Dogs Returning To Their Vomit

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
14,143
5,720
113
You have done those things. I'm just saying you did so because God did a work of grace in you.
I don’t really know brother what I’ve done but certainly everyone ever saves is going to be because he saved us , all I’m saying is the gospel is what he did to save us and we’re meant to believe it that’s how he works in us

as far as salvstion of mine brother I’m waiting to n expectation trying to be prepared to meet the lord and I’ll live or die when he declares my judgement

i believe I’ll be saved , I hope all who have ever said the name Jesus is saved but I believe salvation will come with the savior for those who wait for him

If we believe the gospel we shall be saved that day os my belief and we can believe that part but judgement is going to dig really deep into us in the center of our heart and motives I know to some this doesn’t sound like chrirtianity to wait to see the lord before we begin declaring ourselves saved but that’s something heavy upon my heart regarding my own self

The lord suffered unimaginably to sit upon his throne and be the judge of the living and dead . So I myself just try to live up to the thkngs he’s taught me and hope in the things he’s said will come

i know who my judge is and what he said but also I know my own deeds cursed with a memory like an elephant I remember back to combat even and some of my actions and words behaviors and things I remember heck even back to school things i have done and I hope in the lord because I’ll be seeing him soon but I fear greatly as it approaches

all I have at this point honestly is the gospel that’s my only hope is to recognize his judgements and realize how they can save my soul and I see it really clearly for myself I’m saying .
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
19,207
6,608
113
62
“The example you use is exactly as I said. You assume that 5 were chosen for death and 5 for life. But that isn't what happened. All were under a death sentence. But in grace, the farmer sovereignly chose 5 to be saved.”

right there were ten cattle nd he o my chose 5 to save . What does that mean since he’s the soveriegn for those he didn’t choose

toy can’t acknolwedge he saved five by his choice and the other five had nothing to do with his choice he created all ten all ten were in the same boat l headed to slaughter but he chose only 5 to be saved.

The other five are by default chosen by the same soveriegn to be slaughtered

“The answer is...the farmer can do as he chooses. They are his cows.”

so we’re back to God chose some to save and others to be slaughtered right ? Yet the bible tells us no God Will is that all the cows be saved and not be slaughtered not tbat because they are his he declared some saved and others slaughtered

that’s my entire point the Bible tells us I’ve quoted several times Gods Will is that no one perish no cow be slaughtered , but your back to they are his cows if he wants to slaughter some and save some so be it ……

we already inow his Will is that no one is slaughtered but all live on the farm like green acres brother lol” greeen archers is the place to be farm living is the life for me do doot be doot”


weve been told clearly Gods not chosen some to save and others to slaughter because they are his cows he the farmer wants all of his cows to live he’s provided peters out the back gate d a bell is ringing em out to pasture but ….some of them even though the back gate is open just keep walking towards the slaughter house even with big red flaming signs saying

“ all cows return to pasture laughter house this way turn back we don’t eat steak here “

Your logic has lost me I’m relatively simple to me it seems like if I have ten cows all designated for slaughter and I elect only five of them to save from that then the other five are downed by my election of the others seems basic 10-5 equals 5 burgers walking
I'm making a distinction that I'm obviously not communicating well. We'll just have to agree to disagree.
 

2ndTimeIsTheCharm

Well-known member
Feb 17, 2023
1,932
1,118
113
“I don't understand why you or other people would ignore the verses in the Bible that say a person can lose their salvation.”

“Now it is required that those who have been given a trust must prove faithful. I care very little if I am judged by you or by any human court; indeed, I do not even judge myself. My conscience is clear, but that does not make me innocent. It is the Lord who judges me. Therefore judge nothing before the appointed time; wait until the Lord comes. He will bring to light what is hidden in darkness and will expose the motives of the heart. At that time each will receive their praise from God.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭4:2-5‬ ‭

I do agree with what you wrote. But it's just so scary to me to ignore parts of the Bible just because they are hard to accept.

I used to do that but I found that ignoring parts of the Bible I didn't want to accept distorted my belief in God, His character, how He does things and the rules He's set for Himself and for us. And when that happened, I didn't live up to God's will and how He wanted me to live. Thank God though that He loved me enough to correct me and really drove that lesson home.

So now I face up to those difficult Bible passages that are hard to accept. And I have a better understanding of God and living in His will. I can more easily see both the desirable and difficult parts of God as harmonizing together more, whereas before I wasn't able to.

This is why I encourage people to consider the totality of what the Bible says and not ignore parts of it. It will give people a more complete picture of God, His character, and His will. And in knowing Him better, we can appreciate Him better in all that He is, what He does and His ways.


👘
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
14,143
5,720
113
I do agree with what you wrote. But it's just so scary to me to ignore parts of the Bible just because they are hard to accept.

I used to do that but I found that ignoring parts of the Bible I didn't want to accept distorted my belief in God, His character, how He does things and the rules He's set for Himself and for us. And when that happened, I didn't live up to God's will and how He wanted me to live. Thank God though that He loved me enough to correct me and really drove that lesson home.

So now I face up to those difficult Bible passages that are hard to accept. And I have a better understanding of God and living in His will. I can more easily see both the desirable and difficult parts of God as harmonizing together more, whereas before I wasn't able to.

This is why I encourage people to consider the totality of what the Bible says and not ignore parts of it. It will give people a more complete picture of God, His character, and His will. And in knowing Him better, we can appreciate Him better in all that He is, what He does and His ways.


👘
Oh I was just offering a scripture to show your point totally agreed .

Also though m not sure your age , but when I was let’s say 19 I could read the Bible and very very little would actually get into my thinking . I could read a lot but only a passage or two would really sink in. Do you remember those days ?

you knew without a doubt you were saved because of the few scriptures which really became “ written on your heart “ meaning the ones that really sink in and became part of your faith . That just became the foundation you know ?

Were all at different stages of that development we can read the same Bible and someone might be just converting a couple years ago and just now really reading anything , while another person might be seventy , retired and nearing the end of tbier lives not a lot of temptations or distractions left you know and so they find themselves reading studying praying a lot more than they did maybe at thirty when they were working full time and had a family they were caring for and time was just so scarce

God wants us taking care of our families indeed before anything so what I’m saying is . It’s not that everyone’s ignoring anything willfully , some I think maybe but who am I to judge ?

But most I think maybe are just at a stage in tbier lives and faith where they know for sure like I remeber knowing seven a youngster I believed I’m gonna be saved the lord my saviors gonna do it I know it

and it was just as true then , before I knew much of anything I know now after some study and time spent seeking understanding in prayer. I’ve never felt or believed or thought I wasn’t going to be saved even before I could let those more detailed understandings into my thinking

Im not sure this makes sense I’m not really articulate with writing and expressing just what I’m trying to say but I suppose the point is …..

“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭3:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

if that’s all I really know it’s plenty enough to be true forever

But if this is starting to sink in

“For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭5:10-11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

We can’t ignore it because it’s just as true as everything else

so i think there’s a different level of what God allows to sink in when we are prepared and he wants us to grow up . Sometimes a person isnt ready for the meat I can remember the sweetness of the milk and the strong bones it prodived but the meat makes us grow up and the lord need grown ups to be effective in the world given the times and desperate need for the gospel to be preached in this world of ever dimming light


I think as we need it he feeds us what we can handle sort of so I don’t really assume anyone’s just ignoring I think you can teach a nine month old algebra but they aren’t ignoring always they might be figure out what the heck a number is still

But surely they belong to the one who holds them as babes I just mean to say maybe ignoring willfully is a different thing from not sinking in or being understood yet

i remember as a twenty two or so yr old my daddy would always tell me bout repentance and not drinking and honkytonkin and such because I had started doing those types of things and he’s tell me all the scripture but brother it just went right in one ear and out the other I’d even seem
Interested but I was just wondering where my ride was outta the holler into town lol and it just didn’t sink in

i still felt like the lord was gonna saved me then because that’s what I knew and it was enough
 
Last edited:

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
19,207
6,608
113
62
I don’t really know brother what I’ve done but certainly everyone ever saves is going to be because he saved us , all I’m saying is the gospel is what he did to save us and we’re meant to believe it that’s how he works in us

as far as salvstion of mine brother I’m waiting to n expectation trying to be prepared to meet the lord and I’ll live or die when he declares my judgement

i believe I’ll be saved , I hope all who have ever said the name Jesus is saved but I believe salvation will come with the savior for those who wait for him

If we believe the gospel we shall be saved that day os my belief and we can believe that part but judgement is going to dig really deep into us in the center of our heart and motives I know to some this doesn’t sound like chrirtianity to wait to see the lord before we begin declaring ourselves saved but that’s something heavy upon my heart regarding my own self

The lord suffered unimaginably to sit upon his throne and be the judge of the living and dead . So I myself just try to live up to the thkngs he’s taught me and hope in the things he’s said will come

i know who my judge is and what he said but also I know my own deeds cursed with a memory like an elephant I remember back to combat even and some of my actions and words behaviors and things I remember heck even back to school things i have done and I hope in the lord because I’ll be seeing him soon but I fear greatly as it approaches

all I have at this point honestly is the gospel that’s my only hope is to recognize his judgements and realize how they can save my soul and I see it really clearly for myself I’m saying .
The whole purpose of security for the believer is that he may find rest in Christ. I don't worry a lick that I will be with God throughout eternity. I know that I have been translated out of the kingdom of darkness and into the kingdom of His dear Son. And this assurance should be the estate of all God's children. In fact, John tells his readers that this is his purpose in writing 1 John:

These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that you have eternal life...
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
14,143
5,720
113
The whole purpose of security for the believer is that he may find rest in Christ. I don't worry a lick that I will be with God throughout eternity. I know that I have been translated out of the kingdom of darkness and into the kingdom of His dear Son. And this assurance should be the estate of all God's children. In fact, John tells his readers that this is his purpose in writing 1 John:

These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that you have eternal life...
That’s good brother I’m glad you believe that way and I’m not at all disparaging your belief or saying it’s wrong in any way m actually glad you believe you’re secure , you are !!

I study the Bible maybe too much lol cuz I always come across things that I can’t bring myself to ignore and when I really look at what’s boeng said by Jesus about salvstion or an apostle like Paul about eternal judgement according to my deeds when I see it repeatedly in his letters in the gospels ect in revelation…..

it sort of brings alot of godly fear I’m not gonna lie about it it definately makes me feel like I better make sure I get my ducks in a row I feel I have at this point but I’m gonna wait because of a lot of things I can’t seem to ignore or look past or disfigure in the scriptures

dont get me wrong brother I’m looking forward to seeing his face hoping it doesn’t melt me though
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
19,207
6,608
113
62
That’s good brother I’m glad you believe that way and I’m not at all disparaging your belief or saying it’s wrong in any way m actually glad you believe you’re secure , you are !!

I study the Bible maybe too much lol cuz I always come across things that I can’t bring myself to ignore and when I really look at what’s boeng said by Jesus about salvstion or an apostle like Paul about eternal judgement according to my deeds when I see it repeatedly in his letters in the gospels ect in revelation…..

it sort of brings alot of godly fear I’m not gonna lie about it it definately makes me feel like I better make sure I get my ducks in a row I feel I have at this point but I’m gonna wait because of a lot of things I can’t seem to ignore or look past or disfigure in the scriptures

dont get me wrong brother I’m looking forward to seeing his face hoping it doesn’t melt me though
I know that some biblical verses seem to suggest that we give an accounting based on our actions, but, for the believer, we have already been judged in Christ and will not come under condemnation.
At any rate, I have enjoyed the discussion immensely.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
14,143
5,720
113
I know that some biblical verses seem to suggest that we give an accounting based on our actions, but, for the believer, we have already been judged in Christ and will not come under condemnation.
At any rate, I have enjoyed the discussion immensely.
Indeed it’s always enjoyable and yes lol they sure “ seem “to say that 😂

Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭5:9-11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

They sure do seem like they say that I can never bring myself to dismiss them

“For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, And every tongue shall confess to God. So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭14:11-12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.

For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.”
‭‭Ecclesiastes‬ ‭12:13-14‬ ‭

Seems like it says this stuff

“Who will render to every man according to his deeds: to them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:

but unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;

but glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile: for there is no respect of persons with God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭2:6-11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

that last phrase there that means “ God treats everyone the same way regardless of who they are “

“For God does not show favoritism.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭2:11‬ ‭NIV‬‬

“For there is no partiality with God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭2:11‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

“For God shows no partiality [no arbitrary favoritism; with Him one person is not more important than another]. [Deut 10:17; 2 Chr 19:7]”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭2:11‬ ‭AMP‬‬

“God is always fair when he judges people, whoever they are.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭2:11‬ ‭EASY‬‬
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
7,582
3,616
113
Please stop playing games. You said that the Holy Words from the KJV are jargon and that I need to stop using them.

Please do us all a favor, and stop speaking with authority.
Yes we should avoid jargon because different Christian denominations have different definitons for those terms.. For instance a Jehovah's witness will use the same terms that a baptist will use all derived from the Bible and they will have different ideas what those terms mean.. So again it is best to use plain English.. plain speech when discussing theology when people from different denominations are discussing scripture.. This place is not Baptist chat .com .. It is not confined to one denomination group..

I will speak what i feel lead to speak.. People can accept or reject what i say.. My duty to the LORD is to speak what i am convicted to say.. Each person is responsible for their own responses and what they declare to be so..
 

Adstar

Senior Member
Jul 24, 2016
7,582
3,616
113
This puts to much onus on the individual.

An induvidual can not longer keep themself saved than they could save themself.

It must all be given to God..
A person cannot save themselves.. Jesus saves.. But one must believe Jesus and trust in His atonement to be saved and persist in believing till the day they die. That has not changed over the past 2000 years and will not be changing any time soon..
 

selahsays

Well-known member
May 31, 2023
2,796
1,484
113
I know that some biblical verses seem to suggest that we give an accounting based on our actions, but, for the believer, we have already been judged in Christ and will not come under condemnation.
At any rate, I have enjoyed the discussion immensely.
You know what? It would be extremely interesting for someone to start a thread regarding the two judgements written about in the Bible: the Judgment Seat of Christ Judgment and the Great White Throne Judgment.
 

2ndTimothyGroup

Well-known member
Feb 20, 2021
5,883
1,953
113
I will speak what i feel lead to speak.. People can accept or reject what i say.. My duty to the LORD is to speak what i am convicted to say.
I get the clear feeling that you don't really care about others.
 

Evmur

Well-known member
Feb 28, 2021
5,219
2,618
113
London
christianchat.com
Ok, so this is the first time I've ever cared to think deeply about this passage. I'm wondering what ya'll think of what I think this is about:

2 Peter 2:22 KJV - 22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog [is] turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

I think, and I could surely be wrong here, that this passage is stating that those who claim to be Pure, Righteous, and Holy, yet are fake, will prove that they have not been Transformed by Christ, for these dogs return to their own vomit. If they had transformed into a New Creation, it would be impossible for the New Life to return to the vomit of something it no longer is. Ultimately, this process is pointing to the Circumcision of Christ . . . the fulcrum of our Faith.
... they are dogs and pigs

we be sheeps
 

Evmur

Well-known member
Feb 28, 2021
5,219
2,618
113
London
christianchat.com
NAS Heb 6: 4For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6and then have [e]fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, [f]since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.

ESV 4For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.

No comment/explanation needed.:)
Judas would tick all these boxes ... Judas never was saved
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
25,475
13,419
113
58
NAS Heb 6: 4For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6and then have [e]fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, [f]since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.

ESV 4For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.

No comment/explanation needed.:)
In regard to Hebrews 6:4-6, once enlightened - which means to bring to light, to shed light upon or to cause light to shine upon some object, in the sense of illuminating it. John 1:9 describes Jesus, the "true Light," giving light "to every man," but this cannot mean the light of salvation, because not every man is saved. The light either leads to acceptance of Jesus Christ or produces condemnation in those who reject the light.

In regard to partakers of the Holy Spirit, the word translated “partaker” can certainly refer to a saving partaking in Christ, as we read in Hebrews 3:14, yet it can also refer to a less than saving association or participation. See Luke 5:7 and Hebrews 1:9 - "comrades, companions," which describes one who shares with someone else as an associate in an undertaking. These Hebrews who fell away had obviously in some aspect shared in the ministry of the Holy Spirit, but in what way? There are other ministries of the Holy Spirit which precede receiving the indwelling and sealing of the Holy Spirit, which only genuine believers receive. (Ephesians 1:13)

Those who fall away absolutely could have been affiliated closely with the fellowship of the church. Such people certainly may have experienced sorrow for sin, heard and understood the gospel and have given some assent to it and have become associated with the work of the Holy Spirit while around believers and have tasted the heavenly gift and the powers of the age to come. They may have been exposed to the true preaching of the word of God yet have simply tasted and stopped there. People who have experienced these things may be genuine Christians, yet this alone is not enough to give conclusive evidence that the beginning stages of conversion (repentance unto life, regeneration, salvation, justification, etc..) have taken place for those who fell away. The experiences in Hebrews 6:4-6 are all preliminary to those decisive beginning stages of becoming a Christian, yet those who draw back to perdition after receiving the 'knowledge' of the truth do not believe to the saving of the soul. (Hebrews 10:39)

These certain individuals who fall short of obtaining salvation certainly may have become partakers of the Holy Spirit in his pre-salvation ministry, convicting of sin and righteousness and judgment to come by tasting the good word of God and temporarily responding to His drawing power which is intended to ultimately lead sinners to Christ, yet the writer of Hebrews does not use conclusive terms that these individuals were "indwelled by the Holy Spirit" or "sealed by the Holy Spirit." Genuine believers who have believed the gospel are sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession/unto the day of redemption. (Ephesians 1:13-14; 4:30)

In regard to "tasted" the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, they may have tasted in such a way as to give them a distinct impression of what was tasted, yet they still fell away. Inherent in the idea of tasting is the fact that one might or might not decide to accept what is tasted. For example, the same Greek word (geuomai) is used in Matthew 27:34 to say that those crucifying Jesus "offered him wine to drink, mingled with gall; but when he tasted it, he would not drink it." We do not merely taste, but drink into one Spirit. (1 Corinthians 12:13)

In regard to renew them again unto repentance, this does not specify whether the repentance was merely outward or genuine accompanied by saving faith. They have in some sense "repented," there may be sorrow for sins and an attempt to turn from them (moral self-reformation) that non-believers can experience. There is repentance that falls short of salvation, which is clear from Hebrews 12:7 and the reference to Esau, as well as the repentance of Judas Iscariot in Matthew 27:3. Paul refers to a repentance “without regret that leads to salvation,” which shows there is a repentance that does not lead to salvation. As with “belief/faith”, so too with “repentance,” we must always distinguish between what is substantial and results in salvation and what is spurious. Renew them again "unto salvation" would be conclusive evidence for the argument of a loss of salvation.

In Hebrews 6:7-8, we read - For the earth which drinks in the rain that often comes upon it and bears herbs useful for those by whom it is cultivated, receives blessing from God; but if it bears thorns and briars, it is rejected and near to being cursed, whose end is to be burned. In this metaphor relating to agriculture, those who receive final judgment are compared to land that bears no vegetation or useful fruit, but rather bears thorns and thistles. We see in scripture where good fruit is the evidence of spiritual life and a lack of good fruit is a sign of false believers (Matthew 3:8-10; 7:15-20; 12:33-35) so we have an indication that the trustworthy evidence of one's spiritual condition is the fruit they bear (whether good or bad), suggesting that those who fell away in Hebrews 6 were not genuine believers.

*Verse 9 sums it up for me. The writer is speaking to those truly saved (refers to them as BELOVED). He says that even though he speaks like this concerning THOSE types of people, He is convinced of better things concerning YOU. Things that ACCOMPANY SALVATION. Thorns and briars and falling away permanently do not accompany salvation and are not fruits worthy of authentic repentance.

It's generally stated by those who believe that salvation can be lost that it can be regained again, yet that would not be the case here if the writer of Hebrews was teaching a loss of salvation. I have heard certain individuals state they know someone who was truly saved, but later lost their salvation, yet only God truly knows the heart of individuals. Certain people "on the surface" may do a good job of looking like the real deal for a while (like Judas Iscariot, who was an unbelieving, unclean devil who betrayed Jesus - John 6:64-71; 13:10-11) yet to the other 11 disciples, he looked like the real deal, but Jesus knew his heart. There are genuine Christians and there are "nominal" Christians. There are genuine believers and there are make believers and it's not always easy to tell them apart.
 

2ndTimeIsTheCharm

Well-known member
Feb 17, 2023
1,932
1,118
113
Oh I was just offering a scripture to show your point totally agreed .

Also though m not sure your age , but when I was let’s say 19 I could read the Bible and very very little would actually get into my thinking . I could read a lot but only a passage or two would really sink in. Do you remember those days ?

you knew without a doubt you were saved because of the few scriptures which really became “ written on your heart “ meaning the ones that really sink in and became part of your faith . That just became the foundation you know ?

Were all at different stages of that development we can read the same Bible and someone might be just converting a couple years ago and just now really reading anything , while another person might be seventy , retired and nearing the end of tbier lives not a lot of temptations or distractions left you know and so they find themselves reading studying praying a lot more than they did maybe at thirty when they were working full time and had a family they were caring for and time was just so scarce

God wants us taking care of our families indeed before anything so what I’m saying is . It’s not that everyone’s ignoring anything willfully , some I think maybe but who am I to judge ?

But most I think maybe are just at a stage in tbier lives and faith where they know for sure like I remeber knowing seven a youngster I believed I’m gonna be saved the lord my saviors gonna do it I know it

and it was just as true then , before I knew much of anything I know now after some study and time spent seeking understanding in prayer. I’ve never felt or believed or thought I wasn’t going to be saved even before I could let those more detailed understandings into my thinking

Im not sure this makes sense I’m not really articulate with writing and expressing just what I’m trying to say but I suppose the point is …..

“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭3:16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

if that’s all I really know it’s plenty enough to be true forever

But if this is starting to sink in

“For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭5:10-11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

We can’t ignore it because it’s just as true as everything else

so i think there’s a different level of what God allows to sink in when we are prepared and he wants us to grow up . Sometimes a person isnt ready for the meat I can remember the sweetness of the milk and the strong bones it prodived but the meat makes us grow up and the lord need grown ups to be effective in the world given the times and desperate need for the gospel to be preached in this world of ever dimming light


I think as we need it he feeds us what we can handle sort of so I don’t really assume anyone’s just ignoring I think you can teach a nine month old algebra but they aren’t ignoring always they might be figure out what the heck a number is still

But surely they belong to the one who holds them as babes I just mean to say maybe ignoring willfully is a different thing from not sinking in or being understood yet

i remember as a twenty two or so yr old my daddy would always tell me bout repentance and not drinking and honkytonkin and such because I had started doing those types of things and he’s tell me all the scripture but brother it just went right in one ear and out the other I’d even seem
Interested but I was just wondering where my ride was outta the holler into town lol and it just didn’t sink in

i still felt like the lord was gonna saved me then because that’s what I knew and it was enough

I feel that my major mistake though was ignoring parts of the Bible when I was young. I did learn my lesson eventually but I wasted so much time that I could have been serving God more accurately.

As a result I destroyed my testimony to my family - so far I've only got my mother to get to know God for salvation, and even there I'm still not sure if its genuine. So I continue to pray and try to abide in God in such a way as to let them see Him at work in my life.

My brother rolls his eyes and smirks every time I talk about God. And it kills me inside because when we were younger, he was open to the reality of God. But I had a crisis of faith and it showed itself in my actions, and feelings and thoughts. It really did affect him. So I've been praying to God about that too and asking Him how to reach my brother.

With my sister, she seems open to at least finding a Christian church. She's not open to charismatic or pentacostal churches which is what I used to go to (I was Assemblies of God) which is fine with me. I lean more baptist now and that would be a better fit for her too. So I'm trying to find a good church for her where she lives. I think she is open to know God for herself. I remember she was seeking God as a teenager, but didn't find Him. I asked God about that and He laid it on my heart that she had preconceived ideas about Him and wasn't open to who He really was at that time. So I pray for her too - hopefully she will get to know Him for who He really is in time.

With my father - he is the hardest sell. He's really stubborn and he thinks he's good enough to go heaven. His parents are born again Christians and growing up he went to church and even taught Sunday school. But he's not a Christian, never made the conscious decision to follow Christ and doesn't even seek Him out. He's done some pretty awful things for which I forgive him (with the help of God) so I don't want him going to hell. It's hard to talk to him about God because he thinks he's good and doesn't need Him. I pray for my father and I know the likelihood of him getting saved looks bleak, but I'm compelled to never stop praying for him.

Anyway, this seems to meander about but I'm explaining what drives me to encourage people to accept the totality of the Bible. It will save them a lot of wasted time, possible loss of testimony and grief!


🐛
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
14,143
5,720
113
I feel that my major mistake though was ignoring parts of the Bible when I was young. I did learn my lesson eventually but I wasted so much time that I could have been serving God more accurately.

As a result I destroyed my testimony to my family - so far I've only got my mother to get to know God for salvation, and even there I'm still not sure if its genuine. So I continue to pray and try to abide in God in such a way as to let them see Him at work in my life.

My brother rolls his eyes and smirks every time I talk about God. And it kills me inside because when we were younger, he was open to the reality of God. But I had a crisis of faith and it showed itself in my actions, and feelings and thoughts. It really did affect him. So I've been praying to God about that too and asking Him how to reach my brother.

With my sister, she seems open to at least finding a Christian church. She's not open to charismatic or pentacostal churches which is what I used to go to (I was Assemblies of God) which is fine with me. I lean more baptist now and that would be a better fit for her too. So I'm trying to find a good church for her where she lives. I think she is open to know God for herself. I remember she was seeking God as a teenager, but didn't find Him. I asked God about that and He laid it on my heart that she had preconceived ideas about Him and wasn't open to who He really was at that time. So I pray for her too - hopefully she will get to know Him for who He really is in time.

With my father - he is the hardest sell. He's really stubborn and he thinks he's good enough to go heaven. His parents are born again Christians and growing up he went to church and even taught Sunday school. But he's not a Christian, never made the conscious decision to follow Christ and doesn't even seek Him out. He's done some pretty awful things for which I forgive him (with the help of God) so I don't want him going to hell. It's hard to talk to him about God because he thinks he's good and doesn't need Him. I pray for my father and I know the likelihood of him getting saved looks bleak, but I'm compelled to never stop praying for him.

Anyway, this seems to meander about but I'm explaining what drives me to encourage people to accept the totality of the Bible. It will save them a lot of wasted time, possible loss of testimony and grief!


🐛
Yes I can relate and understand what your saying as we refuse certain things it affects the power of the doctrine to effect change in our lives
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
19,207
6,608
113
62
You know what? It would be extremely interesting for someone to start a thread regarding the two judgements written about in the Bible: the Judgment Seat of Christ Judgment and the Great White Throne Judgment.
You are the one you are waiting for.
 

Everlasting-Grace

Well-known member
Dec 18, 2021
5,944
1,872
113
I don't think you read anything I wrote!
Yes I did.

Eternal life is in Jesus - it's not a separate thing. You can only have eternal life in Jesus. If you walk away from Him, you lose that life and the other benefits of salvation.
Eternal life is a gift govenm to those who are born again, It is an item.

Walk away from Jesus, You can do that? Did he not promise he would never let you go?

what hope does anyone have if we have that power?

God has given all of us a free will and will never take that from us. He wants us to freely choose Him. And He wants us to have a real active relationship with Him. He doesn't want to zap us and make us robots that are programmed to love Him. Would you want your wife to be programmed to love you or have free will to choose to love you? I know some sickos would prefer to have their spouse programmed, but not God, that's for sure!

Just calling abiding in Christ a legalistic work doesn't make it as such. If God wants us to take up our yoke then it isn't a legalistic work. Otherwise He wouldn't tell us to do it.

I don't understand why you or other people would ignore the verses in the Bible that say a person can lose their salvation. God put those verses in there for a good reason - because they're true and can happen! With names mentioned to boot!

I don't think you should be so scared to accept that it can happen. You should focus more on the fact that many people have stay saved through the generations and that you will too. You can also pray for yourself and others that God helps us to stay with Him. That's what I do!


👘
once again, If you are abiding TO BE SAVED. you are working to earn that salvation. You are in effect saying you are saved because of something you must continue to do.

Salvation then becomes a wage, and not a grace gift that could never be earned.

As for walking away. I am sorry. But I do nto believe anyone who walks away ever knew Christ. Because how can you trust God with your eternity. and recieve his grace gift and all that comes with it, then deny it? I do not think you can

John said they were never of us, if they were of us, they never would have left.

People do not just walk away from God and deny his salvation. I was a prodigal son for 5 years. in all that time, i never denied he was my faith or I needed saved, I just lost faith in him for my daily life.