Is it a moral or legal obligation to pay a debt to a bank?

[JimmyTheLock]

May also have a future in the Lake that burns with fire and brimstone.

Yep, if one does not humble themselves before the Lord, acknowledging their sin, asking for forgiveness, and forsaking their sin.... then Lake-0-Fire it will be!

If banks could bring back debtor's prison and poor house, you would be for that?

He is a merciful creditor, not keeping the items given as security by poor debtors. He does not rob the poor but instead gives food to the hungry and provides clothes for the needy. Ezekiel 18:7

Obviously you don't get it... you are an excuse maker and not someone who desires to be led by the Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ... Who does NOT lead people to make agreements and then decide to become liars and break them later.

2 Timothy 3:1-5
This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

I can't imagine anybody tootin their horn about how they made an agreement and then decided to not keep their work and quit honoring the agreement... I guess in these modern times some look up to those that are dishonest

What do you say to them?

Psalm 37:25
I have been young, and now am old; yet have I not seen the righteous forsaken, nor his seed begging bread.

It's not God's fault they are in dire straights... they are not living righteously before the Lord, if they were they would not be in such dire straights.

I speak from experience as one that during his younger years backslid and went back to living in unrighteousness and went broke!

Lots of folks don't search the scriptures for the Lord's Wisdom and then walk in that wisdom... He will provide for our needs if we walk with Him and be doers of His Word... and not be lazy on the job! Some even refuse to work at all and cry about being broke!

By the way, you know nothing about me. You never asked how I got into this situation. You just assume people default on debts because they PLANNED to defraud the banks and credit card companies.

But few get on the internet a brag about it as though screwing the banks is some big accomplishment in life.

You're embarrassing yourself!

 

[JohnB]

Yep, if one does not humble themselves before the Lord, acknowledging their sin, asking for forgiveness, and forsaking their sin.... then Lake-0-Fire it will be!





Obviously you don't get it... you are an excuse maker and not someone who desires to be led by the Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ... Who does NOT lead people to make agreements and then decide to become liars and break them later.

2 Timothy 3:1-5
This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

I can't imagine anybody tootin their horn about how they made an agreement and then decided to not keep their work and quit honoring the agreement... I guess in these modern times some look up to those that are dishonest View attachment 258084




Psalm 37:25
I have been young, and now am old; yet have I not seen the righteous forsaken, nor his seed begging bread.

It's not God's fault they are in dire straights... they are not living righteously before the Lord, if they were they would not be in such dire straights.

I speak from experience as one that during his younger years backslid and went back to living in unrighteousness and went broke!

Lots of folks don't search the scriptures for the Lord's Wisdom and then walk in that wisdom... He will provide for our needs if we walk with Him and be doers of His Word... and not be lazy on the job! Some even refuse to work at all and cry about being broke!




But few get on the internet a brag about it as though screwing the banks is some big accomplishment in life.

You're embarrassing yourself!

"Who does NOT lead people to make agreements and then decide to become liars and break them later. ",....where is your compassion for people who face sudden life changing events where they can no longer make the payments? They or a family member gets sick and the bills to care for yourself or them wipe you out.

 

[JimmyTheLock]

where is your compassion for people who face sudden life changing events where they can no longer make the payments? They or a family member gets sick and the bills to care for yourself or them wipe you out.

Too bad they did not know that God's Word has provisions to prevent stuff like this.

I help a lot of folks, but if they are not helping themselves to the Word of God to get themselves out of the mess they have allowed to come in to their lives... I don't continue helping.

That's how it is with the Lord...

Hosea 4:6
My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.

 

[JohnB]

Too bad they did not know that God's Word has provisions to prevent stuff like this.

I help a lot of folks, but if they are not helping themselves to the Word of God to get themselves out of the mess they have allowed to come in to their lives... I don't continue helping.

That's how it is with the Lord...

Hosea 4:6
My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.

I get food stamps but not much and I don't have a ride or anyone who can take me to the food bank plus because I am legally blind I don't have a choice but rely on others to go to the store for me and I have gotten my bank statements and my rromate who doesn't help finincially at all is using my money and food stamps I couldn't even get groceries this month because she used it all on herself people know I am meek that I have memory isses that I am always willing to help or give even if it hurts me and they ise it all my my life people have done this they have no remorse no guilt and see me as a someone to use for themselves.

But because of my health and my limitations I have no choice but to rely on others and clearly I cannot trust them I am used taken advantage of and honestly I cannot comprehend how anyone can do that to someone with no remorse no guilt whatso ever.

People seem to see kindness as a weakness to exploite and yet I do what I can for people regardless it is just my nature but I cannot afford to live anywhere else I cannot walk to the store or get a ride to my doctor appointments my roomate uses my money with no remorse but I don't know what I can do about it.

But even so instead of letting it affect me I dive deeper into God's grace his promises I believe things will eventually get much better even though I have no reason to do so.

This is the point I am trying to make

Why do you have a roommate who's not helping? Reach out to local churches, call the food banks, tell them your situation and see if anyone will deliver. Go to government online sites that offer help for the poor. I just found out I can get a rebate for a new water heater, because of my low income.

 

[Blain]

"Who does NOT lead people to make agreements and then decide to become liars and break them later. ",....where is your compassion for people who face sudden life changing events where they can no longer make the payments? They or a family member gets sick and the bills to care for yourself or them wipe you out.

Who is in control money or God? will you accept what money has done to you or as an unstoppible force or will you believe that God is our provider? I told you my situation you have no no idea how many times my health has gotten me to the er because I could afford to eat all the health issues I have gained because of it but look at you and look at me I still believe in him more than money or my situation I have no reason to do so I have almost died seven times this year because of it have you?

I said you needed to become closer to God for a reason you put your life in more power with your finincial situation not that you don't deserve compassion and empathy for it but if all you do is give power to the situation if your mind and heart are that controlled by something as limited and temperary as money verses him
then why do you claim to believe and have faith?

Personally because I have been so poor for so long not being able to eat or afford my medicine I am all the more grateful for every little good thing he gives me. I am begging you let go of all this you will not see any better results as long as you hand over power to money. your in debt? what does Jesus say about about it? your lacking what does jesus say about it? It infuriates me that you have been so misled that these things have had such power over you is he the God of impossible or not do you believe he will redeem you or not can you say that you trust him more than your situation?
The enemy has had to much influence over you money has had to much power in your life do you want to be free from debt? what does the scriptures say about it? what does Jesus say? He is the only one who can save you from this but if you do not give your faith and trust that he can and will and you continue to give power over your situation and something as temperary as money do not expect to get out of it

Are you more effected by your situation or you trust and faith in him?

 

[RebekahGuzman]

Personally, I believe in honoring commitments, whether legal or moral.

 

[ByTheGraceOfGod]

Personally, I believe in honoring commitments, whether legal or moral.

A banking institution is not moral.

 

[Cameron143]

A banking institution is not moral.

It's not the bank's morality that should be in view, but yours. Let YOUR yea be yea, and your nay be nay.

 

[JohnB]

It's not the bank's morality that should be in view, but yours. Let YOUR yea be yea, and your nay be nay.

I followed what the l laws allowed me, did nothing illegal.

 

[Cameron143]

I followed what the l laws allowed me, did nothing illegal.

Legally you are fine. Morally...? You didn't break man's law. The question is whether you broke God's law.

 

[ByTheGraceOfGod]

Legally you are fine. Morally...? You didn't break man's law. The question is whether you broke God's law.

I do not break God's law by not allowing banking institutions to steal from me.

 

[JimmyTheLock]

Why do you have a roommate who's not helping? Reach out to local churches, call the food banks, tell them your situation and see if anyone will deliver. Go to government online sites that offer help for the poor. I just found out I can get a rebate for a new water heater, because of my low income.

Christians should be getting their help from the Lord... not relying on godless government who have strings atytached to their hand outs where soon they will cease assistance to true bible believing Christians... but fake christians of course will still get assistance since they support the liberals agenda.

A banking institution is not moral.

Then WHY you down their doing bidness with them???

I followed what the l laws allowed me, did nothing illegal.

Well, we know now not to do any business deals with you... you'll just trash any agreements you sign later and not honor them.

This is what DIS - honorable men do!

So, thanks for the heads up.

 

[JohnB]

Christians should be getting their help from the Lord... not relying on godless government who have strings atytached to their hand outs where soon they will cease assistance to true bible believing Christians... but fake christians of course will still get assistance since they support the liberals agenda.





Then WHY you down their doing bidness with them??? View attachment 258376





Well, we know now not to do any business deals with you... you'll just trash any agreements you sign later and not honor them.

This is what DIS - honorable men do! View attachment 258377

So, thanks for the heads up.

Matthew 25:42-45 English Standard Version 2016 (ESV)For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink, I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not clothe me, sick and in prison and you did not visit me

 

[JohnB]

Legally you are fine. Morally...? You didn't break man's law. The question is whether you broke God's law.

The banks and credit card companies break god's law by charging high interest rates.

The Old Testament "condemns the practice of charging interest on a poor person because a loan should be an act of compassion and taking care of one's neighbor"; it teaches that "making a profit off a loan from a poor person is exploiting that person (Exodus 22:25–27).

 

[Cameron143]

The banks and credit card companies break god's law by charging high interest rates.

The Old Testament "condemns the practice of charging interest on a poor person because a loan should be an act of compassion and taking care of one's neighbor"; it teaches that "making a profit off a loan from a poor person is exploiting that person (Exodus 22:25–27).

Why is it bad when companies follow man's laws, but good when you do it? Banks aren't charging you more than is legally allowed are they?
And why is it only immoral when companies transgress God's law, but okay when you do it? Did the bank fraudulently coerce you into the loan or was it by your choice? Did they violate the terms of the contract?
The very things you find companies at fault for, you also do and excuse. Seems hypocritical to me.

 

[JohnB]

Why is it bad when companies follow man's laws, but good when you do it? Banks aren't charging you more than is legally allowed are they?
And why is it only immoral when companies transgress God's law, but okay when you do it? Did the bank fraudulently coerce you into the loan or was it by your choice? Did they violate the terms of the contract?
The very things you find companies at fault for, you also do and excuse. Seems hypocritical to me.

god does not want the rich making profits off the poor, big difference. Some people go thru loss of job, medical conditions and they are not able to make the payments. If they did they would be homeless. The banks do not show compassion. Is that what you want?

 

[Cameron143]

god does not want the rich making profits off the poor, big difference.

Big excuse. God wants His people to glorify Him. How does you not fulfilling your word glorify God?
Are there times when circumstances can lead us to employ legal means to dispose of debt? Sure. Should we say that it is OK because the business entity we are dealing with is immoral? No.
I don't necessarily believe not fulfilling a legal debt is sinful. But I believe it is always sinful to excuse the debt because the party loaning the money is immoral.

 

[JohnB]

Big excuse. God wants His people to glorify Him. How does you not fulfilling your word glorify God?
Are there times when circumstances can lead us to employ legal means to dispose of debt? Sure. Should we say that it is OK because the business entity we are dealing with is immoral? No.
I don't necessarily believe not fulfilling a legal debt is sinful. But I believe it is always sinful to excuse the debt because the party loaning the money is immoral.

In that case since many CANNOT repay the debt, it's not a sin. They cannot pay what they don't have. maybe these credit card companies shouldn't be handing out credit cards like candy.

 

[Tish]

You should not follow laws that lead you to sin.
You have rights within the moral boundary of Scripture. You may not go beyond it.

“It is better not to make a vow than to make one and not fulfill it.” (Ecc 5:5)

“Let your word be, ‘Yes’ or ‘No’; anything beyond these is of evil.” (Matt 5:36–37)

“However, if you refrain from vowing, it would not be sin in you.” (Deut 23:22)

“Do not be among those who become guarantors for debts.
If you have nothing with which to pay, Why should he take your bed from under you?” (Prov 22:26–27)
​

You are obligated to fulfill your vows, John, no matter how hard it is. You reap what you sow.

 

[Cameron143]

In that case since many CANNOT repay the debt, it's not a sin. They cannot pay what they don't have. maybe these credit card companies shouldn't be handing out credit cards like candy.

I agree. But no one should have taken on a card and used it with the intention of not paying it back. Neither should an excuse be that the company is immoral.