Gods will vs mans free will

[Rufus]

Job 15:14 is spoken by a man who God says did not speak correctly. I see you agree with that man. Join the dots.

I know...you keep telling us that. But then...shouldn't we just write off the entire book of Job since it's replete with errors? All those errors would make the book totally untrustworthy, would they not?

And, yes, I agree with Job because the Book is divinely inspired by God and the specific passages I cited harmonize with the rest of scripture.

P.S. Since Job was such a pathetic spiritual slouch, I wonder why God didn't command Job's three friends to intercede for poor Job and offer sacrifices on his behalf.

 

[Lafftur]

The life that God wants us to choose is not eternal life, which Christ has already accomplished on the cross for those that God gave him, but is that good and abundant life of peace, joy and contentment as we sojourn here on earth. This life can only be chosen by those who have been born again.

Actually, I believe it is both - Life now IN CHRIST on this Earth and Eternal Life IN CHRIST for eternity.

Life is IN CHRIST.

 

[PaulThomson]

There are no contradictions within the Doctrines of Grace. Those "contradictions" are monsters of your own worldly imagination. Maybe a friendly exorcism would do the trick for you...

Paradox

Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Paradox




A paradox is a logically self-contradictory statement or a statement that runs contrary to one's expectation.

Rufus said:
Well...on the other hand, the bible is filled to the brim with paradoxes...so what's one more?

 

[PaulThomson]

I know...you keep telling us that. But then...shouldn't we just write off the entire book of Job since it's replete with errors? All those errors would make the book totally untrustworthy, would they not?

And, yes, I agree with Job because the Book is divinely inspired by God and the specific passages I cited harmonize with the rest of scripture.

P.S. Since Job was such a pathetic spiritual slouch, I wonder why God didn't command Job's three friends to intercede for poor Job and offer sacrifices on his behalf.

There are some chapters of Job that are expressing things that are true so we can understand more how God operates and thinks; and there are some chapters recording the opinions of blind guides, who you happen to agree with yourself: chapters written to point out the foolish fallacious thinking of men not uninspired by the Holy Spirit.

Job's three verbose friends were no more insightful than Job, probably less so. Maybe God was trying to get the three friends to intercede for Job, but they couldn't hear God. Elihu did hear God and did intercede for Job. Job proved to be teachable and correctable. Good on Job.

 

[Lafftur]

Death, according to Strong's concordance is "a separation". The life, in Duet 30:19, is not referencing eternal life, but abundant life of joy and peace that his children can have if they choose to follow his commandments. If they choose death, they will separate themselves from God's fellowship, but not from their eternal inheritance.

In Deuteronomy a lot was said about blessings and curses…. which infers Life and Death.

Adam and Eve were full of Life until they sinned which resulted in them being cursed and separated from dwelling with God in the garden.

It’s all intertwined but in simplicity….

Life is ONLY IN CHRIST.

Death is everything NOT IN CHRIST.

 

[Lafftur]

Paradox
View attachment 267804
Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Paradox




A paradox is a logically self-contradictory statement or a statement that runs contrary to one's expectation.

Rufus said:
Well...on the other hand, the bible is filled to the brim with paradoxes...so what's one more?

The contradictions and paradoxes occur with “literal” dependency on human reasoning interpretation when “spiritual” interpretation by the Holy Spirit is needed….

He that has an ear let him hear what the Spirit is saying…

Just ask the Holy Spirit for understanding in humility- total dependence on the Holy Spirit.

 

[PaulThomson]

The contradictions and paradoxes occur with “literal” dependency on human reasoning interpretation when “spiritual” interpretation by the Holy Spirit is needed….

He that has an ear let him hear what the Spirit is saying…

Just ask the Holy Spirit for understanding in humility- total dependence on the Holy Spirit.

Why do you think ear here does not mean literal ears, but must mean spiritual ears? Why is Jesus not saying, "Everyone who has ears that are working, pay attention to what I am saying to you."

 

[Lafftur]

Why do you think ear here does not mean literal ears, but must mean spiritual ears? Why is Jesus not saying, "Everyone who has ears that are working, pay attention to what I am saying to you."

Because Jesus Christ said to hear what the SPIRIT is saying… which can ONLY be heard with spiritual ears that relate spiritual understanding to our human brains.

 

[Saul-to-Paul]

God created man but gave man free will. Yet God wants man to give us our free will and live according to Gods will.
This intersection of free will and "discerning" Gods will, can be quite challenging.

Here is an example. I'm 51 currently out of work. I've been praying for God to guide me through this difficult time. To be honest, I DONT want to go back to corporate work, but the reality of finances and such might dictate i do so versus starting a new business on my own.
I've been praying and asking God to open doors and opportunities which requires faith. At the same time, God isn't a genie, so a job or new business isn't going to come unless I apply, network, etc. I must DO or ACT upon my own free will and or thoughts to make it happen. While there may be some Christians are many who might say patiently wait upon the Lord.

Another example, prior to be going back to church, I was listening to David Goggins (Navy seal, motivational speaker) and purchased his two audio books. Listening to his message of self-empowerment allowed me to lose 20+ pounds through dedicated working out and a strict diet. The mindset of "you are on your own" and you can do it was empowering. However, does this conflict with biblical principals as well? For the bible says "I am made perfect in your weakness." My point is we have the ability through our own free will do certain things, we can choose what car we buy, what foods we eat, surely, I don't need Gods discernment on everything, etc right?

I don't know if others feel this, but when I feel vulnerable (and humble) when I pray to God several times a day.
But when I feel like it's not my time (God doesn't or hasn't answer my prayer) then I say OK, and I'm going to make something happen if you get my point. Please correct me if I'm not thinking about this right.

Only God's will matters. God is 100% in charge. Man lost their free will (died) in the garden of Eden. After that episode:
Romans 3:10-12 KJV
10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

Romans 5:12 KJV
12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

God must take the first and last step to save a person.

Philippians 1:6
6 Being confident of this very thing, that he (God) which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ: