MYSTERY, BABYLON

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zone said:
WHAT?
WHY?
i have been against pretrib for 8 years.
and trying to defeat dispensationalism too (futurism)

Daniel 9 is fulfilled.

i love you EG
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pretrib is only one aspect of premillenialism. You forgot mid trib and post trib.

post trib teaches jesus returns at the end of the tribulation. raptures us. then we christ sets up his 1000 year kingdom.

thats what I mean when I say just because one person teaches somethign that might not be trur, that all people who believe in the doctrin which supoorts it are not true. or the doctrine is not true.
 
anyway, I have to go. My mens bible study should be here soon. Ironically we are studying through the OT.been doing it for about 4 months now. Ironically, we are coming up on mount sinai and the law..lol I almost regret it after these past two days lol
 
eternally-gratefull said:


This is why I started to study this whole thing. People started talking and convincing me this was not true. So I stopped listenign to people. and spent almost ten years really studying. And found out much of what I was taught as a kid was either error. or half truths.
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yeah its the half truths that sucker you in and are the hardest to decipher and tear down.

we only see in part and I do not seek to know all there is to know about the world but to do what it is that God would have me do in this life. sometimes it is better not to know one's future but concentrate on one's present.

If you were Paul and knew that you would be cruxified upside down in Rome, would you still be able to go and preach and be joyful in the Lord?
 
eternally-gratefull said:
thats what I mean when I say just because one person teaches somethign that might not be trur, that all people who believe in the doctrin which supoorts it are not true. or the doctrine is not true.
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eternally-gratefull said:
pretrib is only one aspect of premillenialism. You forgot mid trib and post trib.

post trib teaches jesus returns at the end of the tribulation. raptures us. then we christ sets up his 1000 year kingdom.

thats what I mean when I say just because one person teaches somethign that might not be trur, that all people who believe in the doctrin which supoorts it are not true. or the doctrine is not true.
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premillennialism is false tho.
 
AnandaHya said:
yeah its the half truths that sucker you in and are the hardest to decipher and tear down.

we only see in part and I do not seek to know all there is to know about the world but to do what it is that God would have me do in this life. sometimes it is better not to know one's future but concentrate on one's present.

If you were Paul and knew that you would be cruxified upside down in Rome, would you still be able to go and preach and be joyful in the Lord?
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that was Peter.
we are not called to not know.
 
zone said:
WHAT?
WHY?
i have been against pretrib for 8 years.
and trying to defeat dispensationalism too (futurism)
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So you like trying to fight God's Word/plan?

You've got to understand the administrations (dispensations) or you won't understand scripture.
 
zone said:
that was Peter.
we are not called to not know.
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sorry name mixed up...

we are not called to be omniscient either...God sometimes only lights one step at a time, one day at a time. sometimes there are things God says, you don't need to know my grace is sufficient.
 
AnandaHya said:
sorry name mixed up...

we are not called to be omniscient either...God sometimes only lights one step at a time, one day at a time. sometimes there are things God says, you don't need to know my grace is sufficient.
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TRUE.
nobody is talking about omniscience.
only what God has revealed in His Word (which is alot) and what we can observe through general revelation (which is a lot).
 
shroom2 said:
So you like trying to fight God's Word/plan?

You've got to understand the administrations (dispensations) or you won't understand scripture.
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mkay.
if it makes you happy carry on:)

(dispensational theology and pretrib are not in God's word or plan).
 
Strangelove said:
Scripture says Jerusalem is responsible for ALL the righteous blood of the saints and the prophets.

But Rome is such a great DECOY aint she?
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But if you really think about it, Catholicism is a counterfeit of Christianity. Any Catholic will tell you they are Christian. The devil is anti christian, so the best way to get back at God is to lead people into what they think is Christianity - Pagan sun worship (from babylon) in the guise of "Christianity"

Satan is smart, as he wants to conceal his plans, but to those reading the bible we can be sure that all is revealed and Rome is mentioned as the last Kingdom on earth that will fall. The Pope is even taking on the role of one of the beasts already, as he is leading this ecumenical movement into this New World order, teaming with the government.

As for the blood of the saints - The pope was involved with Hitler. More innocent lives lost at the hands of the catholic church!
 
zone said:
it says Rome is the last kingdom PERIOD.

but that the 10 toes of iron are mixed with clay.

this is the Caesars and the Herods.

but there is another Kingdom in the eschaton (Rev 17): it is the last kingdom smashed by the Stone cut without hands (iron & caly) REVIVED.

Rome & Jerusalem.
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Daniel told Nebuchadnezzar about the fourth and last earthly kingdom, "And the fourth kingdom shall be strong as iron: forasmuch as iron breaketh in pieces and subdueth all things: and as iron that breaketh all these, shall it break in pieces and bruise." (Daniel 2:40). "And whereas thou sawest the feet and toes, part of potters’ clay and part of iron, the kingdom shall be divided; but there shall be in it of the strength of the iron, forasmuch as thou sawest the iron mixed with miry clay. And as the toes of the feet were part of iron, and part of clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong, and partly broken. . . . but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay." (Daniel 2:41- 43).
Daniel told the King that the fourth world empire, Rome, would be divided as represented by the ten toes of the image. Some of the resulting nations would be strong and some would be weak. This has been fulfilled as the nations of Europe are the successors to the Roman Empire.


Through the years since the fall of the Roman Empire there has been an ongoing effort to bring about a united Europe and another world empire. History records show that every attempt has failed. Just as Daniel predicted, "but they shall not cleave one to another." (Daniel 2:43). Daniel was revealing to the King and also to us, "What shall be in the latter days." (Daniel 2:28).

The new attempt to bring about a New World Order is another effort to form a one-world government. All the attempts that have been made to bring about another world empire have failed, and it has been at great loss of human lives. The reason that they all have been, and will continue to be unsuccessful is because they are not listening to the God of heaven. He told Daniel that there would not be another world empire after Rome.

There is more Bible prophecy that tells us we are about to see the world unite under the influence of the papacy. We will be told that in the name of world peace, all nations need to succumb to the Vatican’s vision of the New World Order. (Ecumenical movement is uniting religions as one and the Pope is working with the US Government in this goal of New World Order)[FONT=Times New Roman, Times]
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eternally-gratefull said:
This ain't even right. If you want to mock, thats fine, but at least get it right.

jesus does not come back three times more. he comes back once more.
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uhh pretrib futurists have at least three comings..the pre trib rapture....the millenial coming..then the coming after the millenium
 
NoahsMom said:
Soooooo....your sayin they think there is 3 commings?
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Yup..

1. Rapture before tribulation - Coming 1
2. Rapture before mil reign- Coming 2
3. Coming at new heavens new earth. - Coming 3

So yeah pre tribbers got Jesus coming back more than the Eagles.
 
1still_waters said:
uhh pretrib futurists have at least three comings..the pre trib rapture....the millenial coming..then the coming after the millenium
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I'm a pretrib futurist (heh, I just learned I was a "futurist" today). Christ is returning twice more. Once for the church (rapture) and the well-known return at the end of the trib, when he returns TO the earth for the 1000 year reign.

Not three. Not that I know of anyway.
 
Katy-follower said:
But if you really think about it, Catholicism is a counterfeit of Christianity. Any Catholic will tell you they are Christian. The devil is anti christian, so the best way to get back at God is to lead people into what they think is Christianity - Pagan sun worship (from babylon) in the guise of "Christianity"

Satan is smart, as he wants to conceal his plans, but to those reading the bible we can be sure that all is revealed and Rome is mentioned as the last Kingdom on earth that will fall. The Pope is even taking on the role of one of the beasts already, as he is leading this ecumenical movement into this New World order, teaming with the government.

As for the blood of the saints - The pope was involved with Hitler. More innocent lives lost at the hands of the catholic church!
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are the following about the Pope?
or Jerusalem?

any idea how many MILLIONS of innocent people have been (and are being) murdered in the world for the Zionist (TALMUDIC) cause? FAR outnumbers any Rome did.

Matthew 23:37
"O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing.

Acts 7:52
Which of the prophets did your fathers not persecute? And they killed those who announced beforehand the coming of the Righteous One, whom you have now betrayed and murdered,

1 Thessalonians 2:15
who killed the Lord Jesus and the prophets and also drove us out. They displease God and are hostile to all men

Revelation 18:24
In her was found the blood of prophets and of the saints, and of all who have been killed on the earth."
 
shroom2 said:
I'm a pretrib futurist (heh, I just learned I was a "futurist" today). Christ is returning twice more. Once for the church (rapture) and the well-known return at the end of the trib, when he returns TO the earth for the 1000 year reign.

Not three. Not that I know of anyway.
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1st Coming, secret (2nd) Rapture, Final Coming (3rd)
 
zone said:
1st Coming, secret (2nd) Rapture, Final Coming (3rd)
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Right. But that's not how I understood StillWaters. She said there are three future comings, at least I thought so.

...and the rapture is not a secret, hasn't been since Paul wrote Corinthians and Thessalonians.
 
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