Did Jesus Die on The Cross for The Just/Elect/Saved Whose Names Are Written in The Book of Life OR

[Cameron143]

Now you are saying Free Will is real when you said you had no choice but to be saved?

The ability to choose isn't freewill. The ability to choose doesn't allow for every choice to come to pass.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

Let's suppose you want to buy a car. You go to the lot and see a vehicle that costs 200K. Can you purchase the vehicle? Technically, sure. You are able to go through the financing process. But are you able to get the vehicle? For most people...no. Why? Probably because they don't have the savings, collateral, or income that will support securing the vehicle.
Now if you had a friend who simply came and gave you the money, now you could.

You are proving Free Will all because it's not in you to agree with me.

I knew it.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

The ability to choose isn't freewill. The ability to choose doesn't allow for every choice to come to pass.

Sure it does. We chose to accept God's offer or reject it.
We have that ability.

 

[Cameron143]

You are proving Free Will all because it's not in you to agree with me.

I knew it.

I don't believe there is freewill as most describe it here.

 

[Cameron143]

Sure it does. We chose to accept God's offer or reject it.
We have that ability.

I well aware that's how you understand things. But why does a goat never turn into a sheep? Why does a tare never become wheat?

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

I don't believe there is freewill as most describe it here.

Well, but it is obvious you believe in some form of it.
You have made that clear to me.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

I well aware that's how you understand things. But why does a goat never turn into a sheep? Why does a tare never become wheat?

If God makes us be saved and He makes everything the way it is including how the circumstances took place with Jesus, it's all a command.

If it's not a command then it's Free Will.

 

[studier]

I don't believe there is freewill as most describe it here.

Please describe or define what you believe re: free will.

 

[Cameron143]

Well, but it is obvious you believe in some form of it.
You have made that clear to me.

I believe men have the capacity to choose as they like. I do not believe they have the capability to bring all their choices to fruition.

 

[Cameron143]

If God makes us be saved and He makes everything the way it is including how the circumstances took place with Jesus, it's all a command.

If it's not a command then it's Free Will.

I disagree with your last statement.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

I believe men have the capacity to choose as they like. I do not believe they have the capability to bring all their choices to fruition.

I believe the same way.

But choosing to submit/yield is simply agreeing we are lost without God and need Him.

 

[studier]

I well aware that's how you understand things. But why does a goat never turn into a sheep? Why does a tare never become wheat?

Because they reject the Gospel.

 

[Cameron143]

Please describe or define what you believe re: free will.

A will that is absolutely free has both the ability to make any and all choices as well as the ability to bring those choices to pass.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

I disagree with your last statement.

When God speaks it's either Prophesy, Warning, Teaching and anything He accomplishes is ultimately a Command or it won't obey.

 

[Cameron143]

I believe the same way.

But choosing to submit/yield is simply agreeing we are lost without God and need Him.

Right. But I don't believe the nature of fallen man allows for the freedom of choices that you do.

 

[PaulThomson]

Again, what I have said is true of God all along.

How so?

 

[Cameron143]

When God speaks it's either Prophesy, Warning, Teaching and anything He accomplishes is ultimately a Command or it won't obey.

Reread the post where I distinguish between prescriptive and descriptive will of God.

 

[Cameron143]

How so?

Just catch up on the thread. It's there.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

Right. But I don't believe the nature of fallen man allows for the freedom of choices that you do.

It's just yielding and nothing else.

 

[FollowerofShiloh]

Reread the post where I distinguish between prescriptive and descriptive will of God.

According to that post there's a possibility of chance. I doubt chance was involved when God wanted His Plan for Jesus to be Sacrificed.