Myth: Humans were hunter-gatherers first, farmers later

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Hakawaka said:
I would agree on Acts 15:29 and Colossians 2:16, but I dont know why people keep saying Peter's vision has anything to do with food, just cause in the vision it says rise Peter kill and eat? If you look at the explanation of the vision its talking about calling no human unclean, the animals represent gentiles.
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Oh and I would also add another proof text for eat as you please (except blood and food sacrificed to idols obviously as the letter to the gentiles says in acts 15):

Mark 7:19 For it doesn’t go into their heart but into their stomach, and then out of the body.” (In saying this, Jesus declared all foods clean.)
 
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Magenta said:
1-Corinthians15-45and1-Corinthians15-22s.png

1 Corinthians 15:20 and 1 Corinthians 15:45 and 1 Corinthians 15:22 Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. The first man Adam became a living being; the last Adam a
life-giving spirit. In Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive.
Thank you for the inspiration! I hope you and yours are well .:)
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So, if the last Adam does not mean the last human then the first Adam does not mean the first human. Adam was the first of his line, the first Adamite. It's like Jacob being changed to Israel and being the first Israelite.
 
ewq1938 said:
So, if the last Adam does not mean the last human then the first Adam does not mean the first human. Adam
was the first of his line, the first Adamite. It's like Jacob being changed to Israel and being the first Israelite.
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I would tend to think of either as prototypes. All are born into the first and need to be reborn into the last.

What you present looks more like a logical fallacy, and does not seem to take context into consideration.
 
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Hakawaka said:
The system and the so called science tells us that humans were hunter-gatherers before being farmers. Biblically I can see this is not so, Adam and Eve were farming from the get go.

Can someone show me any evidence of hunter-gatherers from the Bible? I know there are many primitive tribes in the earth today that do this, not denying that reality of course.

I just watched a video detailing the "worst time to be a human" and they gave some details on how life was for these humans, what they ate, how they lived in trees etc. And all im thinking is: "how on earth can these people know any of this? This is just a religious belief. There is 0 evidence of what they ate, 0 evidence of how long they lived. This is just absolute guess work" The Bible warns us about science falsely so called, and this is definitely it, its not repeatable of observable, its a religious belief pushed as science.

Anyone who disagrees is free to give me evidence to the contrary.
But mostly, I would like to know if the Bible mentions these hunter-gatherer tribes or peoples anywhere? Maybe somewhere in the books of Kings, Chronicles, who knows. I havent seen it, but I admit my knowledge of the OT is limited.
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Well Abel was taught how to raise live stock, probably from Adam his father. Not alot of B12 in plants.
 
SaysWhat said:
Well Abel was taught how to raise live stock, probably from Adam his father. Not alot of B12 in plants.
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What conclusion do you draw from this? And, do you assume man needed meat in his diet before God allowed for meat in man's diet?
 
Magenta said:
What conclusion do you draw from this? And, do you assume man needed meat in his diet before God allowed for meat in man's diet?
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Dairy isn't necessarily meat. There's a few nutrients that are essential and mainly come from animals like DHA. Though recently through science There's a synthetic version. ALA in plants can be converted to DHA by the body but it's minimum.
 
SaysWhat said:
Dairy isn't necessarily meat. There's a few nutrients that are essential and mainly come from animals like DHA. Though recently through science There's a synthetic version. ALA in plants can be converted to DHA by the body but it's minimum.
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Dairy is not meat at all... but I thought you were making a case for the pre-flood consumption of meat to meet B12 requirements?
 
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Hakawaka said:
The system and the so called science tells us that humans were hunter-gatherers before being farmers. Biblically I can see this is not so, Adam and Eve were farming from the get go.

Can someone show me any evidence of hunter-gatherers from the Bible? I know there are many primitive tribes in the earth today that do this, not denying that reality of course.

I just watched a video detailing the "worst time to be a human" and they gave some details on how life was for these humans, what they ate, how they lived in trees etc. And all im thinking is: "how on earth can these people know any of this? This is just a religious belief. There is 0 evidence of what they ate, 0 evidence of how long they lived. This is just absolute guess work" The Bible warns us about science falsely so called, and this is definitely it, its not repeatable of observable, its a religious belief pushed as science.

Anyone who disagrees is free to give me evidence to the contrary.
But mostly, I would like to know if the Bible mentions these hunter-gatherer tribes or peoples anywhere? Maybe somewhere in the books of Kings, Chronicles, who knows. I havent seen it, but I admit my knowledge of the OT is limited.
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that conclusion comes from finding evidence of cities later than finding evidence of people. so the logic goes that you can't build cities if you live by chasing prey around the countryside, and of course you're going to form a commercial economy and cities as soon as you can, that is, as soon as you have farming. that's a big assumption.

but if you're just building out of wood and such, you don't leave behind evidence thousands of years later. and at a time when the land isn't crowded, you can do a combination of subsistence farming and gathering in small clans with no need for a city - leaving practically no trace at all thousands of years later that archeology would find.

maybe the real question is why people started forming cities in the first place. God told them to go fill the earth. congregating all together in one place like Babel is the opposite of that: it's rebellion. which is the meaning of Nimrod's name - and he was a hunter, not a farmer. a hunter of men.
 
Hakawaka said:
I would agree on Acts 15:29 and Colossians 2:16, but I dont know why people keep saying Peter's vision has anything to do with food, just cause in the vision it says rise Peter kill and eat? If you look at the explanation of the vision its talking about calling no human unclean, the animals represent gentiles.
Click to expand...

Does God typically use lies and deceit and false doctrine in a parable? does He violate His own holy nature and command us to sin in visions?

the same topic comes up in the beggar Lazarus - whether it is a parable or not - because Christ talks about the dead being able to speak and sense and interact while either in Abraham's bosom or hades. this offends people who believe in cessation of existence between physical death and resurrection, so they argue essentially that Christ is presenting what they call doctrines of demons as though it is an actual true worldview only to illustrate some spiritual truth.
so to them i always pose the same question, why would Jesus be teaching lies in order to present a metaphor?

Peter is told to "kill and eat" - - is God commanding him to sin? Peter thinks so, and God rebukes him. is there no other way for God to give him a dream about the inclusion of gentiles in the gospel without presenting him with a false worldview as though it is true?

the answer is that there is no other way - He is omniscient therefore chose the absolute best way. and He is holy and good, therefore what He is commanding Peter to do in his vision is not evil: all food is clean, including meat, and physical death is not cessation of existence. it is not sinful to be an omnivore on this earth at this time, and we will be self-aware after our spirit is separated from our flesh. there are second witnesses in scripture of all this.
 
Hakawaka said:
Where do you fit in the Israelite's dietary laws? Do you think they are still in force or no?
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no.

Adam was given only plants.
Noah was given everything.
Moses was given a division between clean and unclean meat.
Christ declared all food clean according to the faith and resultant conscience of the eater.

we are back to the state of the diet of Noah, but in the resurrection there will be no more death.

"The Son of Man came eating and drinking"​
 
ewq1938 said:
So, if the last Adam does not mean the last human then the first Adam does not mean the first human. Adam was the first of his line, the first Adamite. It's like Jacob being changed to Israel and being the first Israelite.
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Christ isn't called the last human, but Adam is called the first man.

1Cor. 15:47 puts that succinctly
 
SaysWhat said:
Well Abel was taught how to raise live stock, probably from Adam his father. Not alot of B12 in plants.
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for wool, i would think, and for a yearly memorial sacrifice commemorating the blood shed to pardon Adam and his wife, when God made them garments.

Adam was given every green thing: it's not until Noah God tells us meat is okay to eat. proto-Pesach, if you will ;)
probably becomes a sticking point that one has to depend on one's brother to have something to offer before God...
(("First of many brethren" anyone? @cv5?))
 
SaysWhat said:
Not alot of B12 in plants.
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https://www.webmd.com/diet/what-are-plant-food-sources-vitamin-b12

up for lunch consideration are yeast, mushrooms, algae..

vegetarianism is completely respectable and even laudable IMO.
just not commanded/required of us.
so - - nothing to judge anyone over, one way or the other, in my view.

speaking personally i recognize the teeth i was born with are seemingly designed for an omnivorous diet, and i go with it without questioning it further.
 
Sheep's have been m
Magenta said:
Dairy is not meat at all... but I thought you were making a case for the pre-flood consumption of meat to meet B12 requirements?
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Sheep's milk is the highest in B12 and quite afew other nutrients than cow or goat milk. It's been consumed for thousands of years.

Adam's sons didn't just pick up on how to grow crops and raise live stock like sheep all by themselves.
 
posthuman said:
for wool, i would think, and for a yearly memorial sacrifice commemorating the blood shed to pardon Adam and his wife, when God made them garments.

Adam was given every green thing: it's not until Noah God tells us meat is okay to eat. proto-Pesach, if you will ;)
probably becomes a sticking point that one has to depend on one's brother to have something to offer before God...
(("First of many brethren" anyone? @cv5?))
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I think some cheese would be ok to eat.
 
posthuman said:
speaking personally i recognize the teeth i was born with are seemingly designed for an omnivorous diet, and i go with it without questioning it further.
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Actually we have both sets,

Incisors, molars, and premolars

These teeth are designed to cut through and grind plants, similar to the teeth of herbivores.

Canine teeth

These sharp teeth are located next to the incisors and are designed to rip through flesh, similar to the teeth of carnivores.
 
SaysWhat said:
Sheep's milk is the highest in B12 and quite afew other nutrients than cow or goat milk. It's been consumed for thousands of years.

Adam's sons didn't just pick up on how to grow crops and raise live stock like sheep all by themselves.
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I had no idea sheep milk was so nutritious!

:D
 
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