Understanding God’s election

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Cameron143

Cameron143

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Magenta said:
Quite astounding, really, that she so scornfully speaks against what God has decreed. In so many ways!

Perhaps we should break out the kleenex in case she will cry some more about how unfair God is.

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Or how unfair we are actually wanting the questions we ask to be answered.
 
Magenta

Magenta

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Cameron143 said:
Or how unfair we are actually wanting the questions we ask to be answered.
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So many times the verses supporting one or another or a whole slew of our beliefs just get ignored.

Instead "they" lie and say we are twisting things and taking things out of context.

Meanwhile they post verses about believers and act as if it is talking about unbelievers.

They have to ignore a lot of what is said of the natural man.

And always the yammering on about people being forced.

Insisting we believe the blasphemous things they claim about God. It's disgusting.

They have zero comprehension.
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

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Magenta said:
So many times the verses supporting one or another or a whole slew of our beliefs just get ignored.

Instead "they" lie and say we are twisting things and taking things out of context.

Meanwhile they post verses about believers and pretend it is talking about unbelievers.

They have to ignore a lot of what is said of the natural man.

And always the yammering on about people being forced.

They have zero comprehension.
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That's the crux of the matter: what is true of fallen man? How one answers this question will determine what is necessary to save him.
 
Genez

Genez

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Magenta said:
Quite astounding, really, that she so scornfully speaks against what God has decreed. In so many ways!

Perhaps we should break out the kleenex in case she will cry some more about how unfair God is.

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God decreed that you would not understand what "decreed" means in light of knowing the true nature of God.
 
Magenta

Magenta

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Cameron143 said:
That's the crux of matter: what is true of fallen man? How one answers this question will determine what is necessary to save him.
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I have posted what is true of the fallen man/the natural man. They don't like it.

What is gets in response is a lot of hate. Jesus said this would happen.

Haters gonna hate.

 
cv5

cv5

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Magenta said:
Ah, yes, the lover of darkness who is himself darkness, the slave to sin taken captive to the will of the devil,
hostile to God, suppressing the truth in unrighteous, incapable of obeying... you say that person of their own
free will chooses to believe and obey before God changes their heart of stone. Wow. Quite the playbook you have.
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Wow. Thats quite a catharsis.

You definitely have the "out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks (Lk 6:45)" passage nailed.

With all of that venom and poison in your system you would think that you had been bitten by a viper.
 
K

Kroogz

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HeIsHere said:
And one has to "believe" first and then they are regenerated/born again.
Scripture does not support your view anywhere.
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Yep......Acts 16:31
So they said, “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you shall be saved, you and your household.”

And then we will get their word salads to try to make it say ," Saved THEN believe."

Like this verse. It really means," beaten THEN committing things deserving of stripes."

Luke 12:48
But he who did not know, yet committed things deserving of stripes, shall be beaten with few.........
 
Magenta

Magenta

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HeIsHere said:
Man's fallen nature is used as a scapegoat in Calvinism.
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The difference between the natural man and the spiritual man is a fairly large distinction made and exposited
in Scripture, the Scriptural Truth of which is germane to understanding what Scripture is in large part about.

I get that you don't like knowing about the differences but that does not mean others should not care.
 
Magenta

Magenta

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Kroogz said:
So they said, “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you shall be saved, you and your household.”
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Does this verse teach that as long as one person in the house believes,
all (the whole household) will be saved whether they believe or not?
 
HeIsHere

HeIsHere

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HeIsHere said:
Man's fallen nature is used as a scapegoat in Calvinism.
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A scapegoat in that sense that it is used so that salvation can only be given by effectual coercive grace for only some.
 
K

Kroogz

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cv5 said:
Wow. Thats quite a catharsis.

You definitely have the "out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks (Lk 6:45)" passage nailed.

With all of that venom and poison in your system you would think that you had been bitten by a viper.
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It's the focus. They focus on the creature. If they understood the Creator and all that He accomplished........No need to focus on all our darkness and faults. He died for each and every person's sins and made His salvation available to ALL.

Now that's light and true HOPE. And the true GOOD NEWS to all of mankind. Why stay in the frame of mind how scummy mankind is? God DID something about it!
 
Magenta

Magenta

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HeIsHere said:
A scapegoat in that sense that it is used so that salvation can only be given by effectual coercive grace for only some.
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Coercive. There's that misrepresentation again. It gets old fast. Probably in fact
deliberate from you. Unless you wanna plead ignorance. I could go with either.

Nobody gets forced but you love to portray it that way.

Those given to Jesus WILL come. Tell me they are forced.

I know you want to.

That's why you have to overlook the heart circumcision.

Your theology falls to pieces if you include it.

Hence you ignore it.
 
cv5

cv5

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Genez said:
How does it feel to be captive?
Bet you could not even tell...
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Feeling something more like captive in a dungeon and drowning in a vat of sulfuric acid is my guess.

Maybe the pain of this experience is what accounts for their endless raging and gnashing of teeth directed against the reprobate evil doomed before birth "non-chosenites"?
 
K

Kroogz

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Magenta said:
Does this verse teach that as long as one person in the house believes,
all (the whole household) will be saved whether they believe or not?
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Nope. Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved and that goes for ANYONE.
 
cv5

cv5

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Kroogz said:
It's the focus. They focus on the creature. If they understood the Creator and all that He accomplished........No need to focus on all our darkness and faults. He died for each and every person's sins and made His salvation available to ALL.

Now that's light and true HOPE. And the true GOOD NEWS to all of mankind. Why stay in the frame of mind how scummy mankind is? God DID something about it!
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Totally agree man. Jesus Name is salvation. He is pure good. The objective of everything He does is salvation.
 
Magenta

Magenta

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Kroogz said:
Nope. Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved and that goes for ANYONE.
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Oh, so you leave off now the "you and your household"?

It does not specify that they are the ones believing. Why do you read that in?

Ah, I get it, you think the person hostile in their mind to God will just up and choose to love Him. Got it.

The slave to sin captive to the will of the devil suppressing the truth in unrighteousness lover of darkness.

The one with a heart of stone. Yes, I understand.
 
Cameron143

Cameron143

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HeIsHere said:
Man's fallen nature is used as a scapegoat in Calvinism.
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No. It's the explanation for why God effects salvation as He does. Not admitting what is actually true of fallen man is what causes the confusion.
 
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