Believing is fallible, so we need to believe whatever harmonizes with whole of GW, beginning with God's all-lovingness, but you do not even affirm that truth! Instead, you say that 1TM 2:3-4 teaches God loves only those the Father gives to Jesus in direct contradiction to it saying that God loves and wants to save ALL people!!! You rant about God hating most of humanity, because God's love even for His enemies must not be in your heart. Sad, making being indwelled and sealed by the HS problematic. Beware the one who can appear as an angel of light.
Understanding God’s election
- Thread starter dougcho
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Correct. I do not believe that in the spiritual sense, God's lovingkindness is extended unto everyone but only to those He chose to be justified by Christ and He does not do so for everyone. If salvation were intended to be for all, then that which would make anyone a candidate for it, would be by their works - whether it is in believing and/or other. Yet we are told salvation cannot be by works but only by God's grace. Therefore, the only way for it to be by grace is if those to be saved were elected to such by God outside of their efforts; that is, without such a thing as the doctrine of election, there could not be grace, otherwise, it must be by works, and our works for salvation leads not to life but to death, and sets Christ as the Savior at naught. I think the problem is that you don't truly comprehend the role of Jesus Christ as the Savior, in salvation,
The plan of salvation decalvinized is the Truth. I just strip away all the layers of intellectualizing if one can call it that.
So far you have not demonstrated anything to repudiate what @cv5, @Kroogz and others, who know the truth and proclaim the simple Gospel of hearing and being able to believe, be persuaded, etc.,
not one time has it been proven false by your out of context proof texts.
Sorry, Adam running and hiding and all the other verses in no way rises to the level of declaring affirmatively that fallen man is wired to respond negatively, throughout all time and in every situation, to the Gospel unless God gives belief or regenerates first.
Not found in scripture anywhere.
Paul makes it clear in context (I notice how the clear passages are never dealt with) he chose to respond affirmatively.
Therefore, O King Agrippa, I wasn't disobedient to the heavenly vision, but declared first to those in Damascus, then in Jerusalem and throughout all the region of Judea, and also to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, performing deeds in keeping with their repentance.
The Book of Acts
So far you have not demonstrated anything to repudiate what @cv5, @Kroogz and others, who know the truth and proclaim the simple Gospel of hearing and being able to believe, be persuaded, etc.,
not one time has it been proven false by your out of context proof texts.
Sorry, Adam running and hiding and all the other verses in no way rises to the level of declaring affirmatively that fallen man is wired to respond negatively, throughout all time and in every situation, to the Gospel unless God gives belief or regenerates first.
Not found in scripture anywhere.
Paul makes it clear in context (I notice how the clear passages are never dealt with) he chose to respond affirmatively.
Therefore, O King Agrippa, I wasn't disobedient to the heavenly vision, but declared first to those in Damascus, then in Jerusalem and throughout all the region of Judea, and also to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, performing deeds in keeping with their repentance.
The Book of Acts
-
1
-
1
- Show all
Hey @CommodoreTeach you were tagged!! 
Gonna brag a little to diffuse my headache ... I have a Mac Book Air, was convinced to buy it and I am really liking it.
I really hate Apple products overall but I think this was the better purchase .. still miss those Commodores though.
They were a challenge alright!
Gonna brag a little to diffuse my headache ... I have a Mac Book Air, was convinced to buy it and I am really liking it.
I really hate Apple products overall but I think this was the better purchase .. still miss those Commodores though.
They were a challenge alright!
-
1
- Show all
Your belief is not a work. The only place belief is described as a work is in JN 6:29, "The work of God is to believe in the One He sent", but EPH 2:8-10 clarifies that we are saved by grace through faith, NOT of works,--which follow genuine faith, so salvific faith in Jesus is NOT a work but merely the non-meritorious acceptance of God's work. Get it? Are you free to get it/LGW or brainwashed by the angel of light to pervert God's loving Gospel per "God's lovingkindness is extended only to those He chose to be justified by Christ".
-
1
- Show all
Gret a grip in reality man. This is a war-time scenario.
The Canaanites had spies, intel, and likely copies of the very scrolls that the Hebrews had, not to mention their own historical records.
But more than that, the collective 400 year old legends they knew (all of the nations roundabout as well) were all coming true right before their very eyes.
They knew. They ALL knew exactly what was going down, every last one of them. It was all-out panic.
[Jos 2:10 KJV]
For we have heard how the LORD dried up the water of the Red sea for you, when ye came out of Egypt; and what ye did unto the two kings of the Amorites, that [were] on the other side Jordan, Sihon and Og, whom ye utterly destroyed.
========================================================
Yes, I know that you would love to conjure up some Calvinite hocus pocus and spooky gnostic super-determinism into all of this, but nope. Never going to happen.
The Canaanites had spies, intel, and likely copies of the very scrolls that the Hebrews had, not to mention their own historical records.
But more than that, the collective 400 year old legends they knew (all of the nations roundabout as well) were all coming true right before their very eyes.
They knew. They ALL knew exactly what was going down, every last one of them. It was all-out panic.
[Jos 2:10 KJV]
For we have heard how the LORD dried up the water of the Red sea for you, when ye came out of Egypt; and what ye did unto the two kings of the Amorites, that [were] on the other side Jordan, Sihon and Og, whom ye utterly destroyed.
========================================================
Yes, I know that you would love to conjure up some Calvinite hocus pocus and spooky gnostic super-determinism into all of this, but nope. Never going to happen.
-
1
- Show all
No, that means that true faith is a gift from God, by which, it not a work, and makes it consistent with Jhn 6:29, with it being
stated as God's work. Any faith that man produces through his own efforts, by that, it becomes a work because he must produce it. Were it otherwise, the verse would be incorrect as written. Did you not read the verse - that salvation is a gift? If a gift, then everything that goes into the gift are parts of the gift.
stated as God's work. Any faith that man produces through his own efforts, by that, it becomes a work because he must produce it. Were it otherwise, the verse would be incorrect as written. Did you not read the verse - that salvation is a gift? If a gift, then everything that goes into the gift are parts of the gift.
There you go again barring the door to a salvation that is free for the asking.
The truth is that this woman could care less about your Calvinite gnosticism. And she is better off for it.
And do you know what I think? I think that Calvinites intentionally set themselves up the modern day Pharisaical gatekeepers.
They bar the way to salvation, and deny entry to anybody that does not submit to their superior spiritual insight and authority and gnostic superpowers of discernment.
Luk 11:52
“Woe to you lawyers! For you have taken away the key of knowledge. You did not enter in yourselves, and those who were entering in you hindered.”
The truth is that this woman could care less about your Calvinite gnosticism. And she is better off for it.
And do you know what I think? I think that Calvinites intentionally set themselves up the modern day Pharisaical gatekeepers.
They bar the way to salvation, and deny entry to anybody that does not submit to their superior spiritual insight and authority and gnostic superpowers of discernment.
Luk 11:52
“Woe to you lawyers! For you have taken away the key of knowledge. You did not enter in yourselves, and those who were entering in you hindered.”
-
1
- Show all
One of the tricks in the Calvinites bag is to call everything a "work", and thereby deny a salvation that is free for the asking.
Will, violation, choice are INHERENT ASPECTS of simply being alive, and are attributes that God has intentionally endowed upon His created beings. Including the holy angels, Satan and his host, and the sons of Adam, even animals.
The Calvinites are gatekeepers and deny and steal even these very fundamental attributes that God gifts to all men.
[Deu 30:19 KJV]
I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, [that] I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:
[Eze 33:11 KJV]
Say unto them, [As] I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?
Will, violation, choice are INHERENT ASPECTS of simply being alive, and are attributes that God has intentionally endowed upon His created beings. Including the holy angels, Satan and his host, and the sons of Adam, even animals.
The Calvinites are gatekeepers and deny and steal even these very fundamental attributes that God gifts to all men.
[Deu 30:19 KJV]
I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, [that] I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:
[Eze 33:11 KJV]
Say unto them, [As] I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?
Did you ever answer @Cameron143's question?
I just did. An appalling failure to comprehend the obvious on his part BTW.
And not only that, the answer is literally right there perfectly described in the text.
==================================================================
@cv5 wrote:
Get a grip in reality man. This is a war-time scenario.
The Canaanites had spies, intel, and likely copies of the very scrolls that the Hebrews had, not to mention their own historical records.
But more than that, the collective 400 year old legends they knew (all of the nations roundabout as well) were all coming true right before their very eyes.
They knew. They ALL knew exactly what was going down, every last one of them. It was all-out panic.
[Jos 2:10 KJV]
For we have heard how the LORD dried up the water of the Red sea for you, when ye came out of Egypt; and what ye did unto the two kings of the Amorites, that [were] on the other side Jordan, Sihon and Og, whom ye utterly destroyed.
========================================================
Yes, I know that you would love to conjure up some Calvinite hocus pocus and spooky gnostic super-determinism into all of this, but nope. Never going to happen.
And not only that, the answer is literally right there perfectly described in the text.
==================================================================
@cv5 wrote:
Get a grip in reality man. This is a war-time scenario.
The Canaanites had spies, intel, and likely copies of the very scrolls that the Hebrews had, not to mention their own historical records.
But more than that, the collective 400 year old legends they knew (all of the nations roundabout as well) were all coming true right before their very eyes.
They knew. They ALL knew exactly what was going down, every last one of them. It was all-out panic.
[Jos 2:10 KJV]
For we have heard how the LORD dried up the water of the Red sea for you, when ye came out of Egypt; and what ye did unto the two kings of the Amorites, that [were] on the other side Jordan, Sihon and Og, whom ye utterly destroyed.
========================================================
Yes, I know that you would love to conjure up some Calvinite hocus pocus and spooky gnostic super-determinism into all of this, but nope. Never going to happen.
I just did. And he shows demonstrates his lack of by failing to comprehend the obvious.
And not only that, the answer is literally right there perfectly described in the text.
"Will, volition, choice are INHERENT ASPECTS of simply being alive, and are attributes that God has intentionally endowed upon His created beings. Including the holy angels, Satan and his host, and the sons of Adam, even animals."
==========================================================
Spell checker gone mad.
And not only that, the answer is literally right there perfectly described in the text.
"Will, volition, choice are INHERENT ASPECTS of simply being alive, and are attributes that God has intentionally endowed upon His created beings. Including the holy angels, Satan and his host, and the sons of Adam, even animals."
==========================================================
Spell checker gone mad.
They "knew" in their mind but didn't understand in their darkened hearts. Nor did they seek God. And they didn't seek him because they had no fear of the Lord before their eyes. Only God-fearers can understand spiritually because the God-fearing abhor evil and abstain from it, while pursuing righteousness and justice, etc.