Understanding God’s election

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Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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The word is preached. The Spirit draws. Men have a choice. No such thing as irresistible grace, ask King Agrippa.
Still no answer from you about who opened your eyes and ears, circumcised your heart, and
raised you to new life in Christ. Why do you repeatedly avoid answering these questions?


Jesus said those given to Him would come. Not maybe...
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
20,283
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Yep, Israel’s Messiah, but the cross was hidden. Did the disciples know about the cross? Jesus’ closest friends? Nope.
The manner of the sacrifice isn't the substance of a substitutionary atonement. The sacrifice is.
 

Rufus

Well-known member
Feb 17, 2024
3,317
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The word is preached. The Spirit draws. Men have a choice. No such thing as irresistible grace, ask King Agrippa.
Of course not. Just the sovereign power of "freewill" in dead men, which you cannot resist talking about, exalting and making God Almighty himself subservient to. See: You do believe in irresistible forces, after all. :coffee:
 

Kroogz

Well-known member
Dec 5, 2023
961
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Really? Well I think that such a proposal is......insane. And I don't think that you or any of your Calvinite crew actually believe it. Rather, it is dogma that you learned to rehearse exactly the same way as the "bad" Pharisees........and for exactly the same reasons.
It's an intellectual thing. In Calvinism, the smartest man in the room wins. It's all about who can debate the best and sound the most intellectual. The IMAGE is very important.

I am an idiot, so I don't have anything to lose. But, I have studied His word, so even these "smart" people sound foolish to this idiot.
 

Rufus

Well-known member
Feb 17, 2024
3,317
471
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Still no answer from you about who opened your eyes and ears, circumcised your heart, and
raised you to new life in Christ. Why do you repeatedly avoid answering these questions?


Jesus said those given to Him would come. Not maybe...
Don't you know, sis, that Jesus got that wrong, as well. :rolleyes:
 

Rufus

Well-known member
Feb 17, 2024
3,317
471
83
It's an intellectual thing. In Calvinism, the smartest man in the room wins. It's all about who can debate the best and sound the most intellectual. The IMAGE is very important.

I am an idiot, so I don't have anything to lose. But, I have studied His word, so even these "smart" people sound foolish to this idiot.
Well look what the wind blew in: an exceedingly rare honest statement by a freewiller. This is the good news. (y)

The bad, however, is how can an idiot know how to study the bible and handle the Word of God accurately? Maybe you don't like to rub shoulders with "smart" people because they make you look worse than an idiot?
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,246
3,717
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Still no answer from you about who opened your eyes and ears, circumcised your heart, and
raised you to new life in Christ. Why do you repeatedly avoid answering these questions?


Jesus said those given to Him would come. Not maybe...
I answered plainly. Jesus saves the believer.

Acts 26:
16 But rise, and stand upon thy feet: for I have appeared unto thee for this purpose, to make thee a minister and a witness both of these things which thou hast seen, and of those things in the which I will appear unto thee;
17 Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I send thee,
18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.
 

Kroogz

Well-known member
Dec 5, 2023
961
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So you are saying that all of those little kids running around your Church don't have actual free will?

Really? Well I think that such a proposal is......insane. And I don't think that you or any of your Calvinite crew actually believe it. Rather, it is dogma that you learned to rehearse exactly the same way as the "bad" Pharisees........and for exactly the same reasons.

And I can't wait until you try and explain this "you are a mindless wind up toy" nonsense to your kids. But I doubt that you'll do that either.

But if you do......stock up on meds and straitjackets first.
This is one quote from calvinistrant:
"A few years ago I was wondering why my self-esteem was so crap and then suddenly realised that the people who taught me to hate myself were my parents, through the medium of calvinism :)" (pktechboi)
 

Rufus

Well-known member
Feb 17, 2024
3,317
471
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Jesus saves those who believe. Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved.
You didn't answer my question. So let me rephrase it: How can't your faith be your ultimate and effectual savior, since Christ's grace is ineffectual and He can only only observe your saving faith and react to it since his will is subservient to yours? Explain, please.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
61,541
30,557
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I answered plainly. Jesus saves the believer.
Did you open your own eyes so you could see?

Did you unstop your ears so you could hear?

Did you circumcise your own heart?

Did you raise yourself to new life in Christ through your "free will" choice?

Or did Christ make you alive while you were still dead in your sins?
 

Kroogz

Well-known member
Dec 5, 2023
961
398
63
So you are saying that all of those little kids running around your Church don't have actual free will?

Really? Well I think that such a proposal is......insane. And I don't think that you or any of your Calvinite crew actually believe it. Rather, it is dogma that you learned to rehearse exactly the same way as the "bad" Pharisees........and for exactly the same reasons.

And I can't wait until you try and explain this "you are a mindless wind up toy" nonsense to your kids. But I doubt that you'll do that either.

But if you do......stock up on meds and straitjackets first.
Another quote. Lets put this DEAD theology into ACTION.....

"My parents used to say 'even the cutest baby is a dirty rotten sinner.' It was somewhat of a joke in our family, but also definitely what we all believed. I’m turning 30 this year and I still have trouble turning down the volume on this narrative about myself. It has led to issues in my friendships, with my partner, and now, with my parents... I have deconstructed to the [point] of agnosticism... This has crippled my emotional growth as an adult in ways..." (foreverlanding)
 

Kroogz

Well-known member
Dec 5, 2023
961
398
63
So you are saying that all of those little kids running around your Church don't have actual free will?

Really? Well I think that such a proposal is......insane. And I don't think that you or any of your Calvinite crew actually believe it. Rather, it is dogma that you learned to rehearse exactly the same way as the "bad" Pharisees........and for exactly the same reasons.

And I can't wait until you try and explain this "you are a mindless wind up toy" nonsense to your kids. But I doubt that you'll do that either.

But if you do......stock up on meds and straitjackets first.
Now Brother....I defy you to find a person that was ruined by......The Lord Jesus Christ had you personally in mind when He Died for the sins of whole world. And He simply asks you to trust in Him for your salvation. All can come to Him Because He died for ALL.

Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved..........

THIS is not a life wrecking message. Calvinism IS.
 
Dec 7, 2024
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Luke 24 (NET)
44 Then he said to them, “These are my words that I spoke to you while I was still with you, that everything written about me in the law of Moses and the prophets and the psalms must be fulfilled.” 45 Then he opened their minds so they could understand the scriptures, 46 and said to them, “Thus it stands written that the Christ would suffer and would rise from the dead on the third day, 47 and repentance for the forgiveness of sins would be proclaimed in his name to all nations,beginning from Jerusalem. 48 You are witnesses of these things. 49 And look, I am sending you what my Father promised. But stay in the city until you have been clothed with power from on high.”
 

cv5

Well-known member
Nov 20, 2018
24,048
8,696
113
It's an intellectual thing. In Calvinism, the smartest man in the room wins. It's all about who can debate the best and sound the most intellectual. The IMAGE is very important.

I am an idiot, so I don't have anything to lose. But, I have studied His word, so even these "smart" people sound foolish to this idiot.
Rule of thumb is:
Always send the village idiot to slay the dragon.

Been there done that.