Did Jesus Die on The Cross for The Just/Elect/Saved Whose Names Are Written in The Book of Life OR
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No, they weren't appointed to "gospel privileges",whatever that means. The text says they specifically were appointed for eternal life. There's another passage that essentially teaches the same truth a little bit differently:
Acts 16:14
14 One of those listening was a woman named Lydia , a dealer in purple cloth from the city of Thyatira, who was a worshiper of God. The Lord opened her heart to respond to Paul's message.
NIV
And this logically means that if the Lord had not opened her heart, she would not have responded positively to the gospel. This text proves that no one is saved by hearing just the general, outward call of the gospel. This call MUST be accompanied by supernatural power that effects the souls, minds and hearts of the listeners. This is why scripture teaches that all believers have been brought forth by God (born of Him) by the Spirit and the Word.
Acts 16:14
14 One of those listening was a woman named Lydia , a dealer in purple cloth from the city of Thyatira, who was a worshiper of God. The Lord opened her heart to respond to Paul's message.
NIV
And this logically means that if the Lord had not opened her heart, she would not have responded positively to the gospel. This text proves that no one is saved by hearing just the general, outward call of the gospel. This call MUST be accompanied by supernatural power that effects the souls, minds and hearts of the listeners. This is why scripture teaches that all believers have been brought forth by God (born of Him) by the Spirit and the Word.
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If the NIV "respond" is not the best translation of the word used in Acts 16:14 and a better translation was - 1. to be in a state of alert, be concerned about, care for, take care; 2. to pay close attention to someth., pay attention to, give heed to, follow; 3. to continue in close attention to someth., occupy oneself with, devote or apply oneself to (BDAG) - would it make a difference in interpreting what Luke is telling us?
Amen.
But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
- John 1:12-13
having predestined us to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will,
- Ephesians 1:5
But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
- John 1:12-13
having predestined us to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will,
- Ephesians 1:5
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He was physically dead.
Jesus had to wake Him up...
11 After saying these things, he said to them, “Our friend Lazarus has fallen asleep, but I go to awaken him.”
So this has nothing to do with anything you are trying to present and as typical it reveals you know nothing of truth but your false doctrine.
Jesus had to wake Him up...
11 After saying these things, he said to them, “Our friend Lazarus has fallen asleep, but I go to awaken him.”
So this has nothing to do with anything you are trying to present and as typical it reveals you know nothing of truth but your false doctrine.
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Lydia was ALREADY a proselyte/follower of God.
She was already a seeker of the TRUTH which is easy for God to direct her.
Your own verse shows it:
14 One of those listening was a woman named Lydia , a dealer in purple cloth from the city of Thyatira, who was a worshiper of God. The Lord opened her heart to respond to Paul's message.
She was already a seeker of the TRUTH which is easy for God to direct her.
Your own verse shows it:
14 One of those listening was a woman named Lydia , a dealer in purple cloth from the city of Thyatira, who was a worshiper of God. The Lord opened her heart to respond to Paul's message.
Or "prosecho" (Strong's 4337) means "pay attention to", "be cautious about", "apply oneself" -- or "take heed", "have regard for".
And so Lydia did AFTER God supernaturally acted upon her!
And why should any God-loving, God-fearing Christian doubt this or cast aspersions upon such divine actions? The other day, I gave several examples out of the OT whereby God "forced" his will upon various people such as Abimelech, Balaam, Job, Jonah, etc. Either God is really in charge of his creation or he isn't! Either he is Sovereign King or he isn't. Either his will be done on earth as it is in heaven or it isn't. Either the Potter is in control this world or his created clay pots are.
And so Lydia did AFTER God supernaturally acted upon her!
And why should any God-loving, God-fearing Christian doubt this or cast aspersions upon such divine actions? The other day, I gave several examples out of the OT whereby God "forced" his will upon various people such as Abimelech, Balaam, Job, Jonah, etc. Either God is really in charge of his creation or he isn't! Either he is Sovereign King or he isn't. Either his will be done on earth as it is in heaven or it isn't. Either the Potter is in control this world or his created clay pots are.
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It has everything to do with it. Are you suggesting that God was careless when he used the metaphor of "death" to describe man's helpless spiritual condition? Was HE careless, reckless and irresponsible with his use of words when from the very beginning he told Adam that in the day of his disobedience he would "surely DIE"?
And you so steeped in your willful ignorance of the scriptures that you turn a blind eye to the saints' spiritual resurrection from the dead?
Eph 5:14
14 for anything that becomes visible is light. Therefore it says,
"Awake, O sleeper ,
and arise from the dead,
and Christ will shine on you."
ESV
You're such a Humanist! You think one is not literally dead unless he's physically dead, right? All that spiritual stuff really can't be taken literally, right?
But of course, you have it all backwards as usual; for the SUBSTANCE of both life and death is not to be found in temporal reality but in spiritual reality. (Read 1Cor 15 some day.) Don't you know that Adam became a living being only AFTER God breathed LIFE into his nostrils? Then Adam rose from the ground and stood erect! But when he sinned, he became separated from his Creator -- his soul no longer alive to the One who had given it life. And it's not in man's power to bridge that gap. And God made very certain of that when he stationed the cherubim and the flaming sword to guard the way to the Tree of Life. Man cannot will himself back to life. There's only ONE Man who ever had that power (Jn 10:18).And before you respond with more of your foolishness, do yourself a favor and meditate on Eph 1:18-23. God's power that works in his elect is the same exact power that it took to raise his Son from the dead!
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It has everything to do with it. Are you suggesting that God was careless when he used the metaphor of "death" to describe man's helpless spiritual condition? Was HE careless, reckless and irresponsible with his use of words when from the very beginning he told Adam that in the day of his disobedience he would "surely DIE"?
And you so steeped in your willful ignorance of the scriptures that you turn a blind eye to the saints' spiritual resurrection from the dead?
Eph 5:14
14 for anything that becomes visible is light. Therefore it says,
"Awake, O sleeper ,
and arise from the dead,
and Christ will shine on you."
ESV
You're such a Humanist! You think one is not literally dead unless he's physically dead, right? All that spiritual stuff really can't be taken literally, right? But of course, you have it all backwards as usual; for the SUBSTANCE of both life and death is not to be found in temporal reality but in spiritual reality. (Read 1Cor 15 some day.) Don't you know that Adam became a living being only AFTER God breathed LIFE into his nostrils? Then Adam rose from the ground and stood erect! But when he sinned, he became separated from his Creator -- his soul no longer alive to the One who had given it life. And it's not in man's power to bridge that gap. And God made very certain of that when he stationed the cherubim and the flaming sword to guard the way to the Tree of Life. Man cannot will himself back to life. There's only ONE Man who ever had that power (Jn 10:18).
And before you respond with more of your foolishness, do yourself a favor and meditate on Eph 1:18-23. God's power that works in his elect is the same exact power that it took to raise his Son from the dead!
And you so steeped in your willful ignorance of the scriptures that you turn a blind eye to the saints' spiritual resurrection from the dead?
Eph 5:14
14 for anything that becomes visible is light. Therefore it says,
"Awake, O sleeper ,
and arise from the dead,
and Christ will shine on you."
ESV
You're such a Humanist! You think one is not literally dead unless he's physically dead, right? All that spiritual stuff really can't be taken literally, right?
But of course, you have it all backwards as usual; for the SUBSTANCE of both life and death is not to be found in temporal reality but in spiritual reality. (Read 1Cor 15 some day.) Don't you know that Adam became a living being only AFTER God breathed LIFE into his nostrils? Then Adam rose from the ground and stood erect! But when he sinned, he became separated from his Creator -- his soul no longer alive to the One who had given it life. And it's not in man's power to bridge that gap. And God made very certain of that when he stationed the cherubim and the flaming sword to guard the way to the Tree of Life. Man cannot will himself back to life. There's only ONE Man who ever had that power (Jn 10:18).And before you respond with more of your foolishness, do yourself a favor and meditate on Eph 1:18-23. God's power that works in his elect is the same exact power that it took to raise his Son from the dead!
11 After saying these things, he said to them, “Our friend Lazarus has fallen asleep, but I go to awaken him.”
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So God acted upon her to pay attention. It seems BDAG and Strong's are pretty much in agreement and "respond" may be a bit of a stretch or at least require some explanation.
But the fact that God did act is obviously true. A question is begged from this verse (which you obviously know is not the only one on the topic), once God got her to pay attention, what then happened? Did she hear and learn and then believe per John6? Did God give her faith? Did she respond to what she paid attention to and prove she was one of God's Elect? Did God show she was one of His Elect by opening her heart fully to pay attention? I'm not looking at the verses so am just throwing out questions.
I see no reason to contest your rhetorical examples you've apparently recently put forth. I know many take exception to God forcing things, but I have no such concerns. I may or may not agree with all that's said about Election by the various sides and prefer to just look at a section of Scripture at a time from any side of the argument. Once we view God as Sovereign and see the various areas of Scripture we argue about, I'm often left thinking that there is some merit in more than one argument. IOW it's not so easy to say one size fits all in the way we seem to desire to put Him in a box to satisfy our thinking. He's able to do what He desires in any matter or example He desires to make a case about. He's constrained only by His essence which underlies His decrees and how perfect, infinite essence functions remains difficult for us to reason.
With this said, I have little concern that He righteously and justly deals with His Creation as He sees fit. Whatever He does, He can never be condemned by His Creation for it. Paul's first command in Romans draws from the Psalms and commands us to see God as true and every man a liar. Whatever God does, God does. To say He does this and doesn't do that based upon the sensibilities of men and how they view absolute and perfect Righteousness and Justice is in part answered by Paul's command using the Psalms.
I also see God telling men that they either believe in His Son or stand condemned to face His wrath as being coercion to the Nth degree. I doubt the non-elect care. I doubt the overly sensitive Elect agree that God coerces or that His coercion is perfectly in line with His Love and His Grace and all the other characteristics of His perfect essence.
But the fact that God did act is obviously true. A question is begged from this verse (which you obviously know is not the only one on the topic), once God got her to pay attention, what then happened? Did she hear and learn and then believe per John6? Did God give her faith? Did she respond to what she paid attention to and prove she was one of God's Elect? Did God show she was one of His Elect by opening her heart fully to pay attention? I'm not looking at the verses so am just throwing out questions.
I see no reason to contest your rhetorical examples you've apparently recently put forth. I know many take exception to God forcing things, but I have no such concerns. I may or may not agree with all that's said about Election by the various sides and prefer to just look at a section of Scripture at a time from any side of the argument. Once we view God as Sovereign and see the various areas of Scripture we argue about, I'm often left thinking that there is some merit in more than one argument. IOW it's not so easy to say one size fits all in the way we seem to desire to put Him in a box to satisfy our thinking. He's able to do what He desires in any matter or example He desires to make a case about. He's constrained only by His essence which underlies His decrees and how perfect, infinite essence functions remains difficult for us to reason.
With this said, I have little concern that He righteously and justly deals with His Creation as He sees fit. Whatever He does, He can never be condemned by His Creation for it. Paul's first command in Romans draws from the Psalms and commands us to see God as true and every man a liar. Whatever God does, God does. To say He does this and doesn't do that based upon the sensibilities of men and how they view absolute and perfect Righteousness and Justice is in part answered by Paul's command using the Psalms.
I also see God telling men that they either believe in His Son or stand condemned to face His wrath as being coercion to the Nth degree. I doubt the non-elect care. I doubt the overly sensitive Elect agree that God coerces or that His coercion is perfectly in line with His Love and His Grace and all the other characteristics of His perfect essence.
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God spoke to the rebellious nay-saying Jews in such a way that they closed their own eyes tighter and blocked their own ears more determinedly. That is how He blinded them. There were God-fearing Jews whom Jesus spoke to differently because they were being attentive. He does not unilaterally blind anyone's understanding.
It does not say specifically WHEN they had been appointed, nor does it say specifically what it was that they believed. The context fits with these gentiles having been appointed to aeonous life by their believing in the Gospel preached by Paul on the previous sabbath (Acts 13:16-43) and on this subsequent sabbath (Acts 13:44--46). The context fits with them, after having been so appointed by their faith in that gospel preached, believbing and rejoicing at what Paul said next -
For so has the Lord commanded us saying, "I have set you to be a light to the gentiles, that you should be for salvation to the ends of the earth. " And when the gentiles heard THIS, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord, as many as had been ordained to aeonous life [through putting their fairh in Jesus earlier].
For so has the Lord commanded us saying, "I have set you to be a light to the gentiles, that you should be for salvation to the ends of the earth. " And when the gentiles heard THIS, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord, as many as had been ordained to aeonous life [through putting their fairh in Jesus earlier].