Can We Really Exercise Free Will?

[LifelongLearner]

Many have probably realised i don't think we can exercise free will, even think it's impossible for us to. Won't explain why i think it's an impossiblility for us yet, think it's useful for some to express why they think it exists first.

I have no doubt we have and can make choices throughout life, however, think our options are far more restricted than most realise. What do you think?

 

[Pemican]

If free will doesn't exist then life is without meaning, and you might as well eat, drink, and be merry for tomorrow we die. Oh, wait, that would mean making a choice!

 

[Magenta]

If free will doesn't exist then life is without meaning, and you might as well eat, drink, and be merry for tomorrow we die. Oh, wait, that would mean making a choice!

You make the error that many do by conflating having a choice with having free will. Nor does having a human will mean that it is free, because it is constrained by far too many factors to be considered truly free, Especially as a lover of darkness who suppresses the truth in unrighteousness because he is taken captive to the will of the devil. The will of the natural man is inherently in opposition to God and hostile to Him.

 

[Pemican]

Also, it sounds like you are straddling the fence. Sometimes you make free choices and sometimes you don't. How can you have it both ways? Is this a way of saying you are not responsible, and therefore God has no right to judge? Did the fallen angels have a free choice to rebel? If not then God's condemnation of them is unjust and even cruel. Lots of problems with your point of view.

 

[GWH]

Many have probably realised i don't think we can exercise free will, even think it's impossible for us to. Won't explain why i think it's an impossiblility for us yet, think it's useful for some to express why they think it exists first.

I have no doubt we have and can make choices throughout life, however, think our options are far more restricted than most realise. What do you think?

I think you just exercised free will by choosing to write this post.

 

[LifelongLearner]

If free will doesn't exist then life is without meaning, and you might as well eat, drink, and be merry for tomorrow we die. Oh, wait, that would mean making a choice!

Such misunderstanding is common Pemican, didn't want to discuss my view yet but think it's necessary as others are likely to misunderstand too.

Think about it, how can we say we have free will, when we must accommodate the needs of others and their choices too? It's actually impossible but what we do have is agency, we can make some choices and influence other decisions and events.

Personally think the only being who really has free will is the LORD and i say Amen to that.

 

[LifelongLearner]

I think you just exercised free will by choosing to write this post.

That was agency/choice Friend, free will no, some choice for sure, if you know what i mean. Your comment made me grin.

 

[LifelongLearner]

You make the error that many do by conflating having a choice with having free will. Nor does having a human will mean that it is free, because it is constrained by far too many factors to be considered truly free, Especially as a lover of darkness who suppresses the truth in unrighteousness because he is taken captive to the will of the devil. The will of the natural man is inherently in opposition to God and hostile to Him.

Sorry precious friend, meant to reply to your comment a little while ago. Your first two sentences are a perfect example of how i see it , talk about in a nutshell, truly brilliant.

 

[GWH]

That was agency/choice Friend, free will no, some choice for sure, if you know what i mean. Your comment made me grin.

Glad you got my humor, but sad you think those three terms are not synonymous. Why do you think the third is antonymous?

 

[Magenta]

Sorry precious friend, meant to reply to your comment a little while ago. Your first two sentences are a perfect example of how i see it , talk about in a nutshell, truly brilliant.

No worries at all lovely lady, as I am at work for the first time today in almost 2 weeks and there is a little bit here for me to do so I'm busy at it LOL [[[HUGS]]]

 

[Magenta]

Such misunderstanding is common Pemican, didn't want to discuss my view yet but think it's necessary as others are likely to misunderstand too.

Think about it, how can we say we have free will, when we must accommodate the needs of others and their choices too? It's actually impossible but what we do have is agency, we can make some choices and influence other decisions and events.

Personally think the only being who really has free will is the LORD and i say Amen to that.

Jesus was challenged by and struggled to surrender His human will to the will of the Father so greatly that He sweat blood in the Garden of Gethsemane before His crucifixion... And yet here we have so many thinking that the natural man is as great as Jesus to be able to lay down their human will, some say with no help from God at all. Their error is in ascribing to the natural man qualities and abilities only the spiritually alive man possesses.

 

[LifelongLearner]

Glad you got my humor, but sad you think those three terms are not synonymous. Why do you think the third is antonymous?

You're always good to chat with GWH, you're rational and open minded too. However, think about the term free will itself, i really don't see how people can think that's what we have, when there are so often constraints on what we can do, because of the effects on others.

Personally think saying we're scratch each other's "backists" is more accurate, every dog has it's day, fair crack of the whip and so on. We all have agency which would work great, if we play fair.

Hope that makes some sense.

 

[LifelongLearner]

No worries at all lovely lady, as I am at work for the first time today in almost 2 weeks and there is a little bit here for me to do so I'm busy at it LOL [[[HUGS]]]

You're such a lovely lady too precious friend, glad you're feeling well enough for work today, you sound like you're enjoying yourself too.

 

[GWH]

You're always good to chat with GWH, you're rational and open minded too. However, think about the term free will itself, i really don't see how people can think that's what we have, when there are so often constraints on what we can do, because of the effects on others.

Personally think saying we're scratch each other's "backists" is more accurate, every dog has it's day, fair crack of the whip and so on. We all have agency which would work great, if we play fair.

Hope that makes some sense.

Yes, but it does not quite address the key issue, which is whether volition is sufficiently free to choose/seek salvation. Of course it does not mean unconstrained. Even God’s omnipotence means that He can do everything except “disown Himself” or not be God (2TM 2:13). It does NOT mean that God can perform logical absurdities, such as creating a rock too large for Him to move.

Omnipotence or sovereignty also means that human MFW has limits with regard to how it can contradict God’s will. God provides morally competent humans the ability to resist His intentional will (for everyone to cooperate and be saved per 1TM 2:3-4 & 2PT 3:9) within limits, such as the time limit that will end with death, resurrection (the last miracle) and judgment (per HB 9:27)–called His permissive will.

Thumb up?

 

[homwardbound]

Many have probably realised i don't think we can exercise free will, even think it's impossible for us to. Won't explain why i think it's an impossiblility for us yet, think it's useful for some to express why they think it exists first.

I have no doubt we have and can make choices throughout life, however, think our options are far more restricted than most realise. What do you think?

Matthew 19:26
But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.

See, believe and see truth over error once Father leads in risen Son for anyone that decides to be willing to see, will see, not necessarily at first. There might be a lot of trouble to go through first, I have and might go through more as have still go, gone through, even after I have physically died more than seven times, I see to remain willing sincerely as Jesus who went willingly first. Now risen where new life is given by Father in risen Son for us all to believe and not quit, no matter what happens here on earth, to me at least
I tell you the truth, seeing the last chapter of Job, seeing Phil 1-3, seeing Ephesians. reading Colossians, Corinthians the whole not scripting out verses, reading the whole, trusting Daddy, PaPa, the Father of risen Son to reveal the truth of love to us all
God loves us all y'all that is fact over everything else, start there in thanksgiving and praise, you will see through if you will continue willingly
Col 1:21-23 has deep roots in truth to me anyways

 

[LifelongLearner]

Yes, but it does not quite address the key issue, which is whether volition is sufficiently free to choose/seek salvation. Of course it does not mean unconstrained. Even God’s omnipotence means that He can do everything except “disown Himself” or not be God (2TM 2:13). It does NOT mean that God can perform logical absurdities, such as creating a rock too large for Him to move.

Omnipotence or sovereignty also means that human MFW has limits with regard to how it can contradict God’s will. God provides morally competent humans the ability to resist His intentional will (for everyone to cooperate and be saved per 1TM 2:3-4 & 2PT 3:9) within limits, such as the time limit that will end with death, resurrection (the last miracle) and judgment (per HB 9:27)–called His permissive will.

Thumb up?

LOVED the comment, you get a hug too. More detailed reply soon friend, playing chess online as well.

 

[Magenta]

Matthew 19:26
But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.

Interesting thought here because Jesus made that response to his disciples when they asked, who then can be saved?

 

[LifelongLearner]

Matthew 19:26
But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.

See, believe and see truth over error once Father leads in risen Son for anyone that decides to be willing to see, will see, not necessarily at first. There might be a lot of trouble to go through first, I have and might go through more as have still go, gone through, even after I have physically died more than seven times, I see to remain willing sincerely as Jesus who went willingly first. Now risen where new life is given by Father in risen Son for us all to believe and not quit, no matter what happens here on earth, to me at least
I tell you the truth, seeing the last chapter of Job, seeing Phil 1-3, seeing Ephesians. reading Colossians, Corinthians the whole not scripting out verses, reading the whole, trusting Daddy, PaPa, the Father of risen Son to reveal the truth of love to us all
hing else, start there in thanksgiving and praise, you will see through if you will continue willingly
God loves us all y'all that is fact over everything else, start there in thanksgiving and praise, you will see through if you will continue willingly
Col 1:21-23 has deep roots in truth to me anyways

That is such a lovely and true comment friend, Col 1:21-23 now has deep roots in me too. I'm still a pretty new believer, don't hesitate to post more scripture recommendations for me.

 

[GWH]

LOVED the comment, you get a hug too. More detailed reply soon friend, playing chess online as well.

Luv hugs! (BTW, I also am a LLL :^)

 

[LifelongLearner]

Luv hugs! (BTW, I also am a LLL :^)

Not that many of us around friend, knew you were another one too. Neither of us are the type to take umbrage often either, we're lifelong lovers of learning too.