, if they're worth marrying, would understand that.

 

[Lanolin]

Job contracts are a bit like pre-nups and they are can be very one sided in favour of the employer. Most jobs you have to sign a 16 page contract before you start, and you simply have to start work for them in good faith that they will pay you.

If it doesnt work out, you can go to the contract and say well this is what you pay me in compensation shoud, the job end.

I imagine its the same kind of thing for marriages that are like contracts. Not signed in blood, but close enough. Also a bloodied bed sheet and children are often not enough evidence if it hasnt been written down on paper and signed. Wives have to take the husbands surname, but I am not sure what happens if it dont work out, if its agreed beforehand what will happen, then maybe there is less legal complications and you dont have to go to divorce court and pay huge settlement fees.

most just leave, run away, but you cant easily leave children behind. Though apparently some people can.

 

[Lanolin]

If you are getting married you may need to make a Will anyway esp of you have children what will happen if one or both of you dies.

 

[presidente]

Is it wrong to want a pre-nuptial agreement

If I were single and marrying a never-married person with no kids, I would consider asking to a prenuptial to be an insult to my character, kind of like demanding an AIDS test of a virgin.

I can think of situations where the heir of some rich family requires children to get prenups to get the inheritance, where there could be an external influence. I have never heard of that happening. It sounds like a plot in a movie.

But let's say a widow and a widower are marrying and they have grown children. If one of them dies, their estate goes to the other. In this case, before marriage, they could agree how their resources will be split up among their heirs before marriage, in the form of a pre-nuptial agreement.

Many believers want to leave an inheritance to their children based on Proverbs 13:22
A good man leaveth an inheritance to his children's children: And the wealth of the sinner is laid up for the just.

 

[presidente]

And I think whether or not someone decides to get a prenup is really up to the couple, their pastor, potentially a lawyer, and God, very much depending on their own unique situation.

The idea of consulting a pastor before getting a prenup hadn't crossed my mind. But it is probably a good idea. If it's two singles and the well-to-do guy wants a pre-nup, the pastor may be an extra person to spot the red flag.

For me personally, if I didn't have enough trust in a woman to where I didn't need a pre-nup, I don't think I'd trust her enough to marry her. The exception would be complicated cases, like when there are children and inheritance issues. There are moral and ethical reasons to leave something to your children, but the state marriage laws interfere with that, so a pre-nup gets around that.

 

[presidente]

IMO, the one seeking the prenup should mention it before a marriage proposal. It would be awful to get engaged and then have some evil fiancee say I'm not marrying you unless you sign a prenup.

 

[Lanolin]

a lot of people do NOT leave inheritances for their children cos they dont even want children.

If they do have children most are expected to become independent and pay their own way not stay and look after their parents, though this is what any good filial child would do to requite thir parent should they become widowed.

What happens in event of divorce is that, depending on how many children you have, they may have to choose between one parent or the other which is a HUGE choice for a child to make.

 

[Lanolin]

Why not just make a will

why call it something else? Makes no sense.

 

[JohnDB]

Why not just make a will

why call it something else? Makes no sense.

Because you women would never wash a single dish in the house once you got married....you women obviously would believe your entire role was to eat bon bons and read books or watch television.

Meanwhile expecting the husband to earn a paycheck and do all the household chores. That's the reason for a prenuptial agreement....
So that later when you women decide to "trade up" you can't claim alimony.

 

[Lanolin]

Because you women would never wash a single dish in the house once you got married....you women obviously would believe your entire role was to eat bon bons and read books or watch television.

Meanwhile expecting the husband to earn a paycheck and do all the household chores. That's the reason for a prenuptial agreement....
So that later when you women decide to "trade up" you can't claim alimony.

huh?

uh ok..here comes out the angry wife hater

 

[Lanolin]

are you having problems in your marriage johnDB?

 

[JohnDB]

are you having problems in your marriage johnDB?

No....
Just wanted to get a rise out of you with a touch of realism.

A prenuptial agreement is a way for prospective husband and wife to discuss responsibilities and duties that will happen after the ceremony and real life settles in. It doesn't have to discuss money or assets and it doesn't have to be notarized or even drawn up by a lawyer.

It's just an agreement.

It can be whatever the couple feel they need. If he expects 20 kids from her and she was thinking one and two in an extreme emergency, that can be discussed in a prenuptial agreement....

 

[Lynx]

Because you women would never wash a single dish in the house once you got married....you women obviously would believe your entire role was to eat bon bons and read books or watch television.

Meanwhile expecting the husband to earn a paycheck and do all the household chores. That's the reason for a prenuptial agreement....
So that later when you women decide to "trade up" you can't claim alimony.

Hmm... Is a prenup the only thing keeping your wife in line? Do you think she would trade up if not for that prenup?

Also, bonbons and TV is outdated. Today it is snack cakes, facebook and tiktok. Snack cakes, snapchat and tiktok for the younger ones.

 

[presidente]

a lot of people do NOT leave inheritances for their children cos they dont even want children.

So are you saying people who have children but don't want them may not leave the children money?

 

[Lanolin]

So are you saying people who have children but don't want them may not leave the children money?

well that happens
be realistic

Do you live in the real world? Happens all the time.

 

[Lanolin]

Don't people have pre-marital counselling and talk about such things.

I don't even know why ppl are arguing about something they aren't even gonna do. Excuse my poor Englush

 

[JTB]

More than a prenup, couples should have to spend 2 weeks auditing divorce court before being issued a marriage license.

 

[JohnDB]