Orthodox Jew answers a few questions

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Status
Not open for further replies.

Aviva

Active member
Dec 3, 2023
192
54
28
27
Canada
The reason why Moses can't enter the promised land is that God wants to lead Israel himself.It's not because Moses did something wrong.Because Moses was Pharaoh's adopted son.People usually acquiesce in this authority.But later became the anointed one is the king of Israel,That's because it heralds the birth of Jesus Christ.

The Gospel of Mark
14:6 And Jesus said, Let her alone; why trouble ye her? she hath wrought a good work on me.
14:7 For ye have the poor with you always, and whensoever ye will ye may do them good: but me ye have not always.
14:8 She hath done what she could: she is come aforehand to anoint my body to the burying.
14:9 Verily I say unto you, Wheresoever this gospel shall be preached throughout the whole world, this also that she hath done shall be spoken of for a memorial of her.
You are incorrect and should read the Torah. The reason Moses was not allowed to enter Israel is because he disobeyed G-D and took credit for his miracle

Numbers 20: https://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/9948/jewish/Chapter-20.htm#lt=primary
Deuteronomy 32: https://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/9996/jewish/Chapter-32.htm#lt=primary.
 

Aviva

Active member
Dec 3, 2023
192
54
28
27
Canada
I showed You that Jesus did not end the Law or command that it had ended. And You can see it was several who later on made claims towards it. So Jesus did not end the Law and He did not promote the worship of other gods nor did He reject the Torah.

Are there other claims about Jesus so I can answer them?
Where did you show Jesus did not end the law? Christians constantly say they aren't under "the old covenant" or whatever, and yet claim Jesus was a Jew and claim some kind of kinship. Did he end it or did he not? If he did, he is not the Messiah, if he didn't then why aren't you all following the Mitzvot?

I imagine She would look at non Jews following Jewish idealism like we see Rahab, Ruth, and others who basically were grafted in.
Ruth and Rahab are Jews.
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
7,159
2,174
113
If he did, he is not the Messiah, if he didn't then why aren't you all following the Mitzvot?
He reconciled the law to man in His death. And in that way He didn't 'end it' but fulfilled it. That is, he paid the debt to the law even while owing no debt to it having lived by it to every jot and tittle.
What provision? a/o surplus? does the law afford any man that can do this? Having never had to bring even the least turtledove to the alter for even the least sin (though I'm assuming it is assumed that He is a liar to claim He is indeed without even one stain of sin so, even if you might think to just humor me an answer)? But, if I understand correctly, it is life he is awarded, and I suppose I am asking more about how one obtains eternal life (is it through Torah?) and if it is possible (though I gather it must be since I believe the Jesus procured it for those that believe in Him) to secure eternal life for another (through the Torah, in your understanding of how the law works)? I mean, what would be the implications involved in living a perfect life, even if you must think in hypothetical terms, and yet receiving the sentence of death as one that broke the law of Moses.
It is a given that I do suppose you must believe that Jesus broke it in the worst way if you believe that He lied about being the Son of God but... if He did not lie, how do you think the law would have 'worked' toward Him?

hopeful that I've been able to adequately formulate my question, :unsure:
 

ThyKingdomComeSoon

Well-known member
Apr 1, 2023
974
596
93
@Aviva Where did you show Jesus did not end the law? Christians constantly say they aren't under "the old covenant" or whatever, and yet claim Jesus was a Jew and claim some kind of kinship. Did he end it or did he not? If he did, he is not the Messiah, if he didn't then why aren't you all following the Mitzvot?

Here is what Jesus said about the law;
Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

The followers of Jesus follow this, mostly the commandments, some think they have to follow none and are under grace which is not What Christ said. Sadly, many have forgotten the words of Jesus and follow other doctrines.

Blessings.
 

ThereRoseaLamb

Well-known member
Jan 17, 2023
4,780
2,068
113
Denial of history is another trait of subversives.
Matthew 27:25 25 "Then answered all the people, and said, His blood be on us, and on our children."
So every Jew since Christ is guilty of deicide? Because that attitude is what lit the fire for the Holocaust. Everyone of us had a hand in the death of Jesus, or did He not die for your sin? Do you not know the old hymn "He was nailed to the cross for me?" smh
 

Aviva

Active member
Dec 3, 2023
192
54
28
27
Canada
He reconciled the law to man in His death. And in that way He didn't 'end it' but fulfilled it. That is, he paid the debt to the law even while owing no debt to it having lived by it to every jot and tittle.
What provision? a/o surplus? does the law afford any man that can do this? Having never had to bring even the least turtledove to the alter for even the least sin (though I'm assuming it is assumed that He is a liar to claim He is indeed without even one stain of sin so, even if you might think to just humor me an answer)? But, if I understand correctly, it is life he is awarded, and I suppose I am asking more about how one obtains eternal life (is it through Torah?) and if it is possible (though I gather it must be since I believe the Jesus procured it for those that believe in Him) to secure eternal life for another (through the Torah, in your understanding of how the law works)? I mean, what would be the implications involved in living a perfect life, even if you must think in hypothetical terms, and yet receiving the sentence of death as one that broke the law of Moses.
It is a given that I do suppose you must believe that Jesus broke it in the worst way if you believe that He lied about being the Son of God but... if He did not lie, how do you think the law would have 'worked' toward Him?

hopeful that I've been able to adequately formulate my question, :unsure:
I can't even quite understand what you're asking.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
36,665
6,725
113
Why has no one made reference to Rabbi Yitzhak Kaduri's prophecy? He was an orthodox Jew. He said that the prophecy should not be opened until 1 year after his death because there is a rule to not speak ill of the dead for one year, he knew that when this prophecy was opened it would be a bombshell to the Jewish community and didn't want them to sin by speaking ill of him.

The prophecy clearly refers to Jesus as the Messiah.

Also, Nathan's NDE saw Rabbi Kaduri in heaven.

 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
Well, I'm not crazy about Israel at the moment so I don't know if that's a good thing.
shalom can I ask what you think of netanyahu

Can I ask also what you think of the destruction of gazza
 

Aviva

Active member
Dec 3, 2023
192
54
28
27
Canada
This is true, you are one fo the very few here who don't and that's admirable. You're also reasonably polite and I haven't seen you engage in outright conspiracy nonsense. However you're also a maga hat which I have real trouble reconciling with anything supposedly Christian.
 

Mem

Senior Member
Sep 23, 2014
7,159
2,174
113
I can't even quite understand what you're asking.
Ok, that is the nature of multifaceted reality, it's hard to convey head on so, I'll try from an approach from another angle. If you are at a position that you do not believe a thing, then you must have come to the conclusion that it is impossible because if you left open the possibility of it you, generally speaking, would say something like, "I don't know" or "I haven't thought about that really, I just try so and so who told me what I should think..." I mean, a lot more people do that than would admit, with all sincerity and respect toward the well-intentioned mentor. However, personally speaking, if someone said, "search that question out for yourself. I have confidence that you will discover the answer," then I would so much more appreciate not only their confidence that the answer can be found, but that it is not only possible for me to find but that he also believes I've been equipped with the ability to find it...

Oh bother, I'm afraid I might be going off into a tangent...

Oh yea, the question...

Is there any scenario would you believe possible that one man could satisfy the sin debt of another, assuming that you currently believe this to be impossible.
 

Aviva

Active member
Dec 3, 2023
192
54
28
27
Canada
Ok, that is the nature of multifaceted reality, it's hard to convey head on so, I'll try from an approach from another angle. If you are at a position that you do not believe a thing, then you must have come to the conclusion that it is impossible because if you left open the possibility of it you, generally speaking, would say something like, "I don't know" or "I haven't thought about that really, I just try so and so who told me what I should think..." I mean, a lot more people do that than would admit, with all sincerity and respect toward the well-intentioned mentor. However, personally speaking, if someone said, "search that question out for yourself. I have confidence that you will discover the answer," then I would so much more appreciate not only their confidence that the answer can be found, but that it is not only possible for me to find but that he also believes I've been equipped with the ability to find it...

Oh bother, I'm afraid I might be going off into a tangent...

Oh yea, the question...

Is there any scenario would you believe possible that one man could satisfy the sin debt of another, assuming that you currently believe this to be impossible.
I'm Jewish and that is my perspective. One would have to provide evidence to convince me of anything that I believe contradicts what I believe to be scripture. If someone comes from a perspective that something cannot be definitively disproven and therefore it must be correct then by that standard ANYTHING can be true.

No person can accept the sins of another. This is stated by G-d unambiguously:

Exodus 32:30 - 35
30 It came to pass on the next day that Moses said to the people: "You have committed a grave sin. And now I will go up to the Lord; perhaps I will obtain atonement for your sin." 31 And Moses returned to the Lord and said: "Please! This people has committed a grave sin. They have made themselves a god of gold. 32 And now, if You forgive their sin But if not, erase me now from Your book, which You have written." 33 And the Lord said to Moses: "Whoever has sinned against Me, him I will erase from My book!" 34 And now go, lead the people to [the place] of which I have spoken to you. Behold My angel will go before you. But on the day I make an accounting [of sins upon them], I will bring their sin to account against them." 35 Then the Lord struck the people with a plague, because they had made the calf that Aaron had made.

Deuteronomy 24:16
Fathers shall not be put to death because of sons, nor shall sons be put to death because of fathers; each man shall be put to death for his own transgression.

Ezekiel 18:20
The soul that sins, it shall die; a son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, and a father shall not bear the iniquity of the son; the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself.

Jeremiah 31:28 - 29
28 In those days, they shall no longer say, "Fathers have eaten unripe grapes, and the teeth of the children shall be set on edge." 29 But each man shall die for his iniquity; whoever eats the unripe grapes- his teeth shall be set on edge.

G-d also calls human sacrifice an abomination:

Deuteronomy 12:30 - 31
30 Beware, lest you be attracted after them, after they are exterminated from before you; and lest you inquire about their gods, saying, "How did these nations serve their gods? And I will do likewise." 31 You shall not do so to the Lord, your God; for every abomination to the Lord which He hates, they did to their gods, for also their sons and their daughters they would burn in fire to their gods.

Jeremiah 19:4 - 5
4 Because they forsook Me and they estranged this place and burnt incense therein to other gods, which they had not known, they, their forefathers, and the kings of Judah, and they filled this place with the blood of innocent people. 5 And they built the high places of Baal to burn their children with fire as burnt offerings to Baal, which I did not command, neither did I speak nor did it enter My mind.

Ezekiel 16:20 - 23
20 Then you took your sons and your daughters that you bore for Me, and you slaughtered them for them to eat. Were your harlotries a trivial matter, 21 That you slaughtered My children and gave them over by passing them over to them? 22 And with all your abominations and your harlotries, you did not remember the days of your youth; when you were naked and bare, and you were downtrodden in your blood. 23 What will be after all your evil? Woe, woe is to you, says the Lord God.
 
Dec 18, 2023
6,402
406
83
Then why did you ask??
I'm to busy to search through to many posts to find an answer,

You dont have to if you don't want to answer.

Like I said forget it I've obviously asked the wrong person
 

Aviva

Active member
Dec 3, 2023
192
54
28
27
Canada
I'm to busy to search through to many posts to find an answer,

You dont have to if you don't want to answer.

Like I said forget it I've obviously asked the wrong person
You're too busy to do a two second search, but not too busy to shoot the breeze on an internet forum? Sure.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.